https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=brKjzKSS9ck


Per some reviews

“ Tips for buyers on competition

Yamaha DGX - 670
Pros - 4 style variations/ better style programs/ reads PSR style files with 4 variations ( there are thousands if free styles)
Can write user styles/ more realistic and musical styles that can be used/ can play midi files ( Roland can not)
40 plus Super Articulation sounds ( best nylon/ acoustic guitars / saxes, etc that Roland or Casio can’t touch)
Will read midi files ( including Roland ‘s GS and Yamaha’s XG files). Remember most pro GM files are written in GS format)
Has 16 track sequencer


Cons- 47 pounds/heavy/ bulky/ GHS keys ( not as good as Roland) . Not gig worthy ( screaming “amateur keyboard)/ no vocal harmony
/ no modulation wheel/ only headphone out/ no separate LR outs


Korg XE- 20
Light weight( 25 Ibs)/ terrible key touch and response/ PA80 arranger styles/ will read SMF/ Wav/ Mp3 files but poorly designed for live playback. No joystick/ pitch bend/ mod wheel/ PA 80 arranger styles means 2 fills and jumpy fills / no style writing/ has basic sequencer


Roland FP- E50
Pros - great key feel/ individual weights ( key response not as fast as Yamaha’s GHS for fast notes runs due to escapement mechanics for certain patches but great for piano tones
- better piano tones ( than Yamaha or Casio)
- pro looking keyboard on stage ( well designed/ no speakers on top or front)
-individual LR outs
- Vocal harmony
- 37 pounds ( lightest pro feel/looking arranger with build in speakers)
- blue tooth midi and audio
- chord sequencer

Cons- Can’t read or write midi files ( only Wav files) . That means you can’t play pre sequenced general midi files with VH data)
- other sounds ( non super natural tones)are good enough but not great ( especially saxes/ guitars still has Juno Di / Ds quality) . Not super articulation quality
- arranger feature is afterthought and style are poorly written ( limitations start to appear if you are One Man Band / solo performer)
- 2 style variations means 1990 era backing with improved sounds ( you will not be able to load even BK3 styles which has 4 variations)


Overall verdict- There is no competition in the market.great if you need one keyboard that has 88 keys and pro piano sounds and other acceptable sounds with manageable weight that has pitch/ mod wheels . Looks great as well.
For OMB players;You just have to load wav files and play and sing on top while using real time harmony by pressing chords in real time



Unfortunate for Casio. Which is still not considered as “pro” looking/ considered KB on stage ( regardless how they improved with the sounds, etc, the stigma is still there). It may take a decade and multiple endorsements.“

If I didn’t have a Korg Havian , I’d probably get one! It’s a great home instrument. I love having 88 weighted keys with arranger features. The chord looper is great for practice purposes too.

I'm excited because it's the first new keyboard with Roland's arranger operating system since the E-A7 was released in 2015. (The E-X50 and other low-end models don't count, since they seem to borrow from Yamaha's OS and feature set.) It's evident that the FP-E50 picks up where the FP50/FP80 left off. Go Roland!!

If you’re using .Wav files, why not put the backing vocals into those? Saves tying your hand up inputting a chord for the VH that probably needs to be doing something else…

And, if you are getting your .Wav backing from one of the audio backing/karaoke sites, those have proper harmonies already recorded, not just block harmonies derived from your singing. Hate to say it, but most great harmony backing vocals don’t track around like the Andrews Sisters! There’s more ‘call and response’ or contrary motion than block stuff.

I've listened to about a dozen demos of this instrument and my wallet is literally vibrating in my pocket . At this price, I think it's an incredible instrument and an incredible bargin. What I want is a stage piano, but for home use (practice and pleasure). I'm not that interested in the pro's and con's of it's 'arranger' features but will use the simple rhythm (backing) tracks when practicing. The main attraction is the realism of that (sampled) acoustic grand. I hope it doesn't suck me into that 'barbie doll' thing starting with buying a pair of high quality dedicated speakers, furniture-type stand, etc. That would just defeat the whole 'bargain' thing . OTOH..... .

The only thing I've got that's similar is my NUMA C2X which sadly, just didn't hit the spot and will probably be my grandson's next birthday gift. It has a decent piano but the rest of board leaves me wanting something a little better. Hope I don't get disappointed again. Oh well, "nothing ventured, nothing gained". Funny thing is, I already have all the features of this board (vocoder, harmonizer, arranger, etc.); they're just in separate units. This way I can bring it up to my office (where I spend most of my day) and noodle when I get bored. Damn, I'm sorry Jamman posted this .

chas

I have always been impressed with Mirriam Music’s reviews… he covers the gamut of everything from real pianos to every kind of stage piano and software too. And always has something relevant to say about each and demos them superbly (very pianistically).

And when he speaks highly of the action of the FP-E50 (after you’ve broken it in a bit!) that’s pretty significant at this price point if you are an actual pianist..! It’s so hard to play convincing piano on a plastic action. Most of us end up just playing it too hard, or having inconsistent dynamics.

I must confess, I've been looking for an 88 for my studio, this might fit the bill (and my bank balance!) 🎹💵😥

Chas
Just my $.02 If your looking for a home instrument with TOTL piano and don't mind going up in price look at the Roland FP90X. YOu already have the BK7M so MIDI that up and you have a pro level setup. That's what I have and love it, but never want to move it although with the mic effects and great onboard speakers I could do a restaurant job with the keyboard alone.

BTW better check and see if that's really your wallet vibrating, maybe it's those new vitamins your taking kicking in LOL

Too late, Bill. I already ordered it from Kraft Music. Plus, the FP90X is over twice the price and frankly, overkill for my pianistic skills. I listened to a lot of demos of the FP-E50 and I really like the sound of that sampled acoustic grand throughout it's sonic range, especially the lower end. The ZEN voices are just okay but then I won't be using them much anyway. I just wanted a standalone with a better than average piano that I could use away from my studio. At the moment, my clonewheel, BK7m, and VP770 are all grouped together in my 'rehearsal' room with two 15" EV's. In my 'studio' I have a Legend Exp midied to a Nord C1 (as a controller), a Crumar SEVEN, Korg Triton, Roland G7, Studiologic NUMA C2X, Live 'something or other' harmomizer, Computer and controller KB (for Sample play), and a ton of recording equipment. All three of my Arrangers are currently (and probably permanently) 'retired' and in storage. I will either replace the NUMA with the FP-E50 or (more likely) put the FP-E50 in my office (with a 2ch audio interface and laptop). That way (with my bad knees) I won't have to go down the dreaded stairs to my studio every time I feel the urge to 'noodle' or just learn a new song. So, as you can see, it's the all-in-one feature set, along with that nice piano, that sold me on this board (that, and the price ).

Long story short, the FP-90X is for a REAL pianist (which I am not). BTW, how are things down that way? I used to own a vacation property on HH until @2012. I still have some friends with vacation homes there.

chas

Chas
Looks like you've done your homework and know what fits you best. Some collection you have so enjoy your new board and happy playing. I get the urge now and then for something new but hate to devote the time to learning it and prefer to spend the time on playing and learning new music, or sometimes on technology and just play piano. Keep us updated on your new board

Bill, you hit the nail on the head about suffering through learning a new board. That's the appeal of THIS board; it looks like it was designed to be operated by (take your pick) a two-year-old or an idiot....well, let's just say it looks like a very simple, well-designed, easy to learn, layout. That's very good for old brains . It's due for delivery on Friday so I'll let you know my first impressions after the week-end. I'm real curious to see what it sounds like with the on-board speakers (I already know they're not on par, or even close, to the FP-90's but may be good enough to practice with without cringing ).

chas

The thing that worries me about downward and rearward facing speakers is they do a great job of not localizing the piano sound, helping it to be diffuse like a real piano.

But… what about all the backing sounds? Those tend to sound better with a directly heard speaker. Be nice if the piano only could be routed to the downward facing speakers, and then the backing routed to the main 1/4” outputs to go to some decent monitors. But I guess there’s always a compromise with a $1000 piece of gear.

Well it comes tomorrow and I'm mildly excited. In any case, I'm not going to START this journey looking for negatives. I'll reserve judgement until AFTER I've heard it in person. I tend to trust MY OWN judgement about how an instrument sounds. If I don't like it I'll return it get something else.....OR, maybe I'll just get a second one and play piano on one through the on-board speakers and the backing on the other through the L-R outs. I'll call it the 'IDIOTS WORKAROUND'. But anyhow, thanks for sending out those good vibes, Diki. The joy of getting a new toy is highly overated, right.

chas

Just want to make sure you are aware that you can use a stereo Y chord in the headphone jack of the DGX-670 and change the headphone jack to be stereo outputs and once you do this and push save, it will stay in this mode everytime you turn on the keyboard

George

I am a little confused...... I have the DGX-670 and use the Stereo Y Chord to connect to my monitors....
What do you mean by "Push Save"..

Ron

I believe this Roland has a chord sequencer/ looper, which I absolutely love. In fact this morning I set a loop for the standard rhythm changes, and worked on some 2 handed voicing that Chas turned me on too. There is no way my KB would recognize those chord voicing with the extensions and alternations using standard auto accompaniment . Also it’s nice to do rhythmic anticipations and delays without being a slave to the downbeat.
Take advantage of this feature Chas, I’m sure you’ll like it too!

I plan to, Paul, along with all the other nice features this very affordable, good-sounding board has to offer. Glad you could use that little 'tutorial'. Mastering that goes a long way towards making one sound 'professional'.

BTW, I've been listening to a lot of Santana lately. He's always been in the top 5 of my favorites, but it's the percussion that keeps bringing me back for another listen. It is just flat-out exquisite. The timing and precision is just beyond awesome. His younger percussionist that died (can't recall his name...failing memory) just astounded me with his artistry. It saddens me that this level of talent and artistry is only known by fans of the band when, in fact, these guys should be in some kind of music Hall of Fame. Oh well, no one said life was fair.

chas

Exhibit 1:
(go to about 5:30)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvvrGWrh...el=EpicConcerts

Oh, and the young guy that sadly died, Raul Rekow.

chas

BTW, got my FP-E50. Set it up briefly in the living room beside by Yamaha acoustic piano. Big mistake. NEVER play ANY digital piano next to a decent acoustic piano; it's going to make you have some regrets . Aside from that, it sounds great considering the two small 11w speakers (in a room size space). I have a spare set of 6" studio monitors which I'll probably add once it's in it's permanent space (my office?).

I haven't had time to play with it yet (NCAA basketball) but what I've heard so far sounds pretty good (probably much better with the external monitors). My only (mild) complaint is the 'stiffness' of the keys. Having played organ (and later synths) most of my musical life, I'm having to adjust to the stiffer action in this keybed. Luckily, I've been playing the Crumar SEVEN a lot, which is even stiffer, so getting acclimated to to the PH4 keybed shouldn't be too difficult. The arthiritis in my fingers doesn't help though. Hope it doesn't get much worse. Anyhow, I'll spend the next week doing a deep dive and see if my own feedback corresponds to the professional reviewers.

chas

Mirriam’s review mentioned that the action loosens up somewhat after it’s played in.

You might try just doing rapid repeated notes on each key in turn for a few minutes each. Boring, I know, but you’ll get a more even break-in that way.

I really like this guy's playing and demo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFUhF2OpQzw&ab_channel=MeXKeys

chas

Ron,
I meant to say that on the dgx670 you can set a mode in "utility" where the internal speakers can be left on or off when you insert your stereo jack in the back to go to external sound systems. In the DGX660 if you did this, you would have to go to an edit screen and turn the feature on or off but on the DGX670, once you set this it will remain when you power off and turn on again. This was a big improvement. In my store if I left the jack in and someone turned the keyboard off and then on again, it would always be in headphone mode and you would here nothing if you didn't have the external amp turned on. Now, it's no longer a problem. I hope this makes sense!

@George Kaye did you mean to post your response on another thread?

Getting back on-topic... Today I received a marketing message from Roland in my personal email advertising additional styles for the FP-E50. When I clicked the embedded link, it took me to a Roland Cloud page. There, I learned that the FP-E50 seems to have style compatibility with legacy Roland arrangers! This supports my earlier conjecture that it has "real" Roland Operating System DNA. I also wasn't surprised to learn that the downloadable styles for the E-X50 and E-X30 are NOT compatible with other Roland arrangers (probably because they borrow from an entry-level Yamaha OS.)

So in the FP-E50 we have the first new "real" Roland arranger product since 2015. What will Roland Japan do for an encore?

Am I wrong, or did I see that styles in the FP-E50 only have two variations? And one Intro, one ending…

Roland’s styles have had 3-4 Intro/Endings and 4 Variations for well over 20 years. So I think full style compatibility is not exactly what’s happening. I wonder, will you be able to select which two of the four Variations play, or will it be always Var1 and Var4 or some other preset combination? And likewise with the Intro/Ending…

I think Roland have missed an opportunity to compete with the Yamaha, which is full Yamaha style compatible (all Intro/Endings and all 4 Variations). It certainly feels like a very arbitrary restriction that limits how well legacy styles will work…

I think any reading of the design and features of this instrument would make it clear that this was never intended as a full blown arranger, but instead a mid-priced digital piano with 88 weighted keys, an excellent sampled piano, and a few arranger-type features. To rate it as an 'arranger' is ludicrous (unless you're deliberately trying to criticize it - nothing new there). The minimal arranger features appear to be there more as an aid to practicing than a gig-worthy feature. I've had mine for about two weeks now and am very happy with it for fulfilling the purpose I bought it for. The specs and features were clearly listed and demoed on the net and if one wanted a full blown arranger keyboard, there were plenty of other options on the market. From what I can gather, most of the (many) new purchasers are not 'arranger' players but guys looking for a decent, inexpensive digital piano that COULD be used as a 'stage' piano.

Sorry, but I just get so sick and tired of the same people 'bad-mouthing' every product that they don't personally own (or intend to own). In most cases they've never even seen the product, much less played it. It must be sad to live a life of 'gloom and doom' where one's only joy seems to be finding something to criticize. Jeez, get a puppy.

I don't think Roland 'missed any opportunities' as the board seems to be very popular and well-received by it's INTENDED MARKET.

chas

Well said chas !!

Diki you are correct that the FP-E50 only has two variations per style. The FP-50/FP-80 also had only two variations per style, as did all Roland arrangers before the G-70. This fact by itself doesn't mean that FP-E50 styles won't play in older Roland arrangers, perhaps subject to revoicing.

My point was that style compatibililty (and incompatibility with the E-X50) supports my theory that the FP-E50 is built on the legacy OS of the FP-50 (which itself was intimately related to the BK-series.) Thus the FP-E50 is a descendant of the true Roland arranger line, whereas the E-X50 and E-X30 are impostors with Yamaha-influenced OS, style format, and chord recognition.

If you accept my claim that there is an "heir," the first in almost eight years, I see this as hope that the bloodline will continue!

So why make it compatible with Roland styles if it can’t play them correctly. It seems apparent that there are some here determined to gush about the product no matter how crippled it is (apparently, they’ve been waiting their whole lives for a crippled arranger, being unhappy with every proper arranger they had).

Sorry kids, but if you’re looking for an uncritical take on the FP, perhaps there’s somewhere a with a bunch of people that don’t really like arrangers. Bon voyage. You think you’re the only one sick of bitching, Chas? I’m not here to cheer on your every purchasing decision. The point was made, apparently the FP is compatible with Roland styles. So pointing out there’s some hurdles to overcome.

Being the person here with an actual FP, Chas, why don’t you do something useful for a change, try and load in a Roland style (you’ve no doubt got a bunch) and let the members know what it does to those 4 variation styles. Some of them might actually be arranger players and might be interested.

Diki, your mouth runneth over but you never LISTEN. First, I don't recall ever asking you to "cheer on" my purchasing decisions. In fact, if that's what I wanted, you'd be the LAST person I'd go to. Seems to me that you have appointed yourself Lord High Commisioner of the forum and that all musical decisions, including hardware purchases, need to meet your approval. It doesn't seem to matter what a member wants or needs, it needs to meet YOUR requirements, not THEIRS. And still you don't see why some folks might find that just a little annoying. You say to me "Chas, why don’t you do something useful for a change". What freaking arrogance. Do you think you're talking to a child? or maybe just some inferior being. I'm pretty sure most members, if interested, would politely ask how this feature worked and if I would test it for them when I had time (which I would be happy to do).

Diki, I don't think you're necessarily a bad guy; in fact, politically, we probably share the same ideology. It's just the condesending way you come across to people, like YOUR decision is the only one that counts and anyone who might have a different opinion automatically becomes an object of derision and ridicule. This even extends to the MANUFACTURERS who, despite their team of engineers, musical consultants, marketing analysts, and decades of experience, still ALWAYS miss the mark (by your standards).

Hey, maybe I'm being too harsh. Maybe I'll go to hell (unlikely, since I'm an atheist ) for not giving a damn about how many intros/endings/variations my purchase has, since that's not why I bought it (I guess you missed that part in the beginning). I wanted a inexpensive digital PIANO to keep in my office when I wanted to just noodle but didn't want to navigate the stairs (really bad knees and hips) to my studio or rehearsal room. The fact that the DP I chose had a few skimpy 'arranger' features was just a bonus (not a requirment).

I will still check out the 'legacy style' thing if I can figure out how to load them. I don't see anything about it in the manual. If you see instructions for it Diki, please post them. I also don't see any reference to a 'General Midi' instrument list and the instrument list provided doesn't contain enough instruments to play Roland styles. ???? I could be wrong about this; since I have little interest in this, I haven't done much digging. I've briefly tried the harmonizer but it doesn't come close to the Vocalist Live I have in the studio. Oh well, I can't sing anyway. Anyhoo, have a good day.

chas

sometimes, ignoring is better ....

... it has become hard to post here safely ...

... what would have said Nigel?!!!

Chas, give those bad knees and hips a break. Buy yourself a Bruno Stair Lift - you will love it!

I purchased this device for my wife about 4 years ago so she could get downstairs to the basement family room. However, because of my distal neuropathy I use it every day because I can no longer negotiate stairways safely. It is a true life saver, at least for me. It was not that expensive and the company installed it in a few hours.

Us old guys have to help each other when the need arises,

Gary (The old codger!)

Gary, I considered a stairlift as long as three or four years ago; Heck, I even considered an elevator (the $35,000 sort of discouraged me ). The main reason I haven't gone that route is the high probability of my selling this house in the near future. I live alone in a fairly large house and with contracted lawn service, landscaping services, weekly house-cleaning services, and heating and cooling a lot of air in largely unused spaces, maintenance can be fairly expensive. Plus, I'd like to be a little closer to my son and grandkids. I'm getting some cortisone shots in the knees and hips next week, so I'll see how much that helps. I may still do the stairlift thing, I'll see what my son thinks. Have a good day.

chas