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#502940 - 05/25/21 11:03 AM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Crossover]
Tapas Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Originally Posted By Crossover
I‘m thinking about buying the iLoud MTM, according to the reviews they are very powerful and surprisingly lightweight studio monitors which sound excellent.

https://www.thomann.de/gb/ik_multimedia_...3VhZ2UiOiJlbiJ9



The IK Multimedia iLoud MTM Compact Studio Monitors got rave reviews on Amazon


Amazon Review



I have not tried them personally.

The best way to evaluate them would be to purchase a pair and try them with your GENOS and see if you like them. Most online retailers like Sweetwater Sound offer a 30-day risk free trial.


IK Multimedia iLoud Studio Monitors - Sweetwater Sound



The GENOS benefits from full range speakers that go down to 30Hz. Small desktop monitors just do not have that kind of bass output. For example, I tried my GENOS with a pair of M-Audio AV40 monitors which has 4” woofers. The results were unsatisfactory. I stepped up to a pair of M-Audio BX5a deluxe monitors with 5” Kevlar cone drivers. The results were subpar. I decided not to include them in my review.

The Behringer B3031A with 8” woofers were the least expensive studio monitors that produced acceptable performance with the GENOS.

The GENOS has a super clean full range output. Your playback system must not only have the capability to play flat down to 30Hz but also have the resolution and refinement to capture the subtle nuances of every voice on this fine instrument.

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#502941 - 05/25/21 01:32 PM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Tapas]
rb293 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/18/07
Posts: 153
Loc: Binghamton, NY USA
iloud studio monitor comparison review... for those who might be interested

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yM9d9qESZgU&list=RDsTAHodk3Z80&index=2

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#502942 - 05/25/21 05:26 PM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: rb293]
Tapas Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Originally Posted By rb293
iloud studio monitor comparison review... for those who might be interested

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yM9d9qESZgU&list=RDsTAHodk3Z80&index=2




That was an excellent video by Piano Man Chuck making a thorough comparison between the iLoud MicroMonitors and the larger MTM Monitors.

Thanks for posting the YouTube link!


A pair of iLoud MTM Monitors costs $700.


I would like to mention 4 other speakers that may be worth evaluating before making a purchase decision.


1.

Behringer Truth B2031A 8.75 inch Powered Studio Monitor

2-way 265W Powered Studio Monitor with 8.75" Woofer, 1" Tweeter, and Room Compensation EQ (each)

$358 a pair


2.

JBL 308P MkII 8-inch Powered Studio Monitor

112W Powered 2-way Studio Reference Monitors with 8" Woofer, 1" Tweeter, and Magnetic Shielding (each)

$498 a pair


3.

ADAM Audio T5V 5 inch Powered Studio Monitor

Active Vertical 2-way Nearfield Monitor with 50W 5" Woofer and 20W U-ART Accelerated-ribbon Tweeter (each)

$400 a pair


4.

ADAM Audio T8V 8-inch Powered Studio Monitor

Active Vertical 2-way Nearfield Monitor with 70W 8" Woofer and 20W U-ART Accelerated-Ribbon Tweeter

$600 a pair



Please note that each one of them is cheaper than the iLoud MTM pair.

Three of them come with 8” woofers which will pump out usable bass down to 40Hz

They are bigger in size and heavier. The increased volume translates to better bass response.


It is hard to judge a speaker based on printed specs and physical dimensions. You cannot really tell how they will perform unless you set them up and properly calibrate them in your home environment connected to your specific gear.

The next best option is to go visit the showroom of a large music retailer. Bring your own music that you are familiar with as FLAC files downloaded to your iPad. Plug in the 1/8” stereo jack to the speaker selector board and compare the sound of all the speakers in the demo room.

If you have a subscription to QOBUZ, you can stream the lossless FLAC files from your Smartphone/Tablet and evaluate the speakers in the store. All Guitar Center stores are equipped to do this.

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#502943 - 05/25/21 07:16 PM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Tapas]
Tapas Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Here are some comparison videos on various Studio Monitors by Digital Stereophony

JBL 305P MKII vs Adam Audio T5V


All comparison videos by Digital Stereophony



They include several iLoud MTM comparisons:


Adam Audio T8V vs IK Multimedia iLoud MTM






Edited by Tapas (05/25/21 07:34 PM)

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#502944 - 05/25/21 11:03 PM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Tapas]
Tapas Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
The Yamaha HS8 edges out the JBL 308P MkII monitors in this comparsion:

Yamaha HS8 vs JBL 308P MKII


The Yamaha HS8 demands an audition.

Yamaha HS8 8 inch Powered Studio Monitor

120W Powered Studio Monitor with 8" Cone Woofer, 1" Dome Tweeter, and Room Control and High-trim Response Controls (each)

$740 a pair


The biggest advantage of the iLoud MTM is its smaller size and weight. You can position them in tight spaces. It comes with a room calibration kit.
It has to be doing some fancy electronic wizardry to get them to emulate the bass response of typical 8" drivers from two 3.5" drivers.

One can easily understand the popular appeal of these monitors. They blend in as ideal desktop monitors whereas the HS8's will look bulky and awkward.


One should not forget that Yamaha makes an affordable 2.1 speaker system for the GENOS.

Yamaha GNS-MS01 Speaker System for Genos

2.1 Active Monitor Speaker System for Yamaha Genos Arranger Workstation with 2 x 20W Satellite Speakers and 1 x 40W Subwoofer

$330

The satellites are even smaller than the iLoud MTMs. If the performance is adequate, why spend any more money?

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#502947 - 05/27/21 01:04 AM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Tapas]
Tapas Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Panel Voices that are common to the TYROS/GENOS family sound exactly identical.

I made an interesting observation while comparing voices that are common to the Tyros 2, CVP-609 and the GENOS.

Note: The CVP-609 shares the same voices as the Tyros 4.

Consider the Panel Voice = DX Sparkle.
This appears on all 3 under slightly different names.

GENOS = DX Sparkle
CVP-609 = Sparkle Stack
Tyros 2 = SparkleStack

I hooked up all 3 devices to channel strips 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 on the Mackie CR1604VLZ mixer.
I set the input gain to unity and raised the fader levels to unity panning each stereo pair hard left and right.

I set the Master Volume on each device to level match the output.

When I played these 3 Panel Voices through my MOAB far field monitors, they sounded exactly identical, even the effects.

I was expecting some form of refinement in the GENOS over the other two. There wasn’t any. Even the demo sequences were identical.

I can see the reason why Yamaha decided to do this. If you have created any project on the Tyros 2, it will playback on the CVP-609/Tyros 4 and the GENOS without requiring any adjustments so long they share common voices.

Of course the GENOS has a whole arsenal of powerful effects. You can enhance these factory voices to your liking.

All the factory panel voices common to the CVP-609 and the GENOS sounded exactly alike:

Here are some panel voices on the GENOS:

DX Ballad
DX BalladBells
DX Dream
DX Sweet
DX Midnight
BoysChoirOoh

Here are the corresponding panel voices on the CVP-609:

Ballad DX
Ballad Bells
Dream DX
Sweet DX
Midnight DX
Boys Choir Ooh


I could see why many Tyros 4 and Tyros 5 users were not enticed to trade up to the GENOS.

The voices common to all do sound exactly the same.

Unless one absolutely needs the extra features and access to the newer voices and REVO drums, there is little justification in shelling out big bucks.

Styles are a different story.

I could clearly hear the refinement in voicing and arrangement moving from the Tyros 2 to the CVP-609 to the GENOS.

If and when Yamaha decides to release GENOS 2, it would need to come with a new feature stack compelling enough to make the upgrade worthwhile for current users.

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#502950 - 05/27/21 10:33 AM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Tapas]
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14207
Loc: NW Florida
How many Genos2’s you think they’re going to sell if they incorporate its features into the original Genos? 😂
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#502952 - 05/27/21 12:22 PM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Diki]
Tapas Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Ha! Obviously none, if the additional features can be incorporated through and OS upgrade on the original GENOS.

Introducing a new model every 3 to 5 years is a superb marketing ploy to get you to buy the same product multiple times with a few improvements.

Ask yourselves, how many Yamaha Arrangers have you bought and sold?

I call this an expensive subscription service laugh

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#502954 - 05/28/21 12:23 AM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Tapas]
Tapas Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 303
Loc: Phoenix, Arizona, USA
Using an External MIDI Controller with the Yamaha GENOS

I explored all the functions on the GENOS that can be remotely controlled by connecting a MIDI Foot Controller.

I was pleasantly surprised to find the simplicity of the MIDI implementation making it idiot proof to configure any controller.

Everything is clearly explained in the GENOS Reference Manual, Page 149:


Genos Reference Manual


There are 95 different functions you can control remotely:

No Assign
Sustain
Sostenuto
Soft
Portamento
Modulation (Alt) Right 1
Modulation (Alt) Right 2
Modulation (Alt) Right 3
Modulation (Alt) Left
Articulation 1 Right 1
Articulation 1 Right 2
Articulation 1 Right 3
Articulation 1 Left
Articulation 2 Right 1
Articulation 2 Right 2
Articulation 2 Right 3
Articulation 2 Left
Articulation 3 Right 1
Articulation 3 Right 2
Articulation 3 Right 3
Articulation 3 Left
Effect Right 1
Effect Right 2
Effect Right 3
Effect Left
Effect Mic
Keyboard Harmony/Arpeggio On/Off
Vocal Harmony On/Off
Vocal Harmony Effect On/Off
Talk
Score Page +
Score Page –
Lyrics Page +
Lyrics Page –
Text Viewer Page +
Text Viewer Page –
Song A Play/Pause
Song B Play/Pause
Style Start/Stop
Tap Tempo
Synchro Start
Synchro Stop
Intro 1
Intro 2
Intro 3
Main A
Main B
Main C
Main D
Fill Down
Fill Self
Fill Break
Fill Up
Ending 1
Ending 2
Ending 3
Fade In/Out
Fingered/Fingered On Bass
Bass Hold
Percussion 1
Percussion 2
Percussion 3
Right 1 Part On/Off
Right 2 Part On/Off
Right 3 Part On/Off
Left Part On/Off
One Touch Setting +
One Touch Setting –
One Touch Setting 1
One Touch Setting 2
One Touch Setting 3
One Touch Setting 4
Registration Sequence +
Registration Sequence –
Registration 1
Registration 2
Registration 3
Registration 4
Registration 5
Registration 6
Registration 7
Registration 8
Registration 9
Registration 10
Transpose +
Transpose –
Multi Pad 1
Multi Pad 2
Multi Pad 3
Multi Pad 4
Multi Pad Stop
Song Control SP1
Song Control SP2
Song Control SP3
Song Control SP4
Song Control Loop


This is a pretty comprehensive list.

All you need to trigger these functions is to send a Control Change message or a MIDI Note ON message.

You can chose from the following 30 Control Change messages to trigger these functions.

CC 0
CC 5
CC 6
CC 8
CC 9
CC 10
CC 11
CC 12
CC 13
CC 14
CC 15
CC 16
CC 17
CC 18
CC 19
CC 20
CC 21
CC 22
CC 23
CC 24
CC 25
CC 26
CC 27
CC 28
CC 29
CC 30
CC 31
CC 32
CC 33
CC 34

If your MIDI Foot Controller has 30 pedals, you can utilize all of them at once, with each CC message mapped to any of the 95 different functions.

The Nectar Pacer has 10 pedals.

I decided to map them as follows:


Pedal Function
1 INTRO 2
2 INTRO 3
3 FILL DOWN
4 FILL SELF
5 FILL UP
6 BREAK
7 INTRO 1
8 ENDING 1
9 ENDING 2
10 ENDING 3


To keep matters simple, I decided to use the default mapping of the GENOS factory preset named “All Parts”

MENU | MENU 2 | MIDI | External Controller | All Parts

CC Default_Mapping

CC 0 Style Start/Stop
CC 5 Fill Down
CC 6 Fill Self
CC 8 Fill Break
CC 9 Fill Up
CC 10 Synchro Stop
CC 11 Main A
CC 12 Main B
CC 13 Main C
CC 14 Main D
CC 15 Style Start/Stop
CC 16 Fill Down
CC 17 Fill Self
CC 18 Fill Break
CC 19 Fill Up
CC 20 Synchro Stop
CC 21 Intro 1
CC 22 Intro 2
CC 23 Intro 3
CC 24 Tap Tempo
CC 25 Style Start/Stop
CC 26 Fill Down
CC 27 Fill Self
CC 28 Fill Break
CC 29 Fill Up
CC 30 Synchro Stop
CC 31 Ending 1
CC 32 Ending 2
CC 33 Ending 3
CC 34 Fade In/Out


Note: You are free to change this factory default mapping to relate any of these 30 CC numbers to any of the 95 functions.

You can save your custom mapping in a User Preset.

You can create as many User Presets as you like.

This brings tremendous flexibility and power to the GENOS.

Besides CC messages, you can also trigger any of these 95 functions by sending a MIDI Note ON message (1 through 30).


The lowest note of an 88-key digital piano is A0 which is MIDI Note 21.

MIDI Note 30 is F#1 on your digital piano.

This means you can use the lower portion of your 88-key digital piano to control 10 different functions:


MIDI_Note, Note_Name
21, A0
22, Bb0
23, B0
24, C1
25, C#1
26, D1
27, Eb1
28, E1
29, F1
30, F#1


This is a great solution if you do not have a MIDI Foot Pedal!


You can make the 10 lowest keys act like pedals to trigger anything you wish from the pool of 95 different functions.

Clearly, Yamaha engineers put a lot of thought in designing the GENOS to bring this level of flexibility.

Special thanks to the Yamaha Documentation Team for publishing easy to understand reference manuals.

I will write up a User Guide with screenshots showing how to configure the GENOS with the Nectar Pacer MIDI Foot Controller with an example SysEx file that you can download and play with.

I will also write up a second User Guide showing how to configure the GENOS with the Behringer FCB1010 MIDI Foot Controller with an example SysEx file.


David

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#502956 - 05/28/21 01:38 PM Re: Yamaha Genos 2 anticipated release date [Re: Tapas]
dud Offline
Member

Registered: 05/05/01
Posts: 232
Loc: israel
my friend it is the end of top arranger keys , there will not be genos2 or pax5 or new ketron , roland stopped to make theme years ago. on the other hand the last top arrangeres that was produced especialy genos and ketron sd 9/60/90 are the best we could dream 20-30 years ago.

it is sad , but that is the fact and there are some reasons for that ,the main reason is that there is no need for arranger keyboards anymore , only few of us who plays western music still find places to work , only eastern countries of arab and turky music still have live music places to work.


Edited by dud (05/28/21 01:42 PM)
_________________________
davidfle@walla.co.il

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