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#98127 - 02/25/05 08:37 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
ChicoBrasil Offline
Member

Registered: 06/09/01
Posts: 993
Loc: Belo Horizonte,Minas Gerais,Br...
Hi Don M

Your comments are wise and opportune.

Chico

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#98128 - 02/25/05 08:49 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
Impuls Offline
Member

Registered: 02/24/02
Posts: 556
Loc: Netherlands
Just a idea,

Lets use the hardware from the G70 and the software from Yamaha Tyros 2
I buy it !

Regards,
Arno
_________________________
Genos,Nord Electro 5D

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#98129 - 02/25/05 09:13 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
BlkNotes Offline
Member

Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 220
[ The only way one could think otherwise is if they go for the marketing excuse spin of "blah blah blah blah complex something blah blah " from Yamaha. Sorry...just all the mega/cool/live/sweet buzzword crap got to me, regardless of the quality of the voices one has to wonder when Yamaha tells them " oh we have super magic samples...super magic multisamples even and its all new stuff magic stuff that errr picks up every nuance of....oh yeah the instruments we sampled.

Dear Alone&Forsaken;

LOL, you are killing me A&F. I especially like your spin on Snagglepuss [ " oh we have super magic samples...super magic multisamples even "]

One would think after 2-3 years under their belt with the Tyros I ( reviewing companints & problems & wish lists), and they are in a position to see what all the other top arranger Kbs companies have done ( since they have all been realeased) that they could top all of them. At least from a marketing stand point isn't that the point. Make a product better then your competitors. I have been told that these companies hate each other ( ex Korg, Yam, past Techniques, Roland etc..) I would think companies would be motivated to make the best keyboard for bragging rights alone.

Also i have figured out why Yam names their voices.mega/cool/live/sweet

1) Mega--named after the geek techs at Yam who want to make a great KB, but who are prevented by the next No.2

2) Cool--named after the executives with cool personalities, who kybosh any advancements

3)Sweet--named after the marketing department who sugar coat and exagerate minimal changes in KB design to increase sales.

4)Live--named after ?? Anyone??


PS. DonM you are showing your age when you talk about lighted keys Do they still make Kbs with those do they? What about bringing back the bouncing ball( on top of music) feature?? Lets have a show of hands. Also, I don't think the pro market is as small as you think Don. In Europe the OMB in clubs, cafes, restaurants is very large. I would have thought that home users would be more interested in digital pianos ( which have arranger function) , organs etc..


Regards;
BN

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#98130 - 02/25/05 09:54 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
nardoni2002 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/12/02
Posts: 673
Loc: malaga, spain
live,reverse live,you got it evil,mike

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#98131 - 02/25/05 09:56 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
Beakybird Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/27/01
Posts: 2154
I agree with Don M. Yamaha probably 1) doesn't want to start the buzz prematurely on Tyros 2, and 2) doesn't want the competitors to see the keyboard yet.

I feel for those who like the Yammie sound and features and just want 76 keys. It must be very frustrating. I'm sure that if and when they see a financial advantage in providing 76 keys, they will do it.

I am certain that the Tyros 2 will not disappoint. It is going to have all new styles and will have mega voices for horns. Plus, it looks like there are some more buttons to play with.

Yamaha has a good track record for improvement of previous models (except for the PSR2100 which was 98% the same as the PSR2000. The PSR9000 was a great keyboard in its time. So was the PSR9000 PRO. The PSR2000/2100 offered great value. The Tyros still is a great keyboard. The PSR3000 is amazing for the price. I'm sure the Tyros 2 will be a fantastic keyboard for those who can afford it (not me!).

I'll buy two PSR3100s or whatever they'll be called when they come out next year.

Beakybird

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#98132 - 02/25/05 10:54 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
Alone&Forsaken Offline
Member

Registered: 12/01/04
Posts: 120
Well, if someone wants to defend Yamaha as they take the home market for all its worth with keyboards lesser then they offered years ago and lesser then even what others offer on that level ( and higher level for less money ) and not use that mass market funding for some R&D...they can have fun doing so.

I think its sad that for many needs Yamaha doesn't even have an option out there.

Hell, Yamaha boards lack basic features like proper output jacks lol or having reverb AND chorus effects ALL on the same keyboard when spending over half a grand...let alone some dsp effects.

Check out the "magic stomp" from Yamaha...why in the heck cant 3000$ keyboards from them have relative quality effects. The tech is right there, Yamaha has it...fact its not taken advantage of is nothing less then stupidity. The effects on their low/mid line mixers are better then the stuff in their high end keyboards.

I dont have some total hate for Yamaha, I just hate how their selective over basic no brainer stuff. I know their out to make money...just there is a big contrast between making a solid product you streamlined some costs on, then taking away an output jack cause " thats 5cents a unit and if we sale XXXX amount we make XXXX amount pure extra." Its like when CBS took over Fender and started bolting on necks with three bolts to jack up profit. There are some things you just dont do.

Yamaha has others dropping off keyboards with pitchbend, mod, d-beam, left/right outputs, metal cases, left/right inputs and so on...for the same price ( or lower ) then Yamahas sub psr1000 line up.

Plus not to slander the Tyros...just I fail to see how its price is justified, when insanity like the Alesis Andromeda is out there. Yeah one is an arranger...the other an analog synth, thats part of the ????? nature of it. Why is the Yamaha arranger the same cost or higher, then that monster of an analog synth?

As for Yamaha not being able to sale enough " pro " keyboards...Dont see Korg having problems pushing thier worksations ( market supports what...seven versions of the Triton ). Korg has the microkorg and MS2000 and MS2000 rack, so the market supports three versions of the same VA engine. Alesis...much the same the Andromeda real analog is supported, then the Ion and Micron two VAs ( with 16 or 17 filter types ) that share the same sound engine are supported. Roland and its Fantoms are not having any issues. lol and this is just a few of the more common players...bring nord to the table and others.

Cause all Korg has to do is enhance their arrangers a bit and drop some under the thousand mark...Roland only needs to do, something to their arrangers smirk That homemarket safe zone fantasy would be shot to hell. Random...think what the Fusion ( thats demos got pushed to march ) could do to Yamaha's flagship motifs if its pulled off well.

SORRY about all the words Just I wish Yamaha would kick the ass we all know they can, the fact that they hint about what could be in their current gear, in their past and dont just drop a bomb is suck. They make such a big deal about " we make real world instruments so we know best what they should sound like " just pisses you off when they had that LIMITED production run of those completely bamboo acoustic guitars and they dint have the mind to sample it to their keyboards. Come on...make a bamboo guitar have the guitar all but impossible to find/buy then gloat about knowing how things should sound, when thier to stupid to sample an instrument made of bamboo. Isnt getting unique sounds one part of the keyboard game after all ? Isnt that kinda a big slip/oversight ?

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#98133 - 02/25/05 10:58 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
Alone&Forsaken Offline
Member

Registered: 12/01/04
Posts: 120
"My opinion is this: Yamaha is working on this prototype. Somebody took an unauthorized photo, and they want to handle the publicity and release in their own time."


I thought this was the understood reality from reading the topic on the now gone Tyros 2 post hahaha.

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#98134 - 02/25/05 11:41 AM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
BlkNotes Offline
Member

Registered: 02/01/05
Posts: 220
Watch our A & F you might get censored by Yammie. :0

Beakybird--what competition? All the brand companies have just or with 1-1.5 years released their top model arrangers. So they are not going to be releasing one anytime soon. So as I see it yamaha doesn't have to worry about anyone stealing their ideas. But really, if one looks at what yamaha is going to release in the Tyros 2, I don't think they are in jepardy of the other Brand companies stealing theses ideas, beacause really they aren't close to ground breaking advancements. I would call the tyros 2 just fine tuning & catch up to the rest of the market. Ex--adding a HD, fixing the OS/problems with the song booketc.., few more sounds and styles, sampler. Just matching with what is already here from other manufacturers.

Regards;
BN

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#98135 - 02/25/05 12:36 PM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
Graham UK Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/20/01
Posts: 1838
Loc: Lincolnshire UK
Having worked most of my life in the British Loudspeaker Business. We made a flagship model knowing full well that the sales numbers would be small and only sold to a dedicated few. The main reason was produce an excellent top flagship of the range that would encourage the greater sales of models lower down the range which offered better value for money.
Take as an example Tyros which enabled very large sales of the PSR3000 at very good value.

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#98136 - 02/25/05 12:50 PM Re: What happend to the Tyros2 link and discussion?
squeak_D Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4643
Loc: West Virginia
Alone,
I can see your points and understand your frustration with Yamaha regarding their keyboards. I remember a ways back I was hounding Yamaha because they would leave off something like a modulation wheel between one model and the next, and how even Casio had both wheels on both models (WK-1800/1600 at the time). I was pleased when they released the PSR-1500 and saw they finally caught on and added the modulation wheel to both models.

I too think that Yamaha can do a bit better in several departments. I look at the Tyros and what all it does, then I look at something like the Alesis Fusion synth coming out and I compare price and features.. Well I think you see where I'm heading with that one.

When I had Gary's PSR-2000 for a few days I did a side by side comparison of that board with my Casio WK-3500. I was pretty shocked. Here I had a Yamaha keyboard that was $1,000 and up when released, and I was finding that a Casio that cost less than $400 was beating out Yammie in several departments. Even in the sound department. The Casio (again in my opinion) has better bass guitars, the stereo acoutic pianos (all 3 of them) had a fuller bodied sound, and were much stronger in the lower registers. Granted Yamaha has the sweet tenor and sweet saprano, but Casio beats them out with the Velo. Tenor, Velo. Alto Sax,and even the preset saxes were stronger than Yamaha's preset saxes (minus the saprano sax).

The Casio gave you 76 full size keys, floppy disk and smart media, way better quality pitchbend and modulation wheels that were also larger (more standard synth size) than the PSR's. I even compared the effects. Both have their strong and weak points there, but the Casio's effects were pretty strong considering it's a bottom line keyboard. The Casio blew the PSR out of the water with the wha effects. I tried creating a good Jimi style guitar on the Yamaha and the Casio put it to shame.

Don't get wrong either I think the PSR-2000 was a great keyboard and in MANY areas put the Casio to shame. It's also probably not fair to really compare the two. However that little Casio (well not really little), held up really well against the Yamaha PSR-2000 in sounds. Casio's drawbars aren't up to Yammies, but again not fair to compare because the WK's drawbars are very stripped down version of the MZ-2000 and those were really damn good.

I can also understand Yamaha requesting the info to be pulled from the Zone. Someone probably snuck a camea into this place and snapped pics of the new Tyros.

I wonder what Yamaha has in store to compete with the new Korg and the new Alesis. The Alesis has a more indepth synth engine, more sequencing tracks, better screen, and even has an 8 track digital recorder built in. Yammie better have something good up their sleeves.

Squeak

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 02-25-2005).]

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 02-25-2005).]
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GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.

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