The G70 arrived yesterday and I spent several hours of playing with it.

I still own the SD1 as well, so there is somthing to compare with.
Exploring the G70 was pretty easy but the most disappointing things are the styles.

Sure there is a kind of progression in variations, stepping from var1, var2, var3 to var4 but minimal. The same guitar that starts in var1 is playing excactly the same notes in all vars. e.g. Only a hihat, rimshot or ride cymbal is added.

I'm not used to this inexpensive 'solutions' and expect a much better job from the programmers.
The styles are created by technicians, not by musicians..... in other words : No musical feel at all.

The Leslie sim, with only one DSP (low speaker) lets the Harmonic Bar sound poor.

The demo songs are not recorded with the use of styles, probably on an external sequencer. I wished I could find one style that has the quality of the demosongs..... no way, there is nohing like that in the styles. The guitars all sound the same.

The SFX sounds, seem to be an exact copy of the ones in the very first Canvas SC55 ?
(Is this 'the best' from Roland?)

None of the three velocity curves is OK to get the good Xpiano sound... at least for me.

The G70 twice locked up and the accompany chords were not processed correctly. Reboot needed.

The songbook contains about 500 songs. Different names, yes, but many identicals,
(Somebody did a rush job)

The G70 has a GM2-logo on it, but playback of a GM2 midifile did not impress me at all.
The quality of SD1 playback of the same file was fantastic. (The SD1 has no GM2-logo)

The bass has no 'body' (no punch).
The brass just sound to Canvas-alike
Some fill-ins do not fit correctly in the time-path.

I do realize one needs time to get used to new sounds, but this one ? ...... I will never get used to a 3000€ machine that performs like a 500€ keyboard

I was told the current G70 is fully engineered/developed at this moment.

In my view Roland needs another 12 months the redo their homework and give it another try in dec 2005

I swapped from Roland G70 to PA1X. The PA1X sounds amazing to me, while the max polyphony is only 62 !

Roel, I'm really disapointed to hear your bad news about the G70 as I really had high hopes for Roland to finally come thru with a winner. On the Upside though, I just saved myself money, realizing that my Yamaha Tyros continues to best suit my keyboard performance requirements. This month (Dec) marks my 2nd anniversary of Tyros ownership, and now more satisfied than ever with this keyboard, especially since those bugs I complained to Yamaha for so long about 'finally' got addressed & corrected. I now look forward to an 'even more satisfying' year playing the Tyros.

Scott

Wow. Thanks for the frank review. I was really holding out a little hope for a technical advance in the sound and function of the G70 after waiting so long for a new Roland arranger. It'll be telling to see how others feel as the keyboard arrives worldwide, but it doesn't sound promising.

How sad to hear the Roland sounds are without much improvement. I know people love the Roland sounds, but I find them dated. That's why I sold my VA-7 off. It's a shame to hear the new Roland G70 sounds are the same old ones!

Tom G.

Thanks Roel,
I echo the replies here. Thanks for being frank about it, and I realize with your
liking towards Ketron, my midjay was a great buy!

------------------
Roy-Andrè

congratulations Roel on purchasing the Korg PA1X !!! As folks overhere know I have been playing the PA80 and PA50 for a couple of years now and think they are great keyboards.
If it weren't for the steep price I would purchase the PA1X myself but considering the few hours I spend playing these days I think it would not be a wise move for the time being.
I sympathize with all Roland players who had very high expectations from this "newborn king", but personally I had kind of expected this.
regards,
john

Roel, sorry for your disappointment about the G70 and congratulations for the Pa1 X pro!

Roy Andrè, could you post your impressions about the Ketron Midijay? Thanks!

I had the opportunity to audition the PA1X Pro last weekend and was impressed overall as well.

The only major thing that kept me from serious purchase consideration was its messed up chord recognition. As I mentioned before, Korg has stubbornly clung to some strange (theoretically correct, but NEVER played by real keyboard players) chord interpretations of chord voicings that would make far more sense to represent chords pro keyboardists 'voice these for' instead. If the chord voicing interpretations Korg chose really were actually utilized for the chords recognition they gave them, then perhaps I could see the reasoning behind reserving it for that purpose, but I can BET not a SINGLE player here (or anywhere for that matter) plays any of Korg's esoterically odd chord voicings to signify the chord assignments Korg gave them. Here's an example: Eb1 - A1 - D2. As I recall, Korg recognizes that as an EbM7(b5) or something similar. Strangely, the important 3rd (which signifies the CRITICALLY IMPORTANT major or minor tone) is completely missing. One would never play this to signify that chord. On the other hand, playing Eb1 - A1 - D2 (together as a chord) is a very commonly played (among pro keyboard players) and considered a left hand rootless voicing for F13, where the Eb = the flatted 7th, A1 = the important major 3rd, and the D2 = the 13th (or 6th). Perhaps some of you aren't familiar with rootless style jazz chord voicings which produce an open sound suitable for comping, but 'how many' of you play this same chord voicing to represent the chord EbM7(b5) either? In other words, why doesn't Korg reserve that voicing for players who ACTUALLY utilize these popular played (especially in Jazz) chord voicings , of which were popularized by jazz piano greats Bill Evans & Wynton Kelly, and currently Diana Krall & many others. Yamaha, Technics, and even Ketron have come on board, so Korg, why aren't you listening?

Scott

Scott and all PA1XPRO owners.

I have had my PA1XPRO for several monthes now and I very much enjoy it.
As to the chord recognition issues, EVERYONE that has one should call KORG to describe the problem and request it to be changed. They are currently working on the next release of the OS.

Th only way to get these (or others too) issues addressed is to go to Korg with the complaints. Sometimes you have to be pretty demanding, but 4 issues I reported GOT FIXED!

My .02 worth...
Lee

Roel,

I wanted to reply to your message in Frankie's thread, but then realized that it belongs here.

I am sorry to read about your (mis)adventures with G70. It has put a damper on my excitement about it as well. Reading your comments about stale sounds makes me wonder where what did they use the 192 MB of sound ROM for.

Having said that, sound is a very subjective thing. There are people who like Korg sound, but to my ears it has always been a bit too harsh and unpolished, more suited for hip-hop rave party than a fancy dinner-dance affair (but that's just my two ears' perception).

The SD1 is indeed a very nice instrument. The Ketron styles are generally much more elaborate than Roland and Yamaha's are, and I fully expected that Roland styles maintain their understated elegance. It is regrettable that Roland did not seem to put in the programming effort into the much heralded 6 fills.

I am pretty certain that there will be an OS update (or a few) which will fix the crashes fairly quickly, probably within the month. Roland is pretty good in getting the stability issues resolved. OS enhancements are a totally different matter - while smaller manufacturers, like Ketron and GEM on occasion will issue an OS update which will give users some new and very desirable functions, Roland has no history of doing that. On the other hand, by spending resources on functional enhancements, they often have to push back work on stability issues, which can (and do if one to believe the Ketron forum here) adversely affect their current customers.

I think that with any instrument there is a trade-off, especially with a complex one like an arranger. There is not a single one which has all the best sounds, styles, ergonomics and ease of use, size and weight, other features like MIDI/MP3 playback and vocal harmonizer, high polyphony, good size and quality keyboard (I need 76 keys), reliability, user support, and competitive price.

At this point my 6 year old G1000 still works for me, and sounds very satisfying. I do not enjoy its lack of user-friendliness, and the small screen size is really hard on my eyes. The fact that it has no vocal harmonizer (while all the competitors do) also bothers me a bit. So I will probably wait until a G70 comes to local stores, or at least to the big on-line retailers who have 30-day return policy - as much as G70 looks good to me on paper, your frank comments will keep me from buying one sight unseen, which would not have been a good thing anyways.

I am glad you found happiness with the PA1X - enjoy.

Regards,
Alex