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#463154 - 12/15/18 09:12 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: IMMusic_Curt]
Bachus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 6974
Originally Posted By IMMusic_Curt
Hmm - An exciting challenge. I found this in the manual:

You can create User Audio Drums (Wave 44,100, 16-bit) using specific Audio Editor Software, or by importing User Audio Drums which were already created for the AUDYA series keyboards.
Whatever the origin of these files is, the SD9 Pro can "locate" and manage them through the DRUM part of the Modeling feature. In order to be properly recognized and utilized, these audio files must have the following name structure and assigned as such:-

That section of the manual goes on to describe how to name the files for the different parts of a style. I'm thinking you could take a loop that you like in Logic, bounce to a wav, name it as a fill, beak, arranger part "A," "B," etc. to make the SD90 happy. The only thing is that would be using the audio in the loop vs. what is in the SD90. Would that matter? In addition to Logic shipping with audio loops, it also ships with a number of MIDI loops that you could work with. I'll also mention another interesting feature in Logic if you haven't tried it. It's called "Drummer". By moving various sliders and turning knobs, you can influence how complex a pattern it will play. There are various genres to pick from when you start. Same thought, if you find something you like, bounce it to a wav and transfer over to the SD90 and work with it in the Modeling feature.

It just started to rain, and the wife is out shopping with her sister - Maybe I'll mess around a little with this. Sounds like FUN!


Thanks, i have a dowloaded manual somewhere

And yes drummer in logic and mainstage is the coolest drum app to be found..
Might be fun to get it in sync with some style or launchpads...
It will be my main goal to make much more use of the vst collection and mainstage/logic/maschine, in combination with the kronos or modx..(2 setups)
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#463157 - 12/15/18 09:52 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: Bachus]
Bachus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 6974
I did some manual diving
And i found this ideo, you really need to see his Kurt



Its itallian, but shows exactly what we just discussed.
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#463159 - 12/15/18 10:47 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: stkeys]
IMMusic_Curt Offline
Member

Registered: 06/17/18
Posts: 313
Loc: New Symrna Beach, Fl.
Excellent Find! I'm going to give it a try. That looks like it will do the trick.
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Curt
https://immusic.co
MIDI, Music and Keyboard Fun!

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#463162 - 12/15/18 12:19 PM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: stkeys]
IMMusic_Curt Offline
Member

Registered: 06/17/18
Posts: 313
Loc: New Symrna Beach, Fl.
Hmm - Not quite working. Getting a ton of white noise and faintly hear the drums in the background. Going to give it another shot in the morning.
_________________________
Curt
https://immusic.co
MIDI, Music and Keyboard Fun!

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#477817 - 10/11/19 09:03 PM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: stkeys]
volovicg Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/26/19
Posts: 8
Loc: Carmel Indiana
Now I am all confused. AJ - you sure that is not a typo.... I have it it the other way around. Live drums is the real drummer and audio drums is the wave table? Please clarify if I am not correct ? Thanks

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#477821 - 10/12/19 01:36 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: volovicg]
abacus Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5014
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Originally Posted By volovicg
Now I am all confused. AJ - you sure that is not a typo.... I have it it the other way around. Live drums is the real drummer and audio drums is the wave table? Please clarify if I am not correct ? Thanks


Wavetable is a synthesis format https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wavetable_synthesis
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#477829 - 10/12/19 04:30 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: stkeys]
volovicg Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/26/19
Posts: 8
Loc: Carmel Indiana
Maybe I used the term incorrectly as I thought a wav table could be synthesized or sampled. IT is my understanding audio drums have a sampled wave file for each note - ie C is kick, c# is Hihat , d is snare etc . And these files are individually sampled. Where live drums are sampled wave of the entire kit and hence you have a wave for arranger A , another for arranger B etc. is this incorrect and is my understanding of audio drums is wrong can some clear it up for me ?
Thanks

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#477835 - 10/12/19 05:21 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: stkeys]
abacus Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5014
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Individual drum sounds are usually sampled and assigned to Midi notes and can be played on a keyboard, drum pad, computer screen etc.
Audio Drum loops are a recording of a real drummer playing a real drum kit, with each variation etc. having its own dedicated loop, however software is available that can split the audio drum loop into its component parts allowing it to be assigned like a normal Midi Drum Sample. (A common format where this is done for you are REX files which contain the full loop and the data to access each part of the loop https://fileinfo.com/extension/rex)
Hope this helps
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English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#478483 - 10/22/19 10:19 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: stkeys]
Ketron_AJ Offline
Moderator

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 3274
Loc: Middletown, DE
Live Drums/Grooves and Live Audio Drums are created the same way ... a drummer playing an actual drum set. Differece is ... Live Audio Drums are not tuched once created - they are simply streamed as audio (*.wav) when used so styles with LIVE means 18 audio wave drums are assigned to each of the 18 arranger parts (Intro1, Intro2, Arranger A, B C ... etc).
This method gives you the BEST LIVE FEELING AS YOUR DRUMMER created it ... but also offers the LEAST CONTROL/EDITING capability as you are dealing with exclusive wave/audio files.

For Live Drums/Grooves, the recorded data is further treated/scliced into sections so that they (the sections) are triggered via MIDI. This type of kit allows for some kind of CONTROL and re-arrangement without loosing too much LIVE FEEL as you are dealing with wave files but slices/segments which individually can be controlled to some extent.

MIDI drums (as used by most other arrangers) are created as thus:- Drummer sits on a drum kit, sound guy says play KICK drum, he plays the kick and that is recored as "KICK.wav", next they say play the snare soft, drummer plays snare and it is recorded as "SNARE-soft.wave", other variation of the snare recorded as "SNARE-med.wave" and "SNARE-hard.wav" ... etc and drummer goes through entire drum set, and repeats this for different drum kits (or in the case of TECHNO, DANCE ... etc, samples are purchased or created in the studio). Now all these samples are put together under various drum sets and stored in the ROM/Wave table of each instrument (KETRON, YAMAHA, ROLAND) ... etc and the samples are 'triggered/recalled' by the style or Midifile or sequencer ... etc as needed. Because these are individual samples, you have more control over volume, reverb.. etc of each INDIVIDUAL notes, more flexibility to create your own drum tracks by triggering as needed ... etc but you LOOSE the LIVE FEEL of the drummer.

Hope this better explains it.

Thanks,
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Design Engineer & Product Specialist.
www.KetronAmerica.com

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#478849 - 10/25/19 04:33 AM Re: Live Drums vs Audio Drums [Re: Ketron_AJ]
Dreamkeeper Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 06/06/18
Posts: 13
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By Ketron_AJ
... the BEST LIVE FEELING AS YOUR DRUMMER created it ... but also offers the LEAST CONTROL/EDITING capability as you are dealing with exclusive wave/audio files.



... and if one want to run other device in midi sync with Ketron SD, it is only possible with Audiodrums and Grooves, but not by the styles with the Live Drums! Even if you set tempo near at the original Live Drums tempo im style - there is no synchronization.

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