To Technicsplayer

Please I need your kind help. If any Forum member has any suggestions, I'd appreciate them, please.

I have owned a KN5000 for long and have in the past few months acquired a KN7000. I have been trying to get used to the KN7000 and the settings. A problem that I encounter is that when I start playing any of the preset rythmns and I put the APC (auto accompaniment) on the keyboard sound becomes becomes very very bassy (i.e. too much bass sound) from the middle part of the keyboard. And this tends to drown the sound I play from either the RT1 or RT2. The bassy sound also tends to drown the drums accompaniment. I try ruducing the bass volume control to reduce the bass. It does not help. And when I dtry solving the problem by pushing down the APC volume control, this affects the entire volume of the accompaniment.

With the KN5000, I find the accompaniment very impressively heavy and clear with the APC on. And when I play any of the RT1 or Rt2 voicings either at the middle or righthand end of the keyboard, the sound of both the voicings and the accompaniment are distinct and what I play doesn't ever tend to drown the drums and other APC accompaniments (which I enjoy when they sound heavy and clear).

I looked at the KN5000 equaliser settings and decided to apply the KN5000 equaliser settings to the KN7000. But it didn't help.

Can I please get some advice and help to enable me solve this problem. I love the KN7000 and would expect it to give me an output better than the KN5000. If I can configure it properly to get rid of the too bassy sound at the middle part of the keyboard when the APC is on, I will be glad.

The second thing, please, is that I copied some KN5000 preset rythmns onto the KN7000 Custom channel. However, when I try to part-edit any of them, I get a message that I cannot part-edit them because they are not KN7000 preset rythmns. Please is there any way I can part-edit any of these?

Finally, I love this Forum and I thank all of its members for their kindness and help to one another.

Thank you.

Kenny

I would start with the overall equalizer assuming there is no fault with this 7k since the sound should certainly be better than the 5k, clearer if anything. Press Program Menus, Reverb & Effect, Equalizer. At FLAT the first slider should affect 125Hz from the initial state. Select that slider, move down to FC with the lower button, trying each range from 40 upwards to 300 or 400 Hz, moving back to the slider and taking it down 3 or 6dB etc to taste, you should be able to find the frequency range of the bass heaviness that annoys you. Naturally EQ ON has to be switched in the corner of the screen. If you find a setting that suits you can prevent new loads from altering it in Data Protection and/or different panel memories from changing it in the Expansion filter.

I'm not entirely clear what is meant with part-editing Customs but Custom styles generally need to be edited in the Composer. Press Program Menus, Composer, Custom Style Copy. Set the Direction at the bottom for Custom to Composer and dial in the relevant locations and OK. The style can now be comprehensively edited (including individual bass and part EQ etc) in the Composer, then sent back to Custom in the same way, with the opposite Direction setting.

Alec said...
"If you find a setting that suits you can prevent new loads from altering it in Data Protection and/or different panel memories from changing it in the Expansion filter."

Can anyone further elaborate "Data Protection" for a personal EQ setting?
I would like to save my custom EQ setting so it's always there when the keyboard is switched back on.

Thanks
Larry

the simplest way to keep a preferred overall equalizer setting is to store it in custom panel and press that button after switch on. The default expand panel memory filter for equalizer is OFF, so changing panel memories will not change the overall equalizer even if different settings are stored in those panel memories. Then if you go to Customise, Data Protection, Total Equalizser, set to ON and OK, loading a file with a different equalizer setting will be prevented from changing your preferred setting.

Dear Technicsplayer

Thanks for your kind and prompt response to my KN7000 problem.

I have tried what you suggested but I discover that I still experience the very bazzy sound when I play any of the 12 black and white notes from the middle C of the board.

Maybe I should explain better my experience: When the APC button is switched off, the sound that I get across the breath of the keyboard is very crisp, wonderful and all that I could ask for in a keyboard. But I always require the accompaniment when I play. I need the APC to be switched on so I could use the accompaniment. However, when the APC button is switched on, any key that I play with my right hand from the Middle C white key all through the 12 white and black keys from Middle C upwards - they sound very deep and bazzy and they tend to drown any accompaniment that is on. After the 12th note from the Middle C, the keys start sounding beautiful and crisp again even with the APC on. Again, when I switch off the APC, those same notes/keys sound very good.

As you suggested, I went to the overall Equalizer and under FLAT, I set all the five Gain sliders to zero, changed all the 5 FC(Hz) settings to the minimum which is 40 each, and changed the four Q(Hz) settings also to their minimum which is 0.1. And when I tried playing with the APC on, there was no change at all. I tried switching OFF the equalizer, and still there was the same problem - very deep and bazzy sounds produced by any keys played with the 12 black and white keys from the Middle C upwards. I really need help to solve this problem. I believe there must be something to turn off or on, or something to adjust somewhere in order to solve this problem. But I don't know, and I therefore need your help and that of members of the Forum out there.

eanwhile, I need to mention that I have just discovered that my KN7000 is PAL ver 1.3. I have read in some other Forum postings about members updating to ver 1.6. I have not yet updated mine, and hope that it is not the reason that I have the problem.

I look forward to your kind and expert advice on this. Thank you and thanks to all you members of the Forum for all your help to fellow members.

Kenny

Hi,
The test is to try and find out if there is a hardware fault on your 7k or if adjusting the sound is enough to improve things. If the problem is specific to certain keys only then it looks like a fault. But to find if a frequency range is the problem here is the procedure:
Initialise the kn7000.
Go the equalizer (now all flat) and switch ON in the bottom right hand corner.
Reduce the FIRST slider ONLY to say -9dB (minus) for example.
Go down to FC and start at say 63Hz, try the sound.
Adjust to the next 80Hz, try the sound.
Try 100, 125 etc etc in turn and see if any setting improves the sound.
IF a setting does improve the sound the next step could be to try the second slider but a much "fatter" Q than 0.1 would be needed to hear a difference.

Again if the problem is specific only to 12 keys this will not help and it looks like a fault. You could try taking out any footswitches, leads etc and a factory reset, hold down 8&16, Rock, Ballad and Jazz rhythm buttons and switch on.

It would not harm to take it up to version 1.6 though whether it helps depends if the problem is hardware or a firmware that somehow got corrupted. If you want to do that leave your email address and I can supply the required 6 floppies.

Dear Technicsplayer

Thanks for your reply and advice. I will try out the steps you have suggested. If I may ask,please do you have the same experience with those keys on your KN7000 when the APC is turned on - OR has any any member of the Forum experienced this with their KN7000. I hope all this is not the result of any malfunction with my KN7000!

Meanwhile, I would like to update to 1.6 if you would please send me the six files as promised, and if possible, please, with instructions on the update procedure. My email address is wisdom2@gmail.com.

Thanks you very much.

Kenny

Hi there,
Files are sent. If you have ver1.3 at the moment:
1 first upgrade to 1.4 table with two disks
2 then upgrade to 1.6 table with two disks
3 then finally upgrade to 1.6 system with two disks.
The procedure is identical for each set of two disks.

Do not upgrade the keyboard if there are any risks of power cuts.
Double click each file in turn with a freshly formatted floppy in the A drive. Click Write/Start, close program when floppy stops writing and label disk.

It is VITAL to check each set of disks in the keyboard before attempting an upgrade.

1 insert disk 1 of a 2 disk set
2 hold down panel memories 1, 2, 3 and 4
3 switch on
4 release panel memories when screen appears
5 press checkdsk in screen
6 confirm with check in screen
7 swap with disk2 when screen prompts
8 wait for OK in screen
9 switch off

if each set of disks pass the test only then proceed to upgrade:

1 insert disk 1 of a 2 disk set
2 hold down panel memories 1, 2, 3 and 4
3 switch on
4 release panel memories when screen appears
5 press update in screen
6 confirm with update in screen
7 swap with disk2 when screen prompts
8 wait for OK in screen
9 switch off

again do 1.4 table first, then 1.6 table, then 1.6 system.

after the upgrade try a hard reset:
switch off
hold down 60s&70s, Mod Dance, Soul&RB rhythm buttons and switch on.

let's hope it's not a hardware fault but this should confirm if it is.

Hi all,

Concerning the KN7000 firmware version, I have the following questions:

1. What is the procedure to check the current kn7000 firmware version?

2. Version 1.6 versus version 1.3, what are the main enhancements in the 1.6 versions?

P.s. Kennykay, thanks for sharing this with us.

Cheers,
Doron

check firmware: hold down piano, guitar, mallet buttons and switch on.
improvements, the vast majority of users never even noticed: bitmaps for home page loading, SD % corrected, backup inf on SD, a couple of advanced technichords improved, audio on SD etc.

Dear Technicsplayer

Thanks so very much for the 6 files you emailed to me. However, I am having problems using the files. I really don't know where - if its the case - I'm going wrong. Or could it be that the files were not emailed in the correct format.

As you instructed, I double-clicked on each of the files and saved each of them onto a floppy disk. I must mention that each of them saved as .imz file just as you emailed them. But when I insert disk one onto my Kn7, hold down panel memory 1,2,3,4 at the same time and switch on, the keyboard simply comes on normally. There is no opportunity showing for me to press checkdsk as you instructed. And as soon as the keyboard comes on normally, nothing else happens.

I thought maybe the files were not saved properly, and I went back, double-clicked each again and re-saved each of them on floppy disks - and still the same result - with the Kn7 just coming on normally when switched on while holding down panel meory 1,2,3,4. I thought maybe I should save each of them as .exe file. I did that, and tried each of them again following your instruction and nothing happens.

Please may I know if they are suppoed to be zip files which need to be extracted. Or as mentioned above, could it be that they were not emailed to me in the correct format. And if so, could you kindly resend them to me in the correct format, please.


Thank you.

Kenny

the exe was removed by a server even though it was in a zip. Rename to exe and try again

Wow Kenny, I tried to duplicate your problem and just couldn't quite do it. First I went into Technichord and switched Right 1 to block then on to the mixer, page 5, and ran the key shift down to a -12. Then I went back to the keyboard and listened to the nasty sound it produced, but it was awful through the three octave range I use for my right hand playing, and not just a one octave range in the middle. Tell ya what, if the advice Alex gave you doesn't help, you may need to go over your keyboard step by step, page by page to find out what isn't working. I would imagine a reset to default settings would do the trick, but apparently that isn't working. Try contacting whoever you got the keyboard from and see if they had the same problem. Maybe they just got rid of a lemon. One thing you may want to try out is to load in a style from a disk and see if it plays okay. If it does, then contact the forum again and your problem will probably get resolved. This place is good for that!

Dear Bud

Thanks for your posted suggestions and concern. I shall try any suggestion that can help resolve my disturbing experience with my Kn7.

What you can do for me, please - chose any of the rhthym accompaniments (say 16bt) and for the R1 voicing choose say Fantasia from PAD. Press the APC button to turn it on and press START. Under the APC mode, press the button and set all three modes to ON (i.e. Basic, Fingered, etc.) and move back the highliter to BASIC mode. With all this set, play any song on Key C to accompany the rhthym accompaniment. And with your left hand playing the three-chord keys under C i.e. C, F and G, try at the same time to play with your right hand and check the sounds you get from playing any of the 12 notes starting from the Middle C note upwards. With my KN7, those notes sound so very deep, you seldom hear them when the accompaniment is on with the APC switched on and the left hand is used to play the CFG keys at the lower end. But if you play any of the notes (after the 12th note from Middle C), they sound clear and OK. Also, if you switch off the APC button - with the rhthym accompaniment still going on, those same 12 notes from the Middle C sound very clear. You could please go through this carefully and check it out for me on your own KN7.

The other thing is that could you let me know what your equalizer settings are so I could try replicating that on my KN7 to be sure it is not from that setting.

In the meantime, if there is a Forum member in London who can provide me with their email address< I could contact them and arrange to meet up with my KN7 and check out theirs alongside mine to determine the cause of the porblem I am having.

Thanks so much.

Kenny

Dear Technicsplayer

Thank you very much for all your help. I received the files you sent and followed the instructions you gave, and I was able to upgrade my KN7 to version 1.6. You have been very patient and kind. And I am grateful to you and to all the members of this Forum.

I am still battling with the problem of the deep and bassy sound around the Middle C area of my KN7 when the APC button is switched on. I am willing to try a number of things to find the solution to the problem. If it was a hardware or system problem, I suppose the upgrade process would have detected it. It may be that the original owner went through some settings that I am currently unable to figure out - although I wonder if that could be the case. This is so because even when I initialise the keyboad, and proceed to make my playing selections and start playing,I still experience the same thing very deep bassy sounds around the Middle C area.

If everything else fails, I may have to seek to meet up with some Forum member here in London who has a KN7 and who may be willing to help, so that I can check out mine alongside that persons.

Again, thanks for being so wonderful. And if you have further suggestions that might help me to solve this problem, please do not hesitate to let me know.

Regards.

Kenny

you're very welcome.

I'm still not clear what the exact problem is whether the right hand voice or the balance in the accompaniment... but you could try this:

1 Initialise the 7k
2 choose 16Bt standard
3 press and hold one touch play
4 the split point should be C3 as seen on the keyboard (middle led)
5 choose fantasia as the R1 voice
6 don't start the rhythm
7 play C3 to C4 as seen on keyboard and the sound will be too low, this is normal because you can easily run out of notes playing this far down
8 play C4 to C5, this is a more natural range for this voice and is the intended playing area
9 switch off APC and the voice moves down the keyboard an octave, ie the same keys play an octave higher.

this is a design intention and does not constitute a fault. APC will shift the octave of the right hand automatically on some voices to make the pitch in the playing area more useful, it depends on the setup and voice chosen. If the R1 voice is too low and you want to play in that area of keyboard that is what the R1/R2 octave shift is for.

Sorry Kenny, still couldn't duplicate your problem. The sounds were lower, but not obnoxious. More like what Alex told you to expect. My equalizer settings are usually factory default and change only when I need to tweak a sound or another style load forces a change. You didn't say if a loaded style made any difference.

Hi technicsplayer

I am a new forum member. I've been following the posted notes on this forum and realize that you have been very helpful to members and that you have very good knowledge of the KN7. Thats nice of you indeed.

Could you or anyone please help. I have some of the original preset rhythms of KN5000. I loaded one of it - Soul Rock on our KN7, but when I hit play, it sounds very funny and rough on the KN7 whereas that rhythmn sounds beautiful and smooth on the KN5000. Do you have an idea why this is so. If you have the KN5000 or if you have the original Soul Rock rhythm file from KN5000, you could load it on your KN7 and check this please. It doesn't sound as good and smooth on the KN7 as on the KN5000.

I also observe that some of the KN7 rhythms when you play them they are not smooth; their timing is a bit rough compared to the rhythms on the KN5000 which we are trying to discard. And I am now hesitating.

Kindly help and clarify these points, please. Are there any particular settings to make all these sound better with correct timing? Appreciate your kind suggestions.

Buddy

Hi Buddy and welcome to the Forum

Some of the styles from previous KN series do require 'tweaking' to operate successfully on the KN7000.
Before the demise of Technics Musical Division, there was a website which included all the built-in styles from the previous KN series (KN2000,3000,5000,6x00) available for free download. All these styles had been edited (tweaked) to make them more compatible with the KN7000 and I believe this mammoth task was undertaken by 'technicsplayer'
Unfortunately, the website no longer exists but you can download the complete set of these styles from my website: http://www.willumspages.co.uk/page8.html They are in SD Card Backup (.SDB) format and you will need an SD card with minimum capacity of 64MB and a suitable card reader/writer. The file transfer can be carried out using your KN7000 and the USB link, but the process will take a very long time, using this method.

------------------
Willum

Hi Buddy,
I had a quick listen to the 5k soul rock on the 7k and could not really hear the problem, but I no longer have a 5k to compare it with. Vars 1 and 2 need a little care with timing because of the syncopated rhythm, but as soon as the snare comes in on var3 it's very easy. You don't say where you got your versions from but if you leave your email address I can send my versions of the rhythms you are interested in for comparison

Hi Willum

Thanks for those helpful suggestions. I do not own any SD card. may be I shall invest in that sometime in the future. Technicsplayer has promised to send me the styles, I believe in floppies to make it easy for me to load onto my KN7. When receive them, I shall certainly follow the instructions on how to tweak them and be able to load them into Customs for my use. I also visited your site and there are very interesting stuff there too.

Thanks for everything.

Buddy

Hi Technicsplayer

Thank you for taking time to consider the issue that I raised. A very important observation that you made is the point about timing. That is a problem that I have observed with some of the preset rhythms in KN7 and a some others transferred from other previous version eg. the KN5000 (the var 1 & 2 timing in the Soul Rock which you observed is one good example). You said it is because of the syncopated rhythm. If I choose to play on either var 1 or var 2 of that rhythm, do you have any suggestion on how to deal with and correct and straighten the timing.

In addition, I'll be glad if you would send me the KN5000 styles. If you have the time to include instructions on how I can correctly load them into Custom,it will be appreciated. There were quite some very good styles in the KN6 series. If you have them and can email same also to me, that will be great. My email address is kayskwed@btinternet.com.

Thanks and Regards

Buddy

Hi Buddy,
files are sent. I could have sent all customs but you would have to re-arrange them yourself so sent floppy disks. Servers baulk at exe files in zips nowadays so unzip and rename each of the 10 disks exe. Then just double click each with a blank floppy loaded and follow the pop up.

Each style has the first 4 panel memories as start points. To copy to custom press Program Menus, Composer, Custom Style Copy, the default direction is composer to custom, just dial up a custom slot number and press OK. Once in custom you can press Music Style Arranger and the Variation buttons will change the preset registrations.



practise?

Hi Technicsplayer

I received the KN5000 and KN6000/6500 files. Thanks immensely for your help. You are very kind. And thanks also to all our SynthZone friends who have helped with suggestions. I appreciate you all.

Cheers

Buddy

you're very welcome