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#310309 - 03/26/10 11:29 PM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
Bachus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 6759
Quote:
Originally posted by abacus:


A similar evolving process occurs with hardware boards; however you have to buy a complete new board to obtain the updated features.

Example:
Users of a Ketron SD1 have to buy a new Audya to get all that it offers, whereas in an open keyboard you just have to buy the new software (Many software updates are free) to give you all the latest features and sounds.



There is one flaw in your reasonning Bill...

At some point in time you will need to upgrade your hardware of your open system to use the latest features.

But this cost much less then buying a new TOTL arranger. Also you can keep all your old stuff, performances and styles and don't need months to et up your new piece of hardware for your performances, its still all there on a software arranger but it includes new stuff and feautures.
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#310310 - 03/27/10 01:43 AM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
spalding1968 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/19/08
Posts: 1234
Loc: United Kingdom
I dont think that this is a fair comparrison as you are not taking into account all the man hours that you have to put in just to make the open keyboard mirror the ease of use of a closed system each time you upgrade the software. You are also ignoring the resale value of your hardware when you upgrade from one closed keyboard to the next. I think if you were to take into consideration all the factors, the the real cost margins in terms of both time and money would be much much closer and maybe even cheaper under the closed system keyboards. Thats with the understanding that your time is valuable and that tinkering with applications to try and make music is not actually making music (which is what i as a musician prefer to do) Just my opinion folks.

Obviously the advantage of the open system is that you can custom make your instrument do what you like.....if you have the technical ability and essentially , access to help and support from experts. The main selling proposition of the Open labs business model is that they give their customers access to a technical support helpline. If the MS ever goes mainstream Dom will certainly need to do this. whilst he is available to personally answer your queries it does nopt take much imagination to see the dificulties he might face if you the MS take up really increased

[This message has been edited by spalding1968 (edited 03-27-2010).]

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#310311 - 03/27/10 02:38 AM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
abacus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 4907
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Hi Spalding
I see where you are coming from, but to take Wersi as a case, until the Apollo was launched they had never produced an OTB instrument in their entire 40 year history, (They worked on the premise that if you were spending this type of money, you would be experienced not a beginner) and users that bought Wersi knew this, and bought them because of this, as well as liking the sound.

This is why I say there are 2 camps, one like yourself are happy to go along with what the manufacture provides, (And there is nothing wrong with that) and one like me, who do not like to be dictated to by the manufacture.(Its purely personal choice)

Hi Tony
My instrument can be seen here http://www.wersiabacus.plus.com/ (I just have the keyboard)

Bill


[This message has been edited by abacus (edited 03-27-2010).]
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#310312 - 03/27/10 02:58 AM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
Tony Hughes Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/30/06
Posts: 3930
Quote:
Originally posted by abacus:
Hi Spalding
I see where you are coming from, but to take Wersi as a case, until the Apollo was launched they had never produced an OTB instrument in their entire 40 year history, (They worked on the premise that if you were spending this type of money, you would be experienced not a beginner) and users that bought Wersi knew this, and bought them because of this, as well as liking the sound.

This is why I say there are 2 camps, one like yourself are happy to go along with what the manufacture provides, (And there is nothing wrong with that) and one like me, who do not like to be dictated to by the manufacture.(Its purely personal choice)

Hi Tony
My instrument can be seen here http://www.wersiabacus.plus.com/ (I just have the keyboard)

Bill


[This message has been edited by abacus (edited 03-27-2010).]


Bill,

What a fantastic theatre sound do you want to swap for the Audya.

Just heard it on youtube

Thanks Bill,
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#310313 - 03/27/10 08:48 AM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
Irishacts Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1631
Loc: Ireland
Quote:
Originally posted by miden:
I repeat my request to James..m8, can you please start another thread?

This one is shot..

Dennis


If you feel it's needed I really don't mind. I could easily start a new one when I post my next video. I think it's only wishful thinking though that one won't go the same direction unless people are very vocal about keeping things on topic when someone tries to do the opposite.

Overall this one has gone down far better than any other thread on this subject before and I think we have made great progress here. There's lots of information in what's been posted and I think people were enjoying reading the content. Shame it's going off topic now though.

Regards
James

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#310314 - 03/27/10 09:18 AM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
Gunnar Jonny Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 04/01/01
Posts: 4013
Loc: Norway
Maybe Nigel could filter out a bit so the tread are more
into the original topic?
And then of course, we have to behave ourselves and keep it that way.

James,
I'm looking forward to the future reports, keep on the good work!

Thanks.
GJ
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#310315 - 03/27/10 10:39 AM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Quote:
Originally posted by spalding1968:
I dont think that this is a fair comparrison as you are not taking into account all the man hours that you have to put in just to make the open keyboard mirror the ease of use of a closed system each time you upgrade the software. You are also ignoring the resale value of your hardware when you upgrade from one closed keyboard to the next. I think if you were to take into consideration all the factors, the the real cost margins in terms of both time and money would be much much closer and maybe even cheaper under the closed system keyboards.

That's with the understanding that your time is valuable and that tinkering with applications to try and make music is not actually making music (which is what I as a musician prefer to do) Just my opinion folks.


Perfectly put, spalding. Many of us would like to keep the time we have got primarily on actually PLAYING, rather than programming. Learning new tunes, drumming up work, all of these take time. Every minute spent debugging or converting styles to run on non-native soundsets is time away from these things...

And yes, even as long as I keep them, most of my 'upgrade' arranger purchases have cost me very little amortized over the years I've had them due to the care I take of them and their consequent used value. To be honest, most people I know who keep fairly current with their computer systems have spent FAR more than me over the last decade or so upgrading and swapping out computers to keep up to date. And used computer parts and even whole out of date computers have VERY little resale value. A fully working arranger in good working order, if kept in good condition, is still worth a fair percentage of its' original cost... But you can hardly GIVE away a five or six (or ten!) year old computer!

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#310316 - 03/27/10 10:58 AM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
Bachus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 6759
Somehow most of James's post tells us how easy the mediastation is to opperate and to optimise..

And as time goed by this feature becomes only better...

So part of Spaldings comments is cought up by the mediastations development team and time in general.
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http://keyszone.boards.net

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#310317 - 03/27/10 12:02 PM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
Magica Alfa Offline
Member

Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 259
MS is easy for use. That is fact.

You can contribute to this topic as you want. But only as user you will see that this is much more better instrument than other.

I Was this year on MUSIC MESSE.
There is only one part developing things.
And this are VST instruments.
Future is coming really fast

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#310318 - 03/27/10 12:57 PM Re: Lionstracs Mediastation arrived today.
miden Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 3353
Loc: The World
Quote:
Originally posted by Irishacts:
If you feel it's needed I really don't mind. I could easily start a new one when I post my next video. I think it's only wishful thinking though that one won't go the same direction unless people are very vocal about keeping things on topic when someone tries to do the opposite.

Overall this one has gone down far better than any other thread on this subject before and I think we have made great progress here. There's lots of information in what's been posted and I think people were enjoying reading the content. Shame it's going off topic now though.

Regards
James


James, imo it has gone MAJORLY off topic and is now getting filled with drivel.

Trouble is that a lot of your earlier posts ( great posts too ) are now pretty well hidden, with not a lot of continuity because of many subsequent posts are not even remotely related to the direct operation of the MS.

A casual observer looking to glean quality info from someone who is taking the time to provide a comprehensive analysis of this system, would be turned off by about page 2 I reckon.

I do not know if the software behind this webiste can allow it, but maybe Nigel can give you a restricted licence to actually remove the dross, and leave the relevant information intact....

Dennis

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