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#294139 - 09/22/10 01:07 PM Why are brands and models so important to us?
captain Russ Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 6659
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
I was looking around over the week-end at a bunch of instruments in the warehouse on my annual, pathetic effort to "trim the fat".

Looked at lots of basses, banjos, guitars, vibes, keyboards, etc.

It occurred to me that, prior to joining the "zone", none of the people I was associated with in the music business EVER had the kind of heated, passionate discussions about the brands and models of instruments they played, with other players.

As you know, sometimes, it gets a little "heated" around here, to say the least.

Guitar players, bass players, drummers and horn players have their preferences, naturally, but that's mostly related to style preferences and comfort with particular instruments. They HARDLY EVER argue that "theirs is the best", or put down what others play like people sometimes do here.

Is that because arranger players are so dependent on the specific "missing band members" features of the arranger?

Is that because OMB ego's take over?

Is that because of the anonymous nature of internet communications?

Just strikes me as being odd, and sometimes really sad!

Russ

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#294140 - 09/22/10 01:10 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
Dnj Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 38655
Loc: NJ
Russ sorry but I wont even touch this ...
it has "EGOFEST" written all over it. when you talk brand loyalty after laying out mucho bucks your gonna get major defensive ego driven mine is the best right or wrong replies every time.

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 09-22-2010).]

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#294141 - 09/22/10 01:26 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
captain Russ Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 6659
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
Donny, I hope not, because that was certainly not the intent.

I'm hoping for some intelligent looks at interactions between a group of folks united by a common bond.

I want to understand the issue better and don't have the answers others may have.

Don't see why ego's need to have anything to do with this one.


R.

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#294142 - 09/22/10 01:32 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10581
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by captain Russ:

Is that because arranger players are so dependent on the specific "missing band members" features of the arranger?

Is that because OMB ego's take over?

Is that because of the anonymous nature of internet communications?

Just strikes me as being odd, and sometimes really sad!

Russ



Russ, many forums are as colorful as SZ...just check out Piano World or some of the guitar sites.

SZ is not a brand specific forum, and the heated exchanges seem to be a natural part of this type of forum

Non-specific brand automotive forums are much the same...GM vs Ford, Honda vs Toyota, Yugo vs Ketron...er, scratch that last one...Ketron don't make cars...yet.

Just don't say anything you wouldn't say to a person face to face...that's usually a good rule.

Threatening remarks, racist comments, and foul language have no place on any forum, in my opinion.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#294143 - 09/22/10 01:44 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
captain Russ Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 6659
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
Ian, I'm sure you're right. I don't frequent any other forums, so I've never seen the "back and forth" you're describing. Since my boy and I restore and show old scooters and cars, I can imagine how heated some of those sites can get.

I guess I need to "look around" a little to see what's up and how people interact with each other.

You'd think someone who teaches interpersonal communications could have figured that one out.

My frame of reference was players of other instruments and direct contact with them, not interaction with them on websites dedicated to specific instruments, styles, etc.

Ian, what you tell me makes a whole lot of sense. It's a little embarrassing that I didn't see the obvious.

Thanks,

Russ

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#294144 - 09/22/10 02:43 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10581
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Russ, you have always been the perfect gentleman on this forum.

I admire your restraint and sense of fair play.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#294145 - 09/22/10 03:00 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Yeah, Russ, before you start thinking that SZ is an isolated example of 'brand-ism' you REALLY need to get out on the web and realize that, for all the shenanigans that makes you roll your eyes, quite honestly, it's a pretty tame place compared to MANY. One of the advantages of mostly being elderly people, I guess!

Trust me, if you think THIS place gets infantile, you have NO IDEA how bad it gets, out there!

One of the things that drives the 'brand-ism' here also is just HOW related brand and capability are... On a guitar forum, well, guitars are all pretty much the same! (See how even that simplistic statement can get a guitarist a bit heated up! ). But guitars, they pretty much ALL got frets, six strings, pickups, tuners, you name it. Doesn't stop some pretty heated exchanges, single coil vs. hummmers, vintage vs. new, etc..

But arrangers have some wildly different approaches, even form factors, very different capabilities, and sometimes even a whole different demographic they are supposed to appeal to. Throw them ALL in the same mix, you are going to get friction...

Compared to most forums, to be honest, SZ is a sea of tranquility!

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#294146 - 09/22/10 03:19 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
Taike Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/28/02
Posts: 2665
Loc: Taiwan-Laos-China
I don't care about brand at all. If it has keys, I'm interested. Simple as that.

Not one brand has it all and I don't want to waste my time and effort to try each and every sound/style on different keyboards for even then it would get me nowhere. So it's fair to say that I like whatever that's out there. Then again, I am the kind of player who just wants to sit down and play. Happiness is in the playing and not the anatomy of an instrument.

"Guitar players, bass players, drummers and horn players have their preferences, naturally, but that's mostly related to style preferences and comfort with particular instruments. They HARDLY EVER argue that "theirs is the best", or put down what others play like people sometimes do here."

I totally agree.

Taike

------------------
Bo pen nyang.

[This message has been edited by Taike (edited 09-22-2010).]
_________________________
Those that cry "freedom" often are the oppressors.

Science can't explain everything, but religion can't explain anything.

Those that are free don't have the need to mention it about every 5 minutes.

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#294147 - 09/22/10 03:41 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
captain Russ Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 6659
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
I'm going to look around at some guitar sites this week-end. Diki, when you said all guitars are quite the same, I tended to agree with you. But when you started mentioning the possibility of arguing single pole vs. humbuckers, set necks vs. neck-through's or other arrangements...there are probably lots of dweebs out there arguing on line, just as arranger folks do.

I think that the comparison I was making was me sitting face to face-side by side with a fellow player. I was thinking guitar, but the instrument may not make much difference. That same courteous person could conceivably
become a raging monster on a site where he/she would be anonymous.

Looks like I need to get out more.

And Ian, on the times when you got your "back up" a little, I understood why.

IT'S PROBABLY FRUSTRATION AT HAVING TO PLAY THOSE DAMN PLASTIC TOY YAMAHA HOME KEYBOARDS
ALL THE TIME (LOL)! (SERIOUS Kidding here, folks, of course)! Ian, I have enjoyed our limited but substantive contact-thanks!

Best to all!

Russ

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#294148 - 09/22/10 03:56 PM Re: Why are brands and models so important to us?
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
I am convinced that there isn't a single one of us here at SZ that, if we meet a fellow member face to face wouldn't get on with them like a house on fire. We have FAR more in common than we have differences

I would be honored to meet Ian, TTG, Spalding, Kingfrog, even Donny , should I ever have the opportunity. It's simply the nature of the written form, and forums in general, that makes the tone so combative. A smile, a wink, face to face they make even the most blatant statement less combative, more tongue in cheek... Sadly, emoticons don't seem to take as much sting out of a statement than seeing someone do it!

Add to that so many different styles and abilities to articulate your opinion, and often we find ourselves arguing, even when, at the core, we probably agree! I know my wordy formal tone and cut and dry writing style often gets people's backs up no matter WHAT I write, but I'm afraid I don't like the idea of stooping to incoherent, badly spelled ungrammatical English, just to fit in, sometimes..!

We've also got a fairly rare thing, a complete mixture of amateur and pro, stellar player and tyro, all mixed up with often no idea who is who. It's hardly surprising that misunderstandings, or utterly different viewpoints often crop up...

I tried, I honestly did, to give this place a rest, but it didn't last long. Talking about arrangers and music (very occasionally!) is so much FUN... We used to be a nation of letters 100 years ago, and written communication was the primary means of information exchange. This is sadly what that has devolved into, but I GUESS that's progress..?!

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