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#248781 - 11/25/08 04:58 AM
Re: Yamaha Stagea ELS-01C..WOOOWWWEEE!!!!!!!
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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Diki.., do you have to stand in front of a 2008 Maybach to know it's better than the top end Mercedes Sedan? Same corp. that builds the two cars..., both high end luxury vehicles.., both look similiar (long and short base models).., but one clearly is built better, sounds better and performs better.
Can't you apply the same principle to these two Rolands...??? Couldn't you look at say the E-80 and G-70 as the higher end Mercedes Sedans.., and the top Roland Organ as the Maybach of the Roland line?
[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 11-25-2008).]
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GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#248785 - 11/25/08 06:52 AM
Re: Yamaha Stagea ELS-01C..WOOOWWWEEE!!!!!!!
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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You also have to take production cost into consideration here as well. I can only imagine the difference in cost between Roland's high end Organ.., and the E80/G70.
Cases like this aren't apples and oranges. It's more the difference of apples and potatos!
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GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#248786 - 11/25/08 05:20 PM
Re: Yamaha Stagea ELS-01C..WOOOWWWEEE!!!!!!!
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Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14239
Loc: NW Florida
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I believe in my ears alone... No hype, no smoke and mirrors, no bull. The only thing a Mibach gives you over a regular car is exclusivity. A car is a tool to get you from A to B. Above a certain point of quality, all these vast increases buy you is something your neighbor can't afford, but doesn't need. His tool to get from A to B is equally as good as yours. You merely spent ten times as much as him, to get a perhaps a 10% increase in comfort. The other 90% you spent was ego, pure and simple. Wealthy retirees are constantly paying through the nose to one up their rivals. And getting little for it except vanity. OK, OK, I'l concede that perhaps the Atelier MIGHT be a bit better than a G70! But not TEN TIMES BETTER (3 grand versus thirty). And, like I said, if you can't tell something that costs ten times more than something else from a factory demo (a good one, at that!) then you are wasting your money. I can't tell ANY difference from the demo. And, if you weren't just hell bent on trying to justify the obscene prices of these barely better hulking arrangers, you MIGHT admit that you can't hear it too (unless you are in it's august majesty's presence)... Give it a rest, guys... you can HEAR the difference between a 2 grand E60 and a 3 grand G70... But you CAN'T hear the difference between a 3 grand G70 and a 30 grand Atelier. Waste your kids inheritance for all I care (they are going to depreciate faster than a Mibach, that's for sure!) but don't try to persuade me there's a difference I can't hear... Anyone ever hear the term 'diminishing returns'? [This message has been edited by Diki (edited 11-25-2008).]
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An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!
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#248789 - 11/26/08 06:10 AM
Re: Yamaha Stagea ELS-01C..WOOOWWWEEE!!!!!!!
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Member
Registered: 11/02/07
Posts: 90
Loc: Rimini, Italy
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Just to add another bit of info to the discussion, and my opinion on prices:
Some years ago, during the usual Roland expo, they offered me the Atelier they had on display there for around € 8.000, it was the AT90S (the next year the AT60SL came out). At that price I was somewhat tempted to get it, comparing its sounds to the current arranger I had at the time (VA-7), but... after considering the pratically absent market these beast have in Italy, I ended up refusing the offer.
So just consider the price drop these things have, from € 30.000 after some years you're lucky if you are able to sell them at less than € 8.000...
The AT-900C costs around 15.000 euros, without pedalboard, if it would cost around € 8.000 WITH pedalboard, perhaps I could consider buying one... but the dead market question remains. It seems in Italy nobody want to study or play organs anymore (apart from classical ones).
[This message has been edited by mrdave (edited 11-26-2008).]
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