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#213058 - 03/01/01 07:48 AM Top End Arranger Keybords Misunderstood.......
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 42582
The Yamaha PSR9000 that I play professionally and Most top of the line units are much-misinterpreted keyboards. When I hear people say these sounds are better or these styles are better I just laugh inside because in the last 2 months I have dissected this keyboard like no other (due to fantastic Fully Programable Mixing Capabilities in every catagory). Feature by feature I have tweaked, voices, styles like no other keyboard I have ever owned (and I have had alot), you'd be surprised at the difference adjusting harmonic content, delays, filters, chorus, etc will do to a style, like taking a stock Solo Trumpet that sounds like a Harmonica and making it sound like Al Hirt 's horn, (Tip) most are defaulted FLAT (64) and NEED these adjustments. Fully edited midis, assembled different parts from other styles (mix & match) and also recorded new parts within a style,tweak Vocalizer setting parameters, import sampled sounds into the mix as custom voices, created totally new styles from scratch track by track when you need that special riff,listen to other keyboard syles and get ideas to create your own, recorded new real-time Multipad sequences (awesome) to be used in the mix, and too many other things to discuss in one post. But what I am saying is, don't be fooled into thinking that an arranger keyboard alone will do all the work for you. Just saying what's better is the problem we face in some of these threads. Playing is one thing, being a good musician who can take a keyboard and listen to things and make adjustments to make it sound better or to suit your taste is a big part of the Arranger keyboard overall experience. If you just play out of the box with default settings you are missing the boat on what these units are all about in my opinion. Take the time to go over every feature whether you use all them or just a few to get that special mix, don't be afraid to turn a few knobs and see what happens? Most manufactures DON'T know what you like in regards to "YOUR SPECIAL SOUND" they just give you a middle ground to work with as a foundation to build on. Most Top units can do these things, some do them in a different way and that also is a consideration to what feels comfortable when you're navigating and playing it. So during the next "What's Better" frenzy remember this post and it will sooth the beast!!

Play Music Every day…………

Donny NJ



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-01-2001).]

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#213059 - 03/01/01 09:49 AM Re: Top End Arranger Keybords Misunderstood.......
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
I agree that playing 'out the box' with these KBS limits the potential sounds of these arranger keyboards. Admittedly, playing out of the box is much much easier and less time consuming but if you take the time (as Donny is doing) to explore the KBs many editing features, you can really customize the sounds/styles/EFX and tailor them to your own personal tastes and needs.

I hardly ever play my Technics KN5000 'out of the box'. Because I have the optional hard drive installed, I have hundreds of customized setups tailored for specific songs and/or specific song styles. I use the keyboard's panel memory registrations to store customized settings for each part of the song (AABA, solo instrumentals, EFX, sound patch orthestrations, etc) as well, and then use a foot controller pedal to move thru these custom panel memorys thru out the song.

Some of you have asked me why I have not upgraded to the newest current model keyboards (Technics KN6500, Yamaha 9000pro, Solton SD1) yet. One big reason I haven't is because of the many weeks/months/hours I have spent in setting up my show repetoire songs on my trusty KN5000. It would take a long time to convert or set up from scratch all the material I have customized on my KN5000 already to another keyboard.

Instead, I have spent more time exploring my KN5000's editing capabilities and importing other arranger keyboard brand styles (via EMC style converter and SMF to style converter) to gain fresh new styles and customized sounds without having to spend any money.By editing these sounds/styles, I have been able to gain new keyboard sounds/styles on my KN5000. Of course I still would love to own a Solton SD-1, Yamaha 9000pro, and a Technics KN6500. I played them all and they ALL sound fantastic, but the bottom line is to remember that most all of the mid range to high end arranger keyboards made in the last few years offer the essential sounds/styles/features required to make great music. We just need to spend more time exploring the features we have in our current keyboards and MOST IMPORTANTLY, spending MORE time playing and practicing.

Happy arranger keyboarding to all,

Scott
http://scottyee.com
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#213060 - 03/01/01 10:04 AM Re: Top End Arranger Keybords Misunderstood.......
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 42582
Hi,

Another good thing to do is to find a friend close by who uses the Same Exact keyboard as you and get together once or twice a month to
brainstorm and share playing experiences,operational skills, playing tips etc. I assure you 2 heads are much better then one and you will learn about things within your arranger unit that you might never have tried, or thought to try. Try it!

Donny NJ

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 03-01-2001).]

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#213061 - 03/01/01 05:04 PM Re: Top End Arranger Keybords Misunderstood.......
MisterEd Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/17/01
Posts: 5
Don & Scott,

I agree completely with your advise (I have a PSR9000), but I do have a Couple of questions. Don, how did you get the great trumpet sound I can't seem to find the secret?? Also, I can never seem to get a clear undistorted sound using the vocal harmonizer. Any suggestions??

I appreciate any help you can give me. Keep the postings coming. It's great hearing ideas and opinions from other Keyboardist.

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#213062 - 03/02/01 12:45 PM Re: Top End Arranger Keybords Misunderstood.......
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 42582
mr ed.

Try playing around with Solo Trumpet in R1 by going into the Mixer and changing the hall reverb in dsp(1) to delay l/r and fine tuning the effect depth, adjusting the harmonic content, brightness, chourus, low/hi eq, etc. This takes time and good ears but you will see how much better it will sound. I suggest that you also put Solo Trumpet into R2 and go back and forth to compare default to your edited version. Once you get the correct sound write down your steps and use that as a stencil to edit any sound you wish.You can make those harmonica sounding high end trumpets sound robust and full for sure. This is the beauty of the PSR9000.

good luck

Donny NJ

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#213063 - 03/02/01 04:55 PM Re: Top End Arranger Keybords Misunderstood.......
MisterEd Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/17/01
Posts: 5
Don,

Thanks for the info. I will give it a try this weekend. Especially good idea putting the same sound in R2 for comparison.

Have you tried creating custom voice with solo trumpet as starting point? I haven't been in this section yet, but I will try after changing mixing console settings.

Thanks again.

Ed - NY

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#213064 - 03/02/01 05:54 PM Re: Top End Arranger Keybords Misunderstood.......
Eric, B Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/15/99
Posts: 1959
Loc: Ventura, Ca, USA
Hi Donny,
I also agree with you. It took me a long time (several month) before my Psr-8000 half-way sounded the way I wanted it. I also agree with Scott that this was one of the reasons why I waited so long before I bought the Pro, which I love now.
As Donny said it would be good to get together with someone in your area, which I also agree with, but I also think that there is an awesome bunch of people on this forum, that we can share specific info with.
For example: Yamaha uses a lot the 60's Guitar in their styles wich is kind of soft.
If I want a rockier sound I'll change it to Solid Guitar and adjust the DSP accordingly.
Another example: If you choose a style that has a Dance Kit as default, try revoicing it with the Rock Kit. It will sound totally 80's, because of the dance kit effects.
Hope this helps. Have fun trying new things.
Eric

[This message has been edited by Eric, B (edited 03-02-2001).]
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Genos, PSR-S970, TC Helicon VoiceLive3, Mackie 802-VLZ3 Mixer, 2 Bose L1 Compact, Electro-Voice ZXA1 Subwoofer

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