http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxZCjt3aKXs


you can do this on your arranger KB unit also easily.

I hope they don't think the so called
"HOME ARRANGER PLAYERS" can't do it..

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-03-2010).]

I guess by the non response no one even interested to go thru the trouble of making their own songs when they have styles already made for them? THis is why there will never be a bonding of the two Arranger/Workstation synth.

Donny,

I realize the point you are trying to make but the lack of response may be due to the video clip you selected. Your point would be far better made if the the keyboard used was an arranger keyboard. It's fine to say that "an arranger keyboard can do that too" but then the proof should be made using an arranger keyboard. Does that make sense?

So my suggestion is to hook up your video camera, aim it at the arranger keyboard of your choice and have at it. Then post the results here.

------------------
Wm. David McMahan
The Modulators

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BU3sfuBbdTc&feature=related


Technics KN7000



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-03-2010).]

Donny,

Come on! At 26 seconds into this video, the creator states 'over 50 tracks of audio'. I'm pretty sure that the KN7000 didn't have 50 tracks of recording, much less audio recording. And I also don't remember the KN7000 having a built-in 8 channel mixer with 100mm automated faders and 8 analog VU meters.

Seriously, make you own video and be done with it.

------------------
Wm. David McMahan
The Modulators

Donny is the King... the YOUTUBE King..

Dave don�t know what the heck this guy on the video is doing...but I've sequenced songs more then I like to remember thru the years using Synths & Arrangers alike.....I am not a teacher & never had patience for it....but I will tell you this it requires procedures & time, effort, and knowledge playing all the parts/efx correctly to achieve a successful project. My point was to bring to light that we all have the tools within our arrangers to do multitrack recordings & to create our own styles also so why not take advantaged�..you just have top indulge yourself, dig into the OS and have fun creating..

OK Donny, I recorded two short little videos this morning before I left to go to work. The quality isn't great, I know; I didn't have time to go direct audio, set up proper lighting, etc. so PLEASE don't complain. There are also a few klunkers, but again this was quick and dirty.

Three separate tracks

Playing with style



------------------
Wm. David McMahan
The Modulators

Thanks for the video clips, Dave. Especially enjoyed the Yardbird Suite.

Taike

------------------
Bo pen nyang.

Dave,
Nicely done...
AND it as simple as that!
Nice chops!

Donny, I still do not know what part of the Korg OS you think is to many button pushes..
My gosh...Dave just did a 3 track, multitrack record and it looked pretty simple to me??

Most everything has a shift key shortcut.

Lee S.

That was awesome, Dave!

Those weighted keys didn't slow you down one bit, did they?


-mike

Thanks Taike, Lee and Mike,

As soon as I get the time (maybe over the weekend) I will record a tune with more than 3 tracks, and try to get a good screen shot so the entire process is visible. On the separate track video from this morning, the only thing I did prior to actually recording was to pre-select the bass, piano and drum sounds that I wanted to use and set the tempo which took all of about 6 seconds. From there it was press Record and go, just like you see in the video. It really couldn't be much easier.

[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 11-04-2010).]

You're welcome, Dave. I'm more interested in hearing (seeing) you play on your XK3, though.

Taike


------------------
Bo pen nyang.

I agree that the fellow did a nice job on the video. Nothing really all that amazing technically with the help of a computer these days, but he is certainly a good player and arranger.

And we are in agreement that many arranger/workstation owners barely touch the surface of the capabilities of their instruments. If more time was spent learning how to use the workstation functions of the higher-end arranger keyboards as opposed to trying to convert and horde every new style from every new arranger model that comes along, we might see non-arranger owners as well as the manufacturers look upon arranger owners a bit more seriously. You might see more musicians realize the potential of the arranger/workstation type instrument, which would lead to more sales and eventually lower prices.

ADDED: I don't mean to offend anyone here with what I wrote above. It's just an observation by someone who has been on the inside so to speak of various manufacturers and also on the sales side of things for many years. I have said for quite some time that several of the high-end arranger keyboards (I may have coined the phrase arranger/workstation years ago) can hold thier own against those instruments commonly referred to as pro workstations. Unfortunately the majority of arranger keyboard owners, at least here in the U.S. which can be a big market, tend to use these instruments as they were originally intended, a replacement for the home organ market on the upper end and a child's toy on the lower end. Obviously arranger keyboard versatility has grown over the years, but if non-arranger owners don't start seeing the light as to the validity of an arranger/workstation type instrument, I fear that eventually they will drop off the radar to the point that production will cease altogether.

------------------
Wm. David McMahan
The Modulators

[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 11-04-2010).]

Dave ..
Thank you for the nice demos well done...I was going to try to do a few demos myself as you did gotta figure out the camera angle thing here ..but maybe in the future whan I get time between gigs.....but then again after reading dickis post I said to myself ...what for?


I also agree in many of the things you said in you post also...you one of the good guys Dave...would love to meet you sometime also..thanx again.

ADDED: "simple as that" is ok for scratch pad work...but when you want to do some serious multitrack creating it takes time, & lots of thought to make it right. Any the point of this whole thing it to make aware to players that the tools are in the unit and just need to be utilized.

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-04-2010).]

Would this include you?

----------------------------------

Thanks, Dave. Yes, it really is as simple as that......but that assumes that you can play. The old saying is still true....'those that can, do; those that can't just sit around talking smack'.

Side note: Have you ever tried the Nord C1? If so, as a bona fide' organist, what do you think of it (sound wise, not the absence of drawbars, which I also think is a negative). BTW, I'm seriously looking at the Roland VR-700. I think the organ is the weak link, but it's so damned convenient as a gigging board.

chas

nah...I'm Still celebrating ELECTION Day results YIPPPPPPEEEE!

I wouldn't celebrate too much; one of your tea party candidates is proposing making ENGLISH the official language.

chas

In any language what we now had before Tuesday elections was the worst menagerie in history. Doesn't seem weird that WE want is the same thing that Billionares want? think about it...Hmmm? I hope in 2 years the rest gets flushed down the bowl for good.
Oh geeeeze I'm sorry,.....there I go talking politics instead of arranger keyboards.. my bad!

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-04-2010).]

Yep, it's true. You ARE the one who introduced politics into this thread. Guess no one noticed since no one called for it to be moved to the bar.

BTW, why DIDN'T you put up a video demonstration? Dave proved that it only takes a few minutes. You're always berating others and baiting them to 'put up or shut up'. Guess it doesn't apply to you.

Oh, and FWIW, congrats to those Republicans who will be entering office with the object of helping the people and trying to solve some of the country's economic woes. For those that come in with no motive other than to be obstructionist, well, history shows that their tenure will be short-lived.

What happened to your ebay heroine? Looks like 'money can't buy me love'. Wow, 160 million of her own money? That's a lot of arranger keyboards.

chas

Chas I dont know how to play either so that must be the reason I didn't post a demo. This way I remainn a level of the rest.
I will act as silly as you from now on.
Me & You = water & oil.

Added: The people have spoken!



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-04-2010).]

1, 2, cha, cha, cha

------------------
TTG

now thahts a great post that makes sense!!

Hey, YOU'RE the guy that tried to bait ME into a political brouhaha. Unless you go back and '.' it out, I think it's there for everyone to see. As far as your being so gleeful about the Republican victories, I doubt if it has anything to do with any kind of ideological commitment; in fact, I'd bet the farm that you didn't even go out and vote. You are the first (and ONLY one) to even bring it up, probably because you thought it would upset me; it doesn't. We live in a democracy where people are free to vote their choices. The people have spoken and they will again in 2012. That's the way it works in America. If you believe in something, you go out and vote for it; just like if you're trying to make a musical point, you make a video demo (yourself), not try to cajole someone else into doing it. Oil and water; that doesn't even begin to describe it. So let's just agree to not respond to each other. I think that would be best for the board. Hey, look at the bright side; at least your kids can stay on your health plan until they're 26, while they look for a job. Oh wait, there ARE no jobs; they all got shipped overseas under George W. Have a nice day, go for a walk, spend a little less time googling links to post to SZ. Practice your English, and don't forget to use Spellcheck.

chas

Are you finshed berating me yet?...

Took a shot Voting for him last time was the biggest mistake I EVER made..wont happen again..2012 he'll be gone for sure !





[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-04-2010).]

I'm WITH you Donny....
The right things will be done...this is only the bginning...and a darn good one!

Lee S.

Hmmmm, that's a familiar tactic. Instead of articulating what you don't like about him or his policies, you simply photoshop him in a clown's outfit. You personify everything I said in Gary's post. But let's look at it realistically. He's slim (as in FIT), intelligent (conceded to by even his foes), articulate, has two Ivy League degrees, cum Laud from Harvard Law, has been a US Senator, and is currently YOUR president and leader of the free world. Now let's look at YOUR accomplishments. Since you had at least a ten year head start on him plus a few uh, other advantages, you should stack up pretty well.
No??? Well then, if he's a clown, what does that make you? I could tell you but why bother. I think most people see you for what you really are; a would-be cyber-bully with a really, really bad inferiority complex. Instead of trying to bait me, why don't you go start another of your famous, intellectually stimulating, "what kind of underwear do you wear to the gig" threads. With the current level of boredom on the board, I'm sure SOMEone will respond.

chas

Let's do this in The Bar, guys...



------------------
Bill in Dayton

....that must have been about the time I was taking my space walk to fix the Hubble space telescope. Man, that was bad, even for you.

chas (can't stop laughing)

Before this goes to the bar....(I don't drink.. )

And I rarely talk politics..since it is usually a no win situation...

Presidents are widely abused verbally..and no president has been knocked more than our previous president..not even Clinton, who set the worst example of any president ever..

Of course Bush had 8 years to pile up the abuse....but Obama only has 2 years so far..but before his term is up..he will get his share...

Education levels are not the only measuring stick..almost in any field ..education without experience can be a failure..

Personally I believe Obama surrounded himself with poor cabinet selections..

Keep in mind it was a close election ..with the youth (less experience youth) casting the votes that put Obama in office..
So there are just as many folks that did not think Obama was the right choice...just as many that "thought" he was..

On top of that folks wanted to be part of the generation that voted in a Black president..or what almost was..a woman president...Maybe the wrong concept to elect?

Now many people think we are going down a road ..we do not want to go...and it doesn't take two Ivy league degrees to understand what we are doing is simply dumb...and destroying our children and grand children's future..

Many of the policies that Obama has endorsed and pushed ..I believe the majority of folks do not want..People I have talked to..believe this administration is taking our country into disaster...

I believe that the election results, are saying something to the political parties...we the people..means that they work for us..People should have the right to speak out and voice their opinions..just as they did in previous administrations..

So I will voice mine...If things remain ..heading in the direction they are..I look forward to a change ..again..Give me the woman president.. ..in 2012..

"Many of the policies that Obama has endorsed and pushed ..I believe the majority of folks do not want..People I have talked to..believe this administration is taking our country into disaster..."

You must be talking about the previous administration.


"I believe that the election results, are saying something to the political parties...we the people..means that they work for us..People should have the right to speak out and voice their opinions..just as they did in previous administrations.."

Wasn't it Bush who took away contitutional protections?

Republicans either have short memories or suffer from false memory syndrome.

Didn't stop them from gorging themselves on "freedom" fries. Quelle horreur!

Taike

(I'm pretty sure what's coming next.)

------------------
Bo pen nyang.

this was such a promising thread....it looked like we could share tips on how to actually use our arranger keyboards . This arranger forum needs to change its name...

Spaulding,
OK, lets do that....

One of the things I want to learn how to do is create either a group of styles (that I can sequence through as needd) ...or a song sequence to be able to play along with a complex piece...something like theme from Jurassic Park etc.

There is a lot of talent here...so teach us how to do this.

Thanks,
Lee S.

Lee are you talking about creating styles that have completely 4 DIFFERENT VARIATIONS within 1 style so you can run thru them let's say with a pedal to change them as you play the piece of music?....this certainly can be done you can even use the registrations to link as many 4 variation setups you create within each style using the style creator also. The process will depend on your particular keyboard.

Well thank goodness this thread is back on track. Nigel added The Bar Forum for OT discussions, so we should respect the guy who created, pays for and maintains the Synth Zone and keep topics on track.

Lee, your idea of having a group of styles dedicated to a particularly complex piece of music is something that I did back in 2000 when I was hired by Baldwin corporate as a digital piano product support rep. The day I started I was informed that in two days there would be a company-wide meeting and that the product support guys (I was one of three) were to perform at the meeting to introduce the new models. I decided to play Birdland by Weather Report. Nice idea except besides the fact that I hadn't spent any time with the Pianovelle PS2600, I couldn't find any style that was to my liking for this tune. My thought was to sequence the entire thing other than the parts I would play live, but the downside of that is having to stick to the structure of the song; I wanted to have the option to stretch out on the solo section. So I got the brilliant idea to create a style that had all of the various sections of the song recorded in the different variations of the style. The PS2600 has four variations, but I needed more sections than that. So my solution was to use the styles ability to change patterns based on the type of chord being played, Maj, Min, 7th, etc. so that each variation had totally different patterns based on the chord type I played. The result was a style that had far more than four variations. I think I ended up with 12 or so completely different patterns for that song that were called up by choosing variations and by playing either Maj, Min of 7th chords. The patterns that I recorded had chord changes built-in to some of them and I had the split point set for the very bottom octave of the keyboard (88 note) which allowed me to play across the entire key range (minus the lowest octave) and not have to worry about loosing my left hand to trigger chord changes. It worked like a charm and the song went off without a hitch. Mind you, up until that point I had never created my own style on any instrument. I have been sequencing for years starting on a Commodore 64 with Dr. T's software so I was very aware of the recording process, but certainly not with creating styles in an arranger keyboard and I accomplished what I described above in a day and a half. Don't misunderstand, I am not tauting myself as some kind of genius. Just pointing out the fact that with an open your mind, spending time reading the manual, and using the capabilities the manufacturer was kind enough to dream up and include in the instrument, great things can be done.

------------------
Wm. David McMahan
The Modulators

now Dave thats what i am talking about and the kind of tutorial that people would pay money for.

Would you provide a demonstration of style programming illustrating this ?

This could be a fantastic thread if we could just let the thing breathe a bit bfore getting sily .

Seriously Dave , thnanks for the demo and please dont stop now.

Donny, David,
Thanks...
I understand the concept...and I think the process will be different in the Yamaha vs Korg. But, maybe not so much?

Not to bore you...but this is kind of what I am talking about...Could just use split or a second kbd on my arranger..just watch the progression of the piece and all the accompanyment.

Notice the registrations changes...etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaMw63ueoVw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bbUIK33Hjbo&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DshfffItK0k&feature=related

How is it best to do this kind of thing on an arranger as we know it?
I got to believe it is possible if this 2004 technology can do it.
As a side bar...don't these things sound great!

Obviously I want to start out with a simpler piece then progess.

Lee S.

Hi Lee,

The way these performances were accomplished is by sequencing the piece in its entirety. The sequence is calling up keyboard set-ups and of course playing the parts like drums that are not being played live. You can see the thumb button triggers under the upper manual being selected automatically throughout the song which is how the sounds on both manuals are magically changing without the player touching anything but the keys. You could pull off something similar by doing a lot of work in style record mode, but for this type of performance, using the traditional sequencer method would be far easier.

On the Generalmusic instruments that I am very familiar with as well as the Korg arrangers that I am becoming very familiar with, you can insert events throughout the sequence that will call up different keyboard set-ups (8 Song Presets on the GEM / 4 STS Presets on the Korg). The GEM Song Presets can each store sound selection, key range (for keyboard splits), transpose, volume, effects routings, pedal and wheel settings and aftertouch for all 32 tracks of the sequencer of which any number of tracks can be either playing back a recorded track or set to play live. On the Korg, the STS's store similar parameters for up to 4 live tracks that are available on top of the 16 sequencer tracks. I am sure Yamaha and Roland arrangers have a similar ability.

And yes, these songs and players are very good. Thanks for the links.

[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 11-05-2010).]

Dave some helpful stuff you've posted. There are no genius that I know of here, but your work and playing is excellent. Thanks for sharing and don't be shy about posting more videos. We all can learn something from that type of post.

David,
OK...As I thought...on the Yamaha the registration changes must be able to be set/changed via the sequencer (midi type 0 file).
On the Korg we would have to change STS, but there is only 4 per song?? Maybe that's enough. It would also be nice to use song position pointer so we could go back to a certain section...will have to look into that...not sure it's suppoted on current instrument.

The Stagea Organ in my posts actually supports 16 registrations at any one time, quite nice.

What I would like is for someone here at SZ to do something like one of these songs (or similar). The brand of arranger doesn't matter. It's the technique we are after.

Lee S.

[This message has been edited by leeboy (edited 11-05-2010).]

what kind of musician is one who doesn't write his own stuff? That's where it all adds up...

I have tried most arrangers, for writing your own songs only the Yamaha cut it, because they have a 'chord track' that the Korg and Roland don't have, which is a shame.
It's basically a track that allows you to precisely write the arrangement in step time.

On the Roland and Korg, you have to record the whole arrangement in real time, which is ridicolous, if you get a wrong chord, or the wrong fill, you have to edit all the instrument parts one by one. On the Yamaha you just replace the chord or the fill with another and the WHOLE backing track will adjust itself accordingly. It also means that you don't have to reharse the whole performance. Just write the arrangement, chords, and melody, and you have a song.

It's a MUCH faster way to write songs. That chord track I am never tired to brag about, it's essential in an arranger keyboard, Korg and Roland take notice, the keyboards are great but we need a CHORD TRACK.

Umm, actually you can do the very same thing on the Korg Pa series.

And this is of course why manuals are supplied with instruments like these.

------------------
Wm. David McMahan
The Modulators

arranger_yes_pc_no,
So many people do not have a full grasp on the full capabilities of newest the Korg OS.

In backing seq. (Quick record) mode you can record your song. It uses grouped tracks (Chord/Acc, & Kbd/pad) grouping. You record your song...then if you need to change style, performance, tempo, 'CHORD' or style elemnt...you go to 'Step' Backing sequence mode to edit any thing you need to. You do NOT have to re-record the song or any part of the song...you just edit the entrys to change it. You can however re-record if you want. The PA2XPRO also has a full pro level 16 track sequencer for track by track recording / editing.

A song writers dream machine.
The Yamaha method is fine too. ( I had a T2, nothing newer)


Lee S.

As do the Pa588, Pa500 and the Pa800.

[/b][/QUOTE]Stephen M :
videos..... We all can learn something from that type of post.
[/B][/QUOTE]


Finally someones who... "GETS IT"..



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 11-06-2010).]

Donny,
Yes, +1,
Lots of talent here...please share what you have learned.

How to make music on the arangers sound superb??

Lee S.

Although there a few talented individuals here ...I have learned that this is not the place to share anything as you will be berated beyond belief. instead I prefer in person, or video conferencing, email, or chats to coreposnd and discuss different things help each other one on one..otherwise it's fruitless.

Donny,
OK, I understand...it's a shame.
Lee S.

lee get in touch with me anytime if you wanna talk ok/

I watch the video and I just don't get it... Its way to difficult to make up songs on these PSR's. I try but I just don't think I'll ever be able to do it...

Donny,
OK, will do.
Thanks for the offer....

By the way, Bart and I played the T4 today at Sweetwater Sound. pretty nice.

Lee S.

Lee, I've talked with Donny quite a few times thru the years about gigs, he definitely has know how and the experience when it comes to gettin' the gigs. Of course he has the talent too.

I know what you're saying, Donny, but no-one's berating Dave in this thread. I respect your M.O. by wanting to keep it one-to-one, but I hope this doesn't discourage people from posting further tutorials on the Zone.

Well that is only true if you are silly enough to acknowledge those negative postings. If you are mature enough to simply ignore them then they will not only fail to affect the thread they will also be deleted as I have already done previously on this thread.

As well I count the number of times someone forces me to delete one of their postings. Once that count reaches 3 it is an automatic ban regardless of why they posted what they did. There is a limit to how much of my time ( and yours ) I will allow people to waste.



[This message has been edited by Nigel (edited 11-07-2010).]

Nigel,
Very good advice...
Thanks for the intuition and your time to keep things in order.

Lee S.

no, you are totally wrong. The PA series doesn't do anything like that,I have carefully examinated all the manuals of all the known arrangers before deciding to stick to Yamaha.
My friend own a Korg and a Yamaha and write your stuff and you'll see what I mean.

The ONLY arrangers that have a chord track are the Yamahas and the Technics. Ketron, Korg, Roland, don't have it. It's just a very relevant oversight from these companies.



[This message has been edited by arranger_yes_pc_no (edited 11-09-2010).]

arranger_yes_pc_no,
So...tell me why the only way to accomplish what you want is with a chord track..in detail please...and I will hopefully tell you how it is done on my Korg PA2XPRO.

Lee S.

I would tell you why in detail, provided I had time to devote to that task, which unfortunately I don't have. Who will pay me?

If you don't believe me, there's a faster way: get a Yamaha or a Technics and write the same song on both the Yamaha/Technics and the Korg, and see for yourself on which one is WAY, WAY faster to write the same song.

That's all I can really tell you. By the way, I don't need to know how to write music on your Korg: I had figured it out about a year ago from the manual before I decided to get my Yamaha, the Korg is no different than a Roland or a Ketron: there's no 'chord track'. It's basically like the sequencer of a synth workstation like a Korg Triton or a Roland Juno.

It seems to me like you have never used that 'chord track' before....if you had, you would be of my same opinion, trust me.

The Korg PA is a great instrument...I am only talking about the 'chord track'. Nothing else



[This message has been edited by arranger_yes_pc_no (edited 11-09-2010).]

arranger_yes_pc_no,
Don't need a chord track....for what I usually do...In this process you can fix not ony chord mistakes but other kinds as well.

If I want to quickly record a song I use this mode:

(From the manual)
Backing Sequence (Quick Record) mode allows you to quickly
record your live performance with the Styles. To make things
easier, just two grouped tracks are provided: Kbd/Pad (Keyboard
and Pads) to record keyboard and pads, and Ch/Acc (Chords/
Accompaniment) to record Style commands and chords played
on the keyboard.

(When you save the song it then creates all 16 tracks.)

THEN, if you want to change something like a wrong chord...here is the answer:

The 'STEP' Backing Sequence mode allows you to enter single
chords, to create or edit the Style (Chord/Acc) part of a Song.
This mode lets you enter chords even if you are not a keyboard
player, or 'FIX ANY ERROR' made playing chords or selecting Style
controls, during a Backing Sequence (Quick Record) recording.

(There is, of course a full PRO level 16 track sequencer that is built in.)

It works great and it is very easy to fix mistakes.

There is a lot in all these arrangers that are sometimes not apparent in a read of the manual...anyway that's what I have learned.
I discovered how this works when I actaully started recording songs the first week.

Lee S.

well done Lee. You beat me to it.

Spalding,
I really like that quick record mode...it's just easy to use and fast to setup. And since I tend to still make a few mistakes..easy to correct them, without having to chgange a lot of things, just go to step backing seq. mode and find the error, & fix it. Nice because you can even add fills, etc that you forgot to do. Chord error are really quick & simple to fix.

I have learned through the years to STUDY the manuals (multiple times)...not just read through them quickly. A lot of things are in the Korg manuals that most people dont even know about, especially Korg owners. I would however like a few video's of some of the more advanced features just to make it more clear...and faster to figure out, because there is so much there. Also the advanced edit mode that covers sound editing, sampling and effects is super. Lots of questions on Korg forums are asked...and the answer is right in the manual.

Lee S.

Hi,
The steptime method between the Korg & Yamaha is different.
With Yammie , you play the actual chord on the keyboard in steptime. In Korg steptime, you dial up the chord.
The Yammie method possibly would be faster, especially with lots of complex chords.

Personally I prefer Korg method.
Suppose it's what one gets used to.

best wishes
Rikki

[QUOTE]Originally posted by leeboy:
[B]arranger_yes_pc_no,



[This message has been edited by rikkisbears (edited 11-11-2010).]

Hi Dave,
I tried something similar with a style I put together a while ago, ( Speak Softly Love) except I had to do mine from a midifile, I DON't have your talent for recording.
I love what can be done on the Korg.
Multiple time signatures ( one for each style part), perfect for creating a medley style.
Up to 32 bars for each style part, including the fills.
Quite mind boggling with what could be done.

best wishes
Rikki.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by WDMcM:
[B] My thought was to sequence the entire thing other than the parts I would play live, but the downside of that is having to stick to the structure of the song;

No, I am totally correct. You wrote:


This is precisely what the Step Backing Sequence Mode allows you to do. Granted, it works a little differently than the way Yamaha has implemented the idea, but the results are the same; a way to create or edit a backing sequence in step time.

Personally I don't use the step record method because I have the ability to play in real time. Sure I make mistakes occasionally, but when I do I normally just re-do the track or use the punch-in feature. Recording in real-time gives the tracks more of a live feel.

WDMcM
+1,
I find it very capable...more capable than my musical skill...but I'm working on that.

I had a T2 and I remember the method there was fine too...but not as capable.
Lee S.

plus you can micro edit with the Korg. You can isolate specific notes and make them louder, softer, last longer or shorter change the putch and the timing etc . Very advanced editing capabilities !

Suffice it to say, all of the arranger keyboards have their strong areas. The original point our friend Donny was trying to make with this thread is that these instruments have more capabilities than a lot of folks use, or may even be aware of.

It does make me laugh (or cry) to see how some people are so convinced that their brand of choice is the only brand that should be considered and that all other brands pale in comparison. The fact is, ALL arranger keyboards do the same thing; you play a chord, they play a background. Each brand has some unique features that aren't found on other brands, but that doesn't mean that the same result can't be accomplished by other means on the other brand. Just a different way of accomplishing the same thing. Naturally once you are familiar with one way, it is easiest to stick with that way of doing things. The downside is you may miss some other very cool features that another brand offers because you won't allow yourself to be open to anything but what you had originally chosen. Just my opinion.

[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 11-11-2010).]

Yep...+1,
Lee S.

earlier I wrote:

'On the Roland and Korg, you have to record the whole arrangement in real time, which is ridicolous'

just toclarify: you can write the chords in step time on the Roland and Korg too, but you can only do so for EACH TRACK SEPARATELY, while on the Yamaha, you can do so for the FULL BACKING at once. You write the chords and the fills and the whole rhythm section is programmed. End of story.

On the Korg and Roland,you can do the full backing as well, of course, but you HAVE TO WRITE THE PARTS FOR EACH INSTRUMENT SEPARATELY. So it's like you compare writing the chords ONCE to writing the chords 8 times (depending how many instruments play in the accompaniment for the chosen style)

That's where the real difference is.

No, this is not correct, at least with the Korg (I am not familiar with the Roland). You most certainly can enter chords in step time in a single pass that all of the accompaniment tracks will respond to.

When looking at the Step Record Sequence main page you can make the following settings for each measure:

• select which Style will be played
• what keyboard set-up (Performance) will be in use
• the Tempo
• the Chord to be used by the arranger
  which Style Element will be used from the selected Style
• the length (how many measures) you want the entries starting at the selected measure to play before moving to the next step

It is all pretty easy to do. Here is what the Step Record Sequence screen looks like:


[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 11-13-2010).]

bump

arranger_yes_pc_no, just curious if my post above clarifies the way the Korg Pa series utilizes a chord track? I realize this is different than the way your Yamaha works, but is not the result the same?

Thanks,

Dave

Dave,
Yep...that's what I do..it works nicely.

Maybe the older Korg didn't have that backing feature..don't know...all I can say is the PA2XPRO and PA800 do. And you DO NOT have to do what Arranger_yes_PC_no is saying.

Lee S.

If you would like to hear original songs created on an arranger keyboard, your welcome top visit my site. Follow the signature.

I wrote some lyrics and used my Ketron Sd1 to formulate ideas for original songs.

------------------
http://www.esnips.com/web/SongsfromDanO

I've posted these songs before. But since this thread is about making music, I thought I would throw back out.

All I used was a Zoom Hard Disk Recorder and my SD1. Most people would never know it was only one keyboard used.

yep it works the same with the PA1X