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#126374 - 12/20/05 06:30 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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I wouldn't suggest attempting "trance" on an arranger. You really need something like a Motif for that. Reason is you need some deep and heavy synths sounds (which the Motif has). You'll also need "pattern chaining", which is much more efficient to use when recording styles such as 'trance".
The Motif does pattern chaining. I'm not sure how in depth the sequencer is on the VA.
Squeak
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#126376 - 12/20/05 08:46 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14182
Loc: NW Florida
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One person says 'pattern chaining', another could say 'style changing'. There is nothing in trance that can't be done MORE interactively on an arranger if you take the time to program the styles yourself. The problem is, few people program their own styles (and if truth be known, most Motif users probably just widdle around with the built-in arpeggios and phrases) and so fail to realize how flexible a good arranger can be.
The VA76 sound selection may not be the best for trance, but a PA1X has a good selection for this style, and with work, the G70 can get some deep-dish sounds, probably Tyros2 would work too, but no-one is going to know how well these styles adapt until the manufacturers start packing these keyboards with more contemporary styles and ditch the polkas!
If only the voicing teams from the Motif and Triton and FantomX would get turned loose on the Tyros and PA1X and G70, more young players would get excited about arrangers, whose ease-of-use is FAR greater than the average workstation..........
(And claudiu.......... before you get too excited about a preset demonstration of a new keyboard, try to get the demonstrator to create a NEW set of arpeggios and phrases, and realize what hard work it is to get beyond the factory presets. You have to understand what incredibly talented people the manufacturers have to program these little snippets. If it was THAT easy, everyone could do it!)
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!
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#126377 - 12/20/05 08:48 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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Grahams right, spend time learning the OS on your VA. When you get a really good handle on your current keyboards operating system, and basic functions, it makes your next buy nicer because you spent time learning the ins and outs Your VA is a VERY good arranger and you can do some really good work with that puppy--wish I had one, but I already got several big toys for Christmas, New Pool Table, New Gun, CD's, Fostex MR-8 digital recorder, and a few other things I haven't seen yet Squeak
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#126378 - 12/20/05 08:51 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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Diki, I agree with some of your points, but it's more difficult to program "trance" beats using an arrangers style recorder. It's the way the patterns/styles are recorded using the arranger functions, and also some limitations.
Recording Trance beats on say a Motif, is quite simple. Then chaining those patterns together is very easy as well. With pattern chaining you can put the backing tracks together much more quickly on say a Motif, Triton, or Fantom.
With the arranger style recorders, it can get a little "jumpy" when recording the "fill-ins" and getting them to trigger properly.
Squeak
[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 12-20-2005).]
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#126384 - 12/20/05 11:23 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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You can do any style of music with the Motif. Reason is that it not only has an indpeth synth engine and very nice synth sounds with huge sonic ability, it also has some great "bread and butter" sounds in the acoustic department.
It wasn't always like that though. Personally I think in the past many arrangers had better acoustic voices than the synths. That has however changed because Yamaha for example is including the sweet voices, ect on their Motif line (taken from the arranger line).
I'd take a Motif, Triton, or Fantom any day over an arranger (even the Tyros2 and Korg PAX series) when it comes to writing music such as dance, trance, techno, drums & bass, rap and hiphop.
The sequencers on these units are more (ideal) in my opinion for writing this music. Especially when it comes to assembling patterns.
Squeak
[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 12-20-2005).]
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#126385 - 12/20/05 11:29 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Member
Registered: 07/13/03
Posts: 321
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With a Workstation(like Motif es) you probably can do music in almost any genre especialy: Dance,Techno,Trance,Hip-Hop..., ( expanding is: adding sound epansion boards, adding memory..etc). also keep in mind that Motif ES 6/7/8 are the same between them, and Motif 6/7/8 are the same between them. Very Similiar to Motif: KORG Triton(Studio, Extreme, Le),Korg OASYS, Roland Fantom-X.
[This message has been edited by Vadim (edited 12-20-2005).]
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#126388 - 12/20/05 11:51 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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Believe it or not some people who write that music don't know how to play a keyboard. Their rigs will consist of high quality samplers such as Akai's, and they'll some extensive computer software as well.
Some of the artists who don't know how to play a keyboard or sequence on the keyboard have basic "notation" knowledge and are able to step record tracks such as piano parts and so forth.
There's also those artists who work soley with samples, they mix them up, slice them here slice them there, stretch them... So much you can do there.
Squeak
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#126411 - 12/22/05 08:35 AM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Senior Member
Registered: 10/08/00
Posts: 4715
Loc: West Virginia
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trtjazz, I agree with you that the Motif Rack is a good sound module (even to use with Claudiu's VA).
However, I would suggest the full keyboard to Claudiu. Even though Claudiu's VA is a very nice arranger, just adding the Motif's sounds via a module (rack) to the VA wouldn't allow Claudiu to accomplish the task.
Claudiu would also need the "sequencing power" of the Motif to drive those voices. The Motif's sequencer would be much more efficient in creating the backing tracks (ie: patterns) needed for the music.
Claudiu, I say if you got the money go for the Mo! It won't let you down in the electronica department for music creation (nor will it let you down for more traditional styles of music either).
I do feel I should mention that if the VA-76's operations and functions have you a little baffled, be prepared for a learning curve (as you'd find on ANY synth/workstation).
My suggestion if to completely familiarize yourself with your VA. Learn the ins and outs of that unit. Learn to use the style creator so you can get the hang of loop and overdub recording, learn to utilize the voice editing features so you can get a basic understanding on how to create and edit custom voices.
Your VA is really a powerhouse! It's also a great board to have and use to "grasp" basic sequencing, and other things as well.
Once you've gotten a good hand on operating your VA, you'll find that operating a synth such as the Motif or Triton will be much easier.
Best Regards, Squeak
_________________________
GEAR: Yamaha MOXF-6, Casio MZX-500, Roland Juno-Di, M-Audio Venom, Roland RS-70, Yamaha PSR S700, M-Audio Axiom Pro-61 (Midi Controller). SOFTWARE: Mixcraft-7, PowerTracks Pro Audio 2013, Beat Thang Virtual, Dimension Le.
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#126414 - 12/22/05 03:18 PM
Re: Yamaha Motif - A piece of ART ?...Yeah.....
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Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14182
Loc: NW Florida
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claudiu, I think perhaps you need to listen to a few of the people on this thread that counsel patience and practice.
From reading many (many!) of your constant posts asking for desperately needed help with this or that basic function, and your admission of being quite young, it is fairly obvious that, although you claim to have no problem playing a piano, you ARE very new to using synths and arrangers.
As with anyone learning a new skill, practice and familiarity with one piece of equipment will help you build the skills to master other gear later on. If you shotgun yourself with an ever-changing equipment list, you will have a hard time ever learning anything during the constant learning curve. You CAN do great things with your VA76 (trance may not be the best it's good at, but many other styles are right up it's alley), and trust me, you are going to find a MotifES FAR more complicated than it is.
Imagine you have a younger brother who is just starting out learning the piano. But he is constantly bombarding you with questions about piano repertoire that is FAR beyond his skills. Do you waste your time trying to answer his questions with information he cannot comprehend, or do you counsel him to slow down, do his practice and scales, and in time he will be able to play more advanced work?
You have to understand that your musical heroes of ANY style did not achieve their greatness over-night. They spent years learning their craft and their equipment, and no purchase will compensate for that. In their earlier years, probably most of them would have begged for an instrument as good as you already have. What they did was work with what they had, learned it's ins and outs, and developed the skills to master later equipment they would eventually use.
Perhaps it is time for you to focus on what MUSICALLY you wish to achieve, rather than obsess about the equipment you have or would like. Make a list of the styles of music you would like to learn, and then pick the one piece of equipment that will do them all adequately, rather than salivating over each piece of specialized gear that is best at one thing.
If you wish to do trance and electronica, I personally would recommend going the software route, and use your VA76 for bread and butter sounds, and enjoy it's superb action for playing the computer sounds. After all, you DO play piano and probably appreciate a good action!
Anyway, keep at it, but be prepared to put the years in, like everyone else..............
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!
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