Hi all,

Reading about Peter's recent tradegy with money stolen from his bank account sent shivers up my spine.

I'd like to see a post from anyone else who in the last 3 years has had money actually taken out of their bank accounts via an unwanted computer online transaction.

I assume the number of cases is relatively small, but the actual problem could be larger than we think.

I think it would be enlightening to hear from the victims. After all, losing money that way, leaves less for us to use in keeping our keyboard inventory going.

Thanks,

Larry Gosmeyer

Hi Larry
It is very prevalent in the UK with the Banks maintaining teams of staff to spot and deal with such activities.
My son had it happen to him several months ago...
Rog

Hi Larry,
The interesting thing about the fraud (well, to me!) was that the bank notified me that these two withdrawals had been made on 4th December and on the same day the pc crashed. I would have spotted them on my monthly bank statement which was due on about 10th December, but the bank got there first,and I still don't know how the bank identified them. The sums taken were small (around £40 sterling) and I was advised that this was likely a fishing expedition and that a clearout of my account would have followed, but luckily, it was on the 4th that the pc crashed and this could have been caused by the hacker making an error or more likely by spyware. The pc repairer found more than 200 spyware thingies in the pc and had to do a complete cleanout.
Point I'm trying to make is to make sure you have a reliable anti spyware programme installed. I had Spybot which I was told is useless and now have a programme called Bullguard which is anti virus, spam, and spyware, which is automatically undated daily. I was also advised to keep away from Limewire as this is a well known source of spyware.....
Peter

Whilst online fraud is very common, we can do many things to safeguard our computers and thus make it more difficult for these people to rob us.
However, don,t think that is all we have to worry about. About four years ago I had two ammounts taken from my bank account. The first was £60 and the second was £4000 which were both supposed to have been paid into a credit card account issued by the same bank to me. The money never got into the account.
After many phone calls and being worried to the point of feeling very unwell the money was repaid into my bank account with no more contact from the bank.
Nine months later I heard on the local news that a bank employee from the same bank but not the same branch had been sent to prison for stealing customers funds.

If I had to make a bet as to where my money went I think you all know where my bet would be placed. As I said earlier, all monies were replaced so I was lucky enough to have a happy ending but for about two weeks I was worried sick.

I suppose the bottom line is,

We don't know from which direction the fraudster will attack.


Alan

Hi Peter,
I would think that the theft of funds from your Bank account, was most likely to be due to a 'Phishing' attack on your PC, rather than a Virus or Spyware. Anti-Virus, Anti-Spam and Anti-Spyware programs, whilst they are valuable additions to improve PC security, will not guarantee detection or prevention of these 'Phishing' emails arriving in your In-Box.
There are an increasing number of these 'Scam' emails circulating, which are VERY convincing and look as if they are genuine requests from your Bank, asking for intimate details of your account. Do you remember ever having received on of these emails?

An important thing to remember is that Banks and Credit card companies, will NEVER ask you for these details via an email.

It is only vigilance on the user's part and suspicion of unsolicited emails, particulary those purporting to originate from your Bank, which will give you protection from any future Scams. You should NEVER click on any links in these emails, since they are most likely to direct you to the Scammer's website, despite the apparently genuine look of the link.

Malware does exist which is capable of embedding itself in your PC and 'Phoning Home' details of passwords, Bank account details etc. but this assumes that these details are held unencrypted, somewhere on your PC. Having such details 'openly' available on your PC is asking for trouble . If you must store these details on your hard disc, then you should only store them using a program, which encrypts them and only allows you to access them, via a single memorable password. There are several such programs available - for example - Password Manager ( www.passwordmanager.co.uk )

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Willum

After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is Music.
Aldous Huxley

Hello Everyone,

I've been reading this post with great interest. Firstly I have to admit that this kind of thing is one of the reasons I no longer use the net for purchases. I feel if companies wish me to use their services, then it is up to them to provide the security needed - NOT ME.

Secondly, (and this is for Bill please) I have so many passwords/important details I use for various reasons, it was becoming difficult to remember them all, so I listed them in Word, saved them to Floppy Disk, then deleted the Word document from the PC and am now just loading the floppy to retreive the info when needed and then repeat the delete process.

My question to you Bill is:-In view of the ever increasing 'crafty' ways these hackers and the like have of getting in to your PC, is deleting the Word document enough? Why I ask this is because I have heard that it takes time for deleted matter to 'drop off' your hard drive. I and many others I'm sure would value your comments on this.

Audrey

Hi Audrey,

Regarding your text "Firstly I have to admit that this kind of thing is one of the reasons I no longer use the net for purchases. I feel if companies wish me to use their services, then it is up to them to provide the security needed - NOT ME." I would comment as follows :

Most reputable Internet trading companies use encrypted secure data transfers for the sensitive parts of your transactions. When you eventually reach the page on their website, where you are about to enter your Credit/Debit card details, you should see two changes on the web page.

1. The address line at the top of the page should change from http://.............. to https://........ indicating that it is a secure encrypted protocol for data transfer from your PC to their server.

2. At the bottom right corner of the web page, you should see a small yellow closed padlock. This indicates that a Secure Sockets Layer (SSL) technology is being used by the Web site, encrypting information and providing authentication via a trusted third party organisation. If you move your mouse pointer over the small padlock, you should see text similar to 'SSL Secured (128Bit)' - the '128Bit' indicates the level of encryption used by the company's server.
If the website conforms to these standards, then I would say that it is as secure as it could be. If the standards are not met, then I would be a bit suspicious..............

Saving all your passwords on a floppy disk is not a bad idea, however, I would tend to make another copy of that disk - just in case..............
If you use the data on the floppy disk only when you are 'Off-Line', I would say that it is fairly secure, but this may not be very practical. Using a utility on your PC, which encrypts all your data and provides easy access for yourself, is a much better way to go. I've had 'Easy Password Manager' installed on my PC for several years now and find it very easy to use. You can download a 40 day trial version from the website mentioned above and if it suits your purpose, the full version is just under £13.00

With regard to File Deleting :
When you 'delete' a file on your PC hard disk, the file is NOT actually erased - the space which it occupies on your hard disk, is just marked as available for re-writing data, the next time you Save a file. The operating system may or may not immediately use the space made available, by 'deleting' that particular file, so it may take several different 'Save' operations before that particular space is overwritten. This may account for your comment I have heard that it takes time for deleted matter to 'drop off' your hard drive.
Deleted files can be fairly easily recovered by using a File Recovery program - many of which are available. If a file has been accidentally 'deleted', the File Recovery operation should of course be carried out before any subsequent Save operations are made, otherwise the 'deleted' file could be overwritten, thereby making normal File Recovery impossible.
Furthermore, when you select the normal 'Delete' operation in Windows, the file does not even go through the 'delete' process - it is merely moved into the Recycle Bin, from where it is a very simple process to reinstate the file to it's former folder. It is only when you decide to Empty the Recycle Bin, that all the space in the hard disk, occupied by the files in the Recycle Bin, is marked as available for re-writing.

There is a simple way to Bypass the Recycle Bin. If you are sure that you no longer wish to keep a file and 'delete' it, rather than send it to the Recycle Bin - Just press and hold the SHIFT key while pressing the 'DELETE' key. You will be asked to confirm the operation.

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Willum

After silence, that which comes nearest to expressing the inexpressible is Music.
Aldous Huxley

Fascinating stuff this.

In response to the question you asked, Willum, I did in fact receive a very official looking mail "from" my bank a few months ago but did not open it, as is my practice with any mail I have doubts about. On phoning the bank I was assured that it was an attempted scam.
I always thought that deleting an email without opening it (especially any attachment) stopped any invasion of the pc. Am I Correct in my assumption?

Peter

Interesting post!

I think the major problem would be EMPLOYEES. Think about it! Any person can apply for a job at a bank or any big business, stay just long enough to get all needed data and quit and sell this private information.

S

Hello Bill. You have given me straight and honest answers to my queries which is exactly what I was after. I will print your reply and work on the suggestions you have made. Thank you very much indeed for your prompt reply.

All the best.

Audrey