I used to be a devoted KN/Technics myself. Heck, my dad used to be a sole dealership overseas for many years before.

A few things that steer me away from Techics:

1. After playing it for over 15 years. Yes, the sounds improved significantly, but I was ready for a change (and it was NOT easy).

2. PRICE

3. Attitude from salesperson at the dealership. I was trying out one of the boards before. In the middle of my playing, he asked me "Are you going to buy this keyboard?" I'm like "why" he answered "cause these people may be interested in buying". Mind you, I play well..even the people behind me were listening to my playing.

4. KN6000 was my last (technics)keyboard- It was broken for a while. When I tried the harmonizer on that thing, I thought the harmnonizer broke since it sounded so distorted and bad.

I don't know why a company as big as Technics can overlook something like this (harmonizer). I don't know how many people turned away (meaning...they lose money off course) from buying this because of a bad harmonizer.

But my dad also told me (long time ago)...that when he was a Yamaha dealer- the people in Japan was much more supportive towards the dealers, etc..and much more intuned to what people want. Not so for Technics. All they wanted was push sales, but not supportive to their dealers.

Okay...enough of my ranting...just bored

Wondering: The Wheaties add on T.V. states it has 100 percent of 12 daily requirements, and no other company can say that. TRUE
Does this imply that Kelloggs the largest cerial manafacturer in the world, with a
R&D department larger than Wheaties entire
cerial factory, just simply, does not know how to include 100 percent of the same daily
requirements, into their product. I don't
think so-------By the same token; do you think that Technics (Pansonic) one of the
largest manufacturers in the world, just
simply don't know how to design and include
a first class harmonizer on their KN-7000.
I don't think so. There simply must be a
very good and sound reason for their decision
that prevokes a "thread like this." Maybe if you looked at the sales record of the 7000
you would find they sure did something right.
The O.S. and superior sounds are what makes it sell like "wildfire." To the great
majority of us out here, buying this stuff, a
harmonizer don't mean "diddle squat",
because 99% of us can't and don't sing a note.
Nuff said, hope I've struck a Chord or Two.
Have a great day everyone------------ARJ

Relating to Vocal Harmonisers. When I spoke to a Technics demonstrator at this past Sping 7 day Keyboard festival in the UK. He stated they could improve the Harmoniser, but its all down to costing, meaning if you want a far better VH on the KN's you are going to pay more for it.
I am not a Technics fan, but in fairness to the KN7000, the Tyros is a lot more money here in the UK. (approx £700 Uk Pounds)
All board manufactures are in tight competition, so all are keen to appear to give the best value. Some boards which have many facilities for their price have to drop something else, poor cheap tacky keyboards is one example. (no names mentioned)

Graham UK


[This message has been edited by Graham UK (edited 08-25-2003).]

So if the Kn7k cost XXXX amount now....to add a quality vocalizer/mic input to possibly an Kn8k would jack the price up even further approaching $4grand+.... Yikes!!

What nerve. The Technics keyboards are already the highest marked up insturments of the bunch! In truth, a kn7k cost about the same as a Tyros or a loaded PA80, but the street prices are through the roof! If they truly want to expand their market...they need to add more pro-friendly features...like a quality harmonizer.

I guess the home kb stores have enough success with the outrageous price schemes, but if you found an MI dealer that had the line... you could buy a kn without the gorging that takes place in other piano stores.

I'm not knocking the profit deal.... just the mentality of NOT advertising a true list price for the customers. Most stores mark them up as much as they want, and no one can argue the ammount. I'm all in favor of fair profit, but I can't advocate "made up" numbers in a market so full of fine competitors.

If Panasonic really wants the pro market, they could have it in a second. They just need to address our needs a little better. I believe they stay away from the pro market because they make more money in the home market. Simple business. Pros are a pain to deal with anyway. Bargain shoppers, broke alot, trading in worn out gear. We're the ones using these everyday in the trenches, and I suppose we're not the "poster kids" that Panasonic wants as spokespeople.

Different strokes, but without a "real" harmonizer ...... the kn series is for different folks than THIS folk!

My 2 cents worth.... I have a kn6000 and bought it 'sight unseen', 'sound unheard' and was TOTALLY disappointed in the harmonizer .. BUT ... that was my fault for not listening to it first... however, the sounds, ease of use, etc. were enough to make me happy ... HOWEVER, as a fan of technics, I feel they are doing a dis-service to buyers or potential buyers by equipping their boards with a USELESS harmonizer .... either put in a good one or get rid of the one that's in there ...
t.

Mike,
Thank you for this excellent review and sharing your discussions with Chris Hanlon. I always enjoy your reviews as they are very informative.
Starkeeper

To shift the discussion away from the harmonizers to meat and potatoes of arranger keyboarding:

- does KN7000 have 4 variations per style or is it still two?
- does it still only have 2 intros and endings per style?
- does it have support for unlimited-size memory card (or is it limited to 256 MB as some Japanese products are)?
- It was also my understanding that its "music stylist" was not programmable, unlike music database on the Yamahas. Is there an equivalent function to that?
- Does EMC style conversioni program include support for the Technics' styles? I recall that Technics told EMC not to include suçport for KN6000, for fear of litigation. Has this changed?

Here in the US the only prices I see on Technics kbs are the ones posted at the local dealers', as Technics does not allow Internet advertizing of prices. At the local store the salesman was using the typical car-sales tactic - "retail of $6999[that's in US Dollars], but if you buy now, we will give it to you for $5000". As I turn around to leave, he says "just spoke with my manager and will give it to you for a one-time special price of $4000 - that's almost half price" I am pretty sure I could bargain the price down more, but that is still higher than Tyros

Technics is not my cup of tea - I think that many of its styles are too oriented for German market - lots of accordions, organs, etc. I also don't like the their sounds - to my ears they don't sound as good as Yamaha's or Roland's or Ketron's - that is my subjective opinion. But the company attitude towards sales process and the customers, putting the customers in the adversarial relationship with the dealer, is just plain wrong. If I were to negotiate the price down to areasonable level, does it mean that the shop owner would provide me with less service if I should need it? (the sales assistance is already poor, with the salesman - a man in his 50s who likely spent his whole life selling musical instruments by day and used cars by night - not knowing about key features of the instrument)

IMO (as a computer engineer), the SD card is a replacement for the floppy drive, not hard drive, as its storage capacity does not come close to that of an affordable hard drive today. But then Technics does not expect their customers to care about the concept of "affordable". Besides adding the extra weight and expanding the size of the instrument to accommodate the now unneeded floppy drive, the main purpose of including both media devices is to bamboozle the not-so-technically-savvy customers into thinking that the instrument can compete with the others which have a hard drive.

I am not going along with that.

Regards,
Alex

Your so right Gary......Besides the great sound... don't forget the Glorious "LIGHTWEIGHT" of the Psr2000 KB!

I looked at and played both the KN7000 and Tyros keyboards. Since I do not sing, I did not consider the harmonizer in my evaluation.
I decided to purchase a Tyros for the following reasons:

1. The ignorance and deceptive sales practices of the local Technics dealer.
The dealer told me the manufacturer's list price of the KN7000 was $7,000 and his discounted price was $5,000. When I told him the price was a joke, he told me he would be willing to sell it to me "under the table" for $4,000 cash. He also said that in Europe the KN7000 is selling for $14,000 US dollars. He also made many false claims about the capabilities and specifications of the keyboard. It was obvious that he was not familiar with the keyboards features or thought I was an idiot.

2. I thought the sounds were very good on both keyboards. I thought the Technics were better on some, and the Yamaha better on others.

3. I liked the Yamaha styles better.
The Yamaha had better contempory styles. Their guitar strumming and the use of drum fills gave their styles a more realistic feel to them. The Technics big band styles were very good but the Yamaha's were prety close.

4. It appears that the music finder database on the Yamaha is more flexible than the music stylist on the Technics. I was not able to change any of the default values (example tempo) on the Technics music stylist settings. Everytime I called up a selection, I had to change the tempo and other values. This makes the feature not very useful. With the Yamaha music finder database, you can modify any of the settings and save the database.

5. It appears there are more tools available on the internet to work with the Yamaha. I have found programs for editing the music finder database with a PC and other useful utilities.

Overall, I thougt the keyboards were very close. I gave an edge to the Tyros.

Even if I liked the KN7000 better, I decided that I never would buy a keyboard from such an ignorant and dishonest dealer.