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#626 - 05/06/03 07:50 AM Keyboard Gigging Amplification
kbrkr Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 2866
Loc: Tampa, FL
Hi Everyone,

I need some advise. I currently play with a Triton pro and a Tyros. I use a Fender kbx-200 Stereo Keyboard amp. It has 1 12" speaker, a 10", and a piezo tweeter. It is 80 watts per side stereo. When my other 4 band mates get it going, I find it hard to cut through the music with my Brass patches for songs like "We got the Funk" and "Play that funky music".

I need a loud, easy to transport, great sound range, and STEREO setup for gigging.

Any suggestions?

Thanks
Al
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Al

Pa4x - LD Systems Maui 28 - Mackie Thumps

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#627 - 05/06/03 09:39 AM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
Leon Offline
Member

Registered: 04/14/99
Posts: 585
Loc: British Columbia
A couple of ??'s
1. How large a venue do you usually play? Are we talking pubs, bars, louges, concert halls?
2. Are you running sound from the stage, or using a soundman to mix for you?
3. Where is your (and your amp's) position on stage in relation to the other members?
4. Are you running through the front end with your keys, in addition to your amp?
5. How is your monitor mix?
6. Are you Up against a wall of Marshall Stacks?? What are the other members using and casn they not bring it down a bit. Sometimes less is more....
7. On a personal note...I would suggest going through something larger than a 12" & a 10". I'm pumping 35 watts through a 15" and it's more than enough.
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...L

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#628 - 05/06/03 10:42 AM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
kbrkr Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 2866
Loc: Tampa, FL
Leon,

1. I play all venues from small bars to outdoor events. From banquet halls to dinner theaters.
2. I have a band member running the sound who I don't trust thus my reluctance to run through the PA.
3. I am always at the extreme right facing the stage from the audience.
4. I position my keyboard amp behind me angled towards the center. My amp has a 10" speaker transversed to the right, so I have output directed at me.
5. We use floor monitors for the vocals and I hear them well.
6. I'm next to the drums, the guitar and bass are on the other side of the drums. They are running 160 to 200 watt amps.
7. I agree with the 15's
_________________________
Al

Pa4x - LD Systems Maui 28 - Mackie Thumps

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#629 - 05/06/03 01:31 PM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
Leon Offline
Member

Registered: 04/14/99
Posts: 585
Loc: British Columbia
kbrkr:
Sounds to me like a bit of a dilemma. All I could suggest is an independent soundman whom you all trust. Perhaps try recording one of your gigs, maybe you already have. Then sit back and have an honest listen and critique session of what you hear. From this, the loud members might be able to grasp the “Whoa...I’m pretty loud” idea, and perhaps we should make some adjustments. Once you’ve got the instrumentation to a bearable level...take it down a notch and bring up the vocals. Too many times I’ve witnessed bands subtly cranking their individual levels and then trying to sing over them...it’s a no win situation. Our band works with a very talented individual in whom we’ve placed our complete trust. Everything runs through the front end. Our onstage amps are basically there for the people who crowd the front of the stage, and would miss what’s coming through the front end. We use in-ear monitors and can tailor, on stage, what we individually want. The front end sound, we leave up to our magician Dave. It works for us....it may not work for you. Those are just my thots....anyone else out there??
Good Luck..
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...L

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#630 - 05/06/03 10:30 PM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
FAEbGBD Offline
Member

Registered: 03/20/01
Posts: 847
Loc: Nashvville TN
I hate loud stages. Leaves my ears ringing, which i don't need. In the band I'm with, we keep stage volume at a minimum and have a massive front house system. I use a 30 watt guitar amp most of the time, a 100 watt is the biggest I've used. Our drummer is behind a plexiglass shield. Our bass player usually just goes through some nice preamps, eqs, compressors, and out to the PA.

All of you are just going to deafen yourselves cranking out that loud from the stage. Seriously!
If you need loud, invest in your front house PA. We have up to 20,000 watts if we need it. That's massive!

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#631 - 05/07/03 05:34 AM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
kbrkr Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 2866
Loc: Tampa, FL
FAEbGBD,

Point well taken. We usually do not play loud for 4 hours. There are a few songs that get really loud when we have the whole place in front of us on the dance floor. For those instances, my HORN patches cannot cut through the music. So it's nice to have some headroom in my amp setup for those occaisions.

Al
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Al

Pa4x - LD Systems Maui 28 - Mackie Thumps

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#632 - 05/11/03 12:20 AM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
Anonymous
Unregistered


Live huh hmm...get some heil hi frequency transformers and sterilize them that'll fix the lil bas....no I'm kidding of course.

If you try putting a parametric or even an active graphic in the effect loop and dialing in your horns, along with some friendly 8" drivers in place of that 10" (4 per side in their own cabinet?) One would think that would do the trick. That is, if your amp can handle a little pushing in the front end without breaking into a clipping distortion. Your power should be enough, but not if your guitarist uses two double headed Carvin, Soldano, Mesa Boogie, Real Marshall amp stacks. What kind of power rating are the other amplifiers? Are they for sure that wattage of 160 and 200? I think it is possible that the speaker location of yopur amp may accomodate you, but it is not penetrating past the stage area also. Before buying anything, try a total repositioning of your amp, even it it takes having to rermotely monitor it with another speaker. Leon why the 15"? are the bass freq.s. weak or the mids weak? I disagree (unless the brass is a Sousaphone or Tuba), a 15" in equal complience of a speaker is going to put out less of those horn range freq.s. than an 8 or 6 inch designed for mids right?

Last ditch (non-realistic) effort - when each of them are not looking, solder a big fat resistor inline with their speakers
Final effort - rent two crown mono 1000 watt amps two voice of the theater enclosures and a limited damage waiver.
.
A 10" off axis, a 12" , and a tweeter. That sure seems like an odd combo don't you think? Seems unusuall for a keyboard anyway.
MORPH!

[This message has been edited by Morphamatik (edited 05-11-2003).]

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#633 - 05/11/03 09:18 PM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
aj Offline
Member

Registered: 10/18/98
Posts: 191
Loc: new zealand
Hi kbrkr I play Keyboards in a band (haha we do 'funky music' too occaisionally)But I also do sound engineering and mix from side stage (not Ideal but workable) and the biggest problem mixing a band and getting a good FOH sound is too much onstage volume .I used to use a 150 watt keyboard combo (2 x 12" and 1 piezo tweeter) but now have gone to having my own monitor with mainly keys in it. Everything goes through the desk. I feel your pain , 'cause our guitarist plays a modified marshall stack which Does have a great tone but (like all valve amps) only when theyre being driven .It took a couple of gigs with other engineers commenting that they'd muted his channel on the desk and he was still too loud
before he invested in one of those power soak gizmos .... now gotta work on the drummer ...
But if this doesnt suit what about some powered speakers on stands like mackie 450s or the smaller model (I forget the model number) Peavey do some too (big peavey fan) you could use them angled up as monitors or on stands as a stereo setup also as a small PA when you go solo or give it up and become a DJ hehehe

[This message has been edited by aj (edited 05-12-2003).]

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#634 - 05/12/03 06:07 AM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
cassp Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/21/03
Posts: 3748
Loc: Motown
For all sound (mics, kbd, line in guitar) I use a Mackie 808S stereo powered mixer (1200w)with two Mackie 300i 12" 2way speakers for the mains - they're fantastically clean and strong. I use a pair of Peavy 10" monitors which I run off the monitor mix. I also have an EV SXa200 powered sub-woofer that I use in larger rooms. Recently, I added a Peavey KB/A 50 amp as a stage monitor; I run all keyboard sound thru there first and run a line out to the Mackie - I used to run straight into the Mackie. I usually play as a duo or trio (sax + gtr), but sometimes add a girl singer as a fourth. We have no problem playing for up to 500 people, and often play outside with the same equipment win no problems.

------------------
Cass Pawlowski - Motown
PSR2000, SC88, Cakewalk

[This message has been edited by cassp (edited 05-12-2003).]
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Riding on the Avenue of Time
cassp50@gmail.com

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#635 - 05/12/03 10:08 PM Re: Keyboard Gigging Amplification
Nigel Offline
Admin

Registered: 06/01/98
Posts: 6482
Loc: Ventura CA USA
If a stereo monitor on the stage is important to you and you don't want to carry 2 powered cabinets then check out the Motion Sound amps at http://www.motion-sound.com/ There has been quite a bit of discussion about them on the General Arranger Forum on this BBS.

If you are up to carrying 2 compact powered boxes then the biamped Behringer B300 is hard to beat for $350 per box with 300 Watts, horn and 15 inch speaker. It is also a very convenient size for carrying in a car.

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