Through a series of trades, I found myself with a P-121 digital piano.
https://youtu.be/2erIv6fNseM
I wasn't really looking for a weighted piano, but the 73 key size made it appealing to me. Then ... after hooking up the iPad app - WOAH Nelly!
(does anyone else's' folks say "Woah Nelly")?

The piano is pretty cool on it's own, but the app makes navigation SO MUCH easier.
Splits, layers, drum styles, octave shifts, tempo, transpose ... all on the screen.
Nice one, Yamaha.
BTW - the P121, and P125 are identical in every way, except number of keys)

I'm thinking this may be my winery rig. I have another 10 days or so to experiment with it, but my thinking is this:
The tasters & sippers are generally more of an up scale crowd, and the volume is pretty low, so styles would just sound lifeless, and whimpy ... more artificial than usual. (no air=no life) When I did it with the PA700, I only used rhythm and bass - no acc voices. That's the tone that seemed appropriate. So, with THAT thinking ... the simpler, the better, I say. Straight piano most of the night, and Rhodes, Bass & drums for some "special sauce" here, and there. The room is super "live" so I don't even need (or want) any vocal effects, so that simplifies things, too.
The setup is not as easy as an all-in-one arranger board, but this rig has promise.
I'll keep you all posted. (and no, Donny - no pics or video will be taken)

This is the first slab piano I may actually buddy up to, since the size makes it fit into my personal comfort zone. Who needs the breaking glass tones up top, or the farting bullfrogs down below on an 88 anyway?
(yup - stirring the pot for my piano purist buddies) lol

Seriously - this is not a bad unit, and I got it used, and mint, so there was a good amount of savings, too. Heck - they're only $500 or so, new!

Good luck Dave on the Wine gig...Salute`

I owned the P-115 for a while (almost identical to the successor P-125), it has the same "CF-Engine" piano sound, which was nice. I think the P-121 is the most lightweight fully-weighted hammer action piano you can get.

I’m really on the fence with this, but it’s such a novelty for me ... thinning out the sound; making it more acoustic-ish for the intimacy of the situation. More me, less gear. Fingers crossed that I’ll be happy. 😇

You should just barrow Grace's Yamaha digital piano.(your old one).

That would've been an option if this didn't fall into my lap. I'm likin' it - the app makes it very easy. Without the app, I'd never have it.

Curious which app you are referring to??

Thanks!

Hi Jill,
The app is Yamaha's "Smart Pianist" - Works on several models, and is invaluable on this one, since the controls are mostly hidden.

Wish it had actual midi out to control sound module or arranger. They stopped after P95/35.

USB out alone limits overall use.

Same issue with Roland FP 10/30 ( $499/$699) love the key response, 4 good pianos but limited / so so EPs, though organs and strings are great. It also comes with similar app). USB to device also ( I believe it can play back SMF, not sure,need to confirm it).

But you have YAMMY P515 with both USB and midi out, better keys but, it’s heavy.

That's not true. The midi works just fine. I just tested it with my ipad.

Yes, via USB you can use midi, e.g. with an iConnectMidi4 interface, which should also work without iPad connected.

Precisely..

And there is more solutions for this, which are under €80

It is.
I was referring to midi in out to hook up ( one straight midi out cable)to modules without additional externals.Not USB midi. (Meaning ; to use weighted keys to control hardware modules).

OK, it‘s more complicated now. I prefer traditional midi sockets, too. But all manufacturers have dropped them for their low-priced product lines.
At least you have the alternatives mentioned. In our church we have a DGX 630 from 2008, which only has a USB connection that is not yet suitable for iPad nor any of the current USB/midi interfaces, you really can do nothing with modules in that case. Now we finally replaced it with a P-255.

It also need a external power supply for the converter if you want to control external modules.



Again we are not talking about Midi to USB. We are talking about keyboards with USB out to physical Midi connector.

Your typical Midi to USB ( computer) will not work due to lack of power supply.

https://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/MIDIExpand--keith-mcmillen-instruments-midi-expander?mrkgcl=28&mrkgadid=3301332467&rkg_id=0&product_id=MIDIExpand&campaigntype=shopping&campaign=aaShopping%20-%20SKU%20-%20Studio%20%26%20Recording&adgroup=Studio%20Mixers%20%26%20Control%20Surfaces%20-%20Keith%20McMillen%20Instruments%20-%20midiexpand&placement=google&adpos=1o2&creative=280136033989&device=m&matchtype=&network=g&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIhYHexJr84wIVGNtkCh0JZABGEAQYAiABEgJg_fD_BwE





Way more cables.

For home/ studio , no issues.

But for live, unless you are totally satisfied with onboard sounds (or iPad sounds if you are using ipad’s Soft synth via camera connection kit), not ideal.

Ipad here is only to manage onboard sounds of P121/125.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=neXswJJcatc


https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gTu6soq2j_k




https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FZbaHLz2wsY

The Keith McMillen Instruments MIDI Expander works only for the Softstep and some other devices by Keith McMillen. The description on Sweetwater is wrong. I use USB MIDI converters by this company based in Spain. https://compasflamenco.com/midi-c-3/

After reading this post, I went to GC to try the P-121. I enjoyed it enough to play 90 minutes on it. Didn't like the P-45 sitting right next to it. Liked the 115 last year and not so much the 125. Personal preferences. The 121 might be right for me with the 73 keys and the inviting price. But I really need to hear it on the battlefield (battlefield being any place that's NOT the small "keyboard korner" that lives in most Guitar Centers.

What‘s different between P115 and P125 at all? Both have the new version of the „Pure CF engine“ for the piano sound.
The P45 has an inferior piano sound generation.

“The main Concert Grand Piano tone on the P-125 uses 4-layer sampling as opposed to 3 layers found on the P115. The layer has been added to make the sound more dynamic and allows for a smoother transition between the samples.”

“10 new instrument sounds”

https://www.pianodreamers.com/yamaha-p125-review/

That's interesting, thanks. I didn't notice any jumps between the 3 layers when I had the P-115, but 4 layers is definitely what you should expect for a stage piano these days...

It's debut time for the P-121 at the winery. I'll let you all know how it goes (went, depending on when you read this)
I'm just bringing the P-121, and one small amp to sing through .... either a Bose S-1pro, or my Boss Acoustic singer. I'm partial to the Boss, because it has a harmonizer, and looper built in. I might feel like using the "icing" if the right moment arises.
For the most part, I expect to play straight Piano, with the added "fluff" of the Bass/Drums for some spice.
I'll post my feelings after the weekend.

The Boss VE-8 is the top rated unit in this market.. So have you found out why I like Roland harmonizers? The demos sound good on youtube and I know you like Laura formerly from TC Helicon.
It seems like the perfect tool for Solo guitarist.. We are waiting for a review.

Hi guys,
Bit confused, which isn’t all that unusual nowadays haha.
The piano doesn’t have midi in/out ports, just a USB port.

I gather it will work with iPad, with some sort of camera cable? I’ve heard of these cables being needed for other things as well.

Big question, will it connect to my laptop so I can use just say band in a box with it, or my sequencer software? Without having to buy some sort of interface.

I was thinking of buying an 88 note controller keyboard, but the salesman suggested a piano, if I didn’t need all the functions of a controller. Not sure he quite got it right as I did mention I wanted to maybe connect my Pa4x.

OK - review time!
First ... the job went very well, and except for some fatigue in my left pinky (heavier action) I was was very comfortable.
Fran, the harmonizer was a minimal tool at this venue, so I won't comment, other than to say, the tracking on this amp is very good. I knew this already from using it with guitar.
Rikki, the USB port connects to the iPad and does everything a midi port can. A simple wire (lightening to USB-B) is all you need to connect.
Having the tempo, transpose, octave shift, and pattern selection on screen makes this piano playable in my style of show. I was very pleased with the tones, and overall sound.
Point of interest: the Rhodes piano on the P-121 is worlds better than I remember in the P-115, and prior. I was very happy with the expression, and sound I got.

A few thoughts about this specific venue:
1) it's a very "live" space, and has too much natural echo, especially when there's lots of people talking .... which is most of the time. This is why I turn off all reverb to minimize the "mud", and clean up my vocals.
2) It's very much a background situation, and not a "listen to me" type show, so I get to work on my instrumental chops more than normal. I have several playlists of accompaniment tracks that I enjoy soloing over. The best sounding ones are from Jam Trax. Real recorded bass and drums. Gives my voice a break, doesn't add to the din of echo in the room, and helps me explore new ideas.
3) Less is more in this room. I think of myself as "musical wallpaper" ... something to be admired, but staying out of sight until the listener chooses to engage.

Overall impression - I like this rig, and I will enjoy using it each month.

Yes - a simple usb cable will connect to your laptop.

Awesome, thank you Dave. Sometimes miss having a piano, the 61 notes on a keyboard isn’t quite enough for the arpeggio style tunes I like to play, I’d probably go for the 88 note version for that reason. Thank you for your review.

The old one man band software or VArranger may get some use yet.

When Roland came out with the “easy eight” card for the E series, Fran, and I were in style heaven. These bread and butter patterns gave us the ability to cover 90% of our repertoire, with no programming. Yamaha has included a similar set of patterns in the P121. I can do almost any request with these included rhythms. Bravo, Yamaha.

I sort of miss the days when the first organ 'arrangers' had just a handful of drum beats. Then they came out with automatic bass. Over the years they evolved into the predecessors of what we know today as arrangers.
One of the best days of my life was when I was able to sell my last organ and go to several components that freed me from hauling that beast around!
As I recall, that first setup consisted of a Yamaha PSR 70, midied to a drum machine and a DX 7 for lead sounds.
All the PSR did was generate the tempo and bass line.
Things were a lot more simple as far as arrangements.
Do I really miss those days? NOOOOOO!

Hi Dave,
I remember having the card, but can’t remember what it played, was it only drums?

I’m finding some of my Korg styles a bit too busy, so trying to dumb them down.
Like the piano ballad, works ok with major chords , then gets too busy with the 7th, and no longer suits.

Converted one of the psr styles across because I couldn’t find a Korg style that went really well with the show tunes and old ballads I like to play. This one simple piano style seems to work with a heap of them.

Kind of wish they’d come up with a set of styles that were more basic.

AGREED! Too much Steve Gadd, and not enough Ringo for my taste.

I used that EZ-8 card in my Pro-E, and E-20, and it was a complete band, just like the the organic patterns on board.
As to Korg busy patterns - yup ... On my 4x (as well as the PA900) I always used one of the programmable switches to mute parts 1-5. I often play with just bass, drums and RH.

Drum patterns are the main reason I started using arrangers in the first place. I always played manual bass, and Rhodes, and carried a drum machine. The arranger combined all three in one. I really prefer basic, simple, generic patterns for almost everything I do live. I use my bass lines, and chord comping to generate the feel I'm going for. I want simple bass, and simple drums, unless it's a swing tune, then I want a swingin', walking bass line, and a drum pattern that lays down the groove without putting too much fluff into it.

The patterns in the Yamaha kept me happy last Saturday at the winery. Solid. Simple. Just what was called for.

Hi Rikki,

I'm hearing every word you say...and relating to it all. I remember when you and I were working on converting those Roland styles for that reason.

So...it's NOT my imagination. These Korg styles really say nothing. (I still can't find a decent cha-cha and some other basic styles). Korg styles...rather unexciting and "over-blown!" Not terribly inspiring. But I think only those of us who have been playing for years have a benchmark to compare them with (the early Yamaha's and Roland's)

I went to a concert over the weekend and the band (for a change) was really terrific. Then it hit me. The keyboard player was mega-good and he was playing on an old vintage Yamaha stage piano. No one noticed...no one complained...no one cared. He got standing ovations. So I'm thinking to myself...why not go back to your old equipment...the Roland Pro-E, etc just for the styles. My intuition tells me to sell this "untouched" PA3x and maybe look into the new Yamahas even.

I don't agree that Korg styles are unexciting ... in fact, I think they border on "too" busy lots of times. I prefer generic beats so I can use fewer patterns to cover more songs. In a live situation, a drummer will play a standard 8 beat the same on many different songs, with only minor modifications to fit each particular song. This is what I like in an automatic version. Believe me, if the samples in the Pro-E (cymbals, specifically) sounded as good as modern day gear, I'd still own one.

So UD...I didn't know you and Fran had Pro-E's. I still have mine in mint condition. And you're talking about this which I also have?



...and the "Pro-E rhythm style cards?"




How do you think the styles AND the sound fare against today's stuff. All those demo's I posted that I did were done with the Pro-E rhythms. Newer isn't always better.

For the piano, the Yamaha P-121 seems to fit me perfectly. I think I'm going to go with that myself.

That to me is why they are "unexciting." Too busy. Gets in your face. The style controls your playing....you don't control the style (unless you're editing it).

I remember years ago when I first discovered the Ketrons. Couldn't get enough of hearing/playing them. But the more I played them the more they wore me out. Great styles and great sounds, but (to me)....the styles were overpowering. The musician should make the total sound, NOT the style.

I still have this never used Ca30, with power supply, manual, and YES the EZ eight card.

The cymbals are the largest shortcoming. The samples are so much shorter than today's (memory limits, I suppose), and it's really evident as the sound dies out. I still have a Korg i5s, and I could definitely get by with those sounds, if I needed a backup. Since much of my live work is a stripped down sound with mostly Vocal, Rhodes/Piano, Bass, and Drums ... I appreciate how far the tonality has progressed, and I enjoy hearing the sound as realistic as possible.
A good friend of mine still uses a Pro-E for his live bass lines. He uses a dedicated bass amp, so that helps the realism, but the core sound is still 1980s Roland.

Hi Mark,
I’m guessing the styles might be fine or maybe even brilliant for certain genres, unfortunately not for the old fashioned ? music I enjoy playing. Haha.
What I have really enjoyed about my Korgs over the last 10 years is the technology ie the style creation and editing capabilities. I’m a tech junkie , not a musician. .Sadly my musical abilities don’t match my ability on knowing how to go about it.

First time in 30 years, I’ve lost interest in trying to convert styles across . Had about 8 months off not being able to use my right hand properly, thank goodness things worked out ok, back to normal, and spending time playing , instead of messing round.
I did find my psr had more styles that suited the songs I enjoy playing, even though soundwise not a patch on my Pa4x.

Think I may get the new psr when it arrives. Don’t like the feel of the keys on the psrs950, too soft. Doubt the new one will be much different, hence I may get a piano as a controller ( with interface or whatever it needs) or midi it to my Pa4x if I keep it.

Rikki....I didn't know that. What happened?

UPDATE on pedal/sustain issue:
Yamaha missed the boat on this, but it's not a deal breaker. As the manual states (p.15) the 3 pedal unit operates the way it should, with the LH ignoring the damper pedal in split mode. Unfortunately, the dedicated damper pedal jack on the instrument (the one MANY players will use) does not support this. I'm currently modifying the pedal unit to attach to a traditional, portable stand (not sure which one, yet). The 3 pedal unit is larger, and heavier, and needs serious support to function comfortably. I'll post my findings when I sort it all out.

Hi Mark,
Slipped on black ice, went down full weight on right wrist ,snapped it. Pins and plate caused numbness and pain in hand, After they were able to remove plate ,things went back to normal.

Came to the conclusion, not worth messing round with styles etc if I can’t actually play.
So making the most of playing, better late than never. Haha.

Hi Dave,
So for home use, the stand and pedals ( optional extras from yammie) are fine, your issue is you need something more portable, so you’re doing a work around?

Look forward to hearing what you come up with.

Yup. The home stand doesn't break down for transit, and the pedals won't rest steady on the floor unless they are bolted to something. A standard damper works just fine, unless you lay alot of LH bass, like I do.

Thank you Dave.