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#461215 - 11/09/18 02:26 PM Calling Bachus
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 6703
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
Bachus, since you seem to be our resident expert on VST's and related topics, I was wondering if you could shed some light on one particular area, setting the velocity curve on the keyboard controller. Some history: when I first got my SEVEN, I struggled a little with the keybed. I hooked up an Akai VX49 to it and found that the sound was quite different (for the same patch). Further experimentation showed it to be the different velocity curves of the respective keyboards. The VX49 gives you a choice of up to 10 velocity curves to choose from. #6 (1-10) seemed to come closest to the native SEVEN keybed (but not exactly). In any case, it provided a totally different (and unsatisfying) playing experience and I soon abandoned it (I have since become reasonably comfortable with the SEVEN's own keybed). But my question is this:

Will a given velocity curve, which is a global, not a patch/plugin specific parameter, have an effect on the sound and playability of my VST's? If so, and since I have thousands, what if any, would be a workaround? Do I 1) just pick one, say 5 or 6 from the available 1-10 range; 2) look for some kind of workaround; or 3) just forget about it and accept the sound as is with some fixed VC value. I realize there may not be a 'good' solution, but I'd be interested in your thoughts nonetheless. Thanks.

chas
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"Faith means not wanting to know what is true." [Nietzsche]

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#461234 - 11/10/18 02:56 AM Re: Calling Bachus [Re: cgiles]
Bachus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 7143
Originally Posted By cgiles
Bachus, since you seem to be our resident expert on VST's and related topics, I was wondering if you could shed some light on one particular area, setting the velocity curve on the keyboard controller. Some history: when I first got my SEVEN, I struggled a little with the keybed. I hooked up an Akai VX49 to it and found that the sound was quite different (for the same patch). Further experimentation showed it to be the different velocity curves of the respective keyboards. The VX49 gives you a choice of up to 10 velocity curves to choose from. #6 (1-10) seemed to come closest to the native SEVEN keybed (but not exactly). In any case, it provided a totally different (and unsatisfying) playing experience and I soon abandoned it (I have since become reasonably comfortable with the SEVEN's own keybed). But my question is this:

Will a given velocity curve, which is a global, not a patch/plugin specific parameter, have an effect on the sound and playability of my VST's? If so, and since I have thousands, what if any, would be a workaround? Do I 1) just pick one, say 5 or 6 from the available 1-10 range; 2) look for some kind of workaround; or 3) just forget about it and accept the sound as is with some fixed VC value. I realize there may not be a 'good' solution, but I'd be interested in your thoughts nonetheless. Thanks.

chas


On all keyboards i know, the vellocity curve is implied to to the midi out vellocity..
And so should have influence on the performance in the same way it impacts on local sounds..

The big danger however is that many VSTs and DAW’s also have their own vellocity curves set.. you should make sure to only use one and keep the other to a single setting.. if you use both a vellocity curve on the vst as well as one on the keyboard, they will add to eachother.. which can yield to undesired results if you don’t realise this..

If the keyboards vellocity is a global setting, its okay.. you will never change it, and you can use the vst settings (which often are much more advanced) to fine tune for a specific sounds..

On arranger keys, vellocity is often a global setting, on my kronos its a setting for every sound.. because you want different vellocity curves for different instruments/sounds to get your desired results..

So what i would do with the akai keyboard, is et it up the way you prefer #6(as it is global) and then make the adjustments on the soundgenerators side when needed and possible.
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Yamaha Genos, Roland Jupiter 80, Ipad pro.

http://keyszone.boards.net

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#461238 - 11/10/18 04:28 AM Re: Calling Bachus [Re: cgiles]
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 6703
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
Bachus thanks, you're right. When I look at the VST parameters, most, but not all, have a setting for velocity. I assume, as you suggest, that they've already been optimized. The truth is, I've only noticed this with the SEVEN which, of course, made me paranoid smile. BTW, I love the VIP software which came with (and is integrated with) the VX49 along with over 3000 VST's. Load time is almost instantaneous but I'm sure that has something to do with the fact that it's running on a very fast PC (w/SSD). If only it were 76 keys. I can't find another VIP-compatible controller that is larger except for the 61-key Akai and I really want a 76. Oh well. Thanks again.

chas
_________________________
"Faith means not wanting to know what is true." [Nietzsche]

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#461242 - 11/10/18 05:56 AM Re: Calling Bachus [Re: cgiles]
Bachus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 7143
Originally Posted By cgiles
Bachus thanks, you're right. When I look at the VST parameters, most, but not all, have a setting for velocity. I assume, as you suggest, that they've already been optimized. The truth is, I've only noticed this with the SEVEN which, of course, made me paranoid smile. BTW, I love the VIP software which came with (and is integrated with) the VX49 along with over 3000 VST's. Load time is almost instantaneous but I'm sure that has something to do with the fact that it's running on a very fast PC (w/SSD). If only it were 76 keys. I can't find another VIP-compatible controller that is larger except for the 61-key Akai and I really want a 76. Oh well. Thanks again.

chas


Chas you can controll vip from almost all akai/alesis/m-audio keys currently for sale,,
Altough its way less intuitive then special vip keyboards.. but i saw someone that build a controll surface for vip in an ipad app...
But there is an 88 key from akai that would work..(but no 76).. but i personally dislike the keybed...
_________________________
Yamaha Genos, Roland Jupiter 80, Ipad pro.

http://keyszone.boards.net

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