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#383503 - 02/02/14 03:06 AM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Playing an organ, I would tend to strip down the style to just drums and maybe (and that's a big MAYBE) one arp track for the left hand, as I would be playing bass with bass pedals.

Using the arranger as I do, with no bass pedals, I like using more accompaniment tracks, the number of which will depend on the genre and/or the overall size of the virtual band I'm trying to emulate.

The part of the style, I find, that affects the accompaniment the most when changed, is the bass line.

Ofttimes I like staring a tune with a style variation that has no bass or drums, and the bass part is being provided by one of the chordal tracks using a guitar or piano sound, then switching to the next variation that adds a simple bass track with or without drums. The third Variation will have a more complex bass line, and more accompaniment tracks will be added.

Also, sometimes I will go between two similar styles to achieve more variety in a tune, or use a FreePlay style to begin the tune rubato, and then switching to another style.

You could also use style assembly to make one of a style's Main Variations into a FreePlay section, if you don't mind giving it up.

I don't use styles to color my songs, I create songs by using styles... they're a crucial part of what I do ... I never considered, as some do, that styles are a crutch...to me, they're part of the art.

That's the main reason I use an arranger...otherwise I'd just get an XK3c dual manual (or a Nord C2D), get a 25-note bass pedalboard, and a drum machine and play organ like I did years ago.

I like the way this guy, Alan McPike uses his setup...very nice bass pedal work. He also backs up a vocalist on several other clips. Very creative player.

Ian

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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#383525 - 02/02/14 09:48 AM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
It takes YEARS to be able to kick pedals half as well as the modern arrangers do! I'm sure I've lost all my pedal skills and don't care! smile Never was great at it, but passable.
The little Japanese or Italian guy (or Chinese now) in the keyboard is way better at it than I am.
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DonM

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#383528 - 02/02/14 09:51 AM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: DonM]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By: DonM
It takes YEARS to be able to kick pedals half as well as the modern arrangers do! I'm sure I've lost all my pedal skills and don't care! smile Never was great at it, but passable.
The little Japanese or Italian guy (or Chinese now) in the keyboard is way better at it than I am.


I have done some business with Alan not too long ago great player by all standards. clap

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#383561 - 02/02/14 01:08 PM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Originally Posted By: Dnj
Originally Posted By: DonM
It takes YEARS to be able to kick pedals half as well as the modern arrangers do! I'm sure I've lost all my pedal skills and don't care! smile Never was great at it, but passable.
The little Japanese or Italian guy (or Chinese now) in the keyboard is way better at it than I am.


I have done some business with Alan not too long ago great player by all standards. clap


Alan makes me realize just how much the music depends on the player, and not on what keyboard brand is being used, or what instrument has better sounds than the other.

I often listen to his arrangements when I'm programming jazz styles, as he makes a little go a long way. Simple, but effective!

He is not only a terrific bass pedal player, but watching the way he works with that old drum machine is fascinating...and humbling too.

The music just seems to pour out effortlessly from his fingers.

Did you do any singing with him, Donny?

Ian

PS...here's another excellent tune.

_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#383564 - 02/02/14 01:36 PM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: ianmcnll]
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Originally Posted By: ianmcnll
Originally Posted By: Dnj
[quote=DonM]
I have done some business with Alan not too long ago great player by all standards. clap
Did you do any singing with him, Donny?


We did some backing track projects


http://www.standardstrax.com/

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#383568 - 02/02/14 01:46 PM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Cool!
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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#383572 - 02/02/14 02:19 PM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
cgiles Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 6703
Loc: Roswell,GA/USA
I'm really with you on this one. Alan has one of the best pedal-bass lines in the business. Super tasteful. You have to be an organ player (or a would-be one like me) to appreciate how effortless he makes it seem. A really great musician. I sort of wish everyone would click on Donny's link above and read what Alan has to say about himself and about his musical taste. He mirrors my thoughts and feelings so closely that it's scary. Like him, I've admired but never been a huge fan of Sinatra but have never had the courage to say it on THIS board for fear of being murdered (actually Fran is a pretty nice guy so I'd probably only get broken kneecaps smile smile ). Anyhoo, talent doesn't always land you in the big leagues.

chas
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#383577 - 02/02/14 03:29 PM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Chas, Alan's bass pedal playing is so good, he can get away with using his left hand to play fills on the drum machine, and be playing for quite some time only with his right hand...and nothing seems missing!

I studied Yamaha's Electone method and after graduating, I taught it for several years, and bass pedals were introduced from the first lesson. I still remember starting the students with the very basics, the simple swing: "pedal, chord, pedal, chord" or the basic Rumba: pedal, chord, chord, pedal, chord, pedal, chord.

I can/could manage pedals pretty decently if I applied myself again, but Alan's pedal work is just so smooth, effortless and flawless, it makes me feel like I've just started.

Also, his bass pedal work while playing the piano is equally as good, and he just seems to know the perfect places for putting in left hand strings or a pad, and it is never overdone.

The same with the drum machine...basic beats, but his playing somehow masks them and it sounds like a really good steady drummer playing along with him.

Sinatra was always a favorite of mine, especially the effortless way he phrased his singing, and his incredible sense of timing...sheer genius.

I like such a wide range of music, including Country...I even like Barry Manilow, who is an incredible musician, and as schmaltzy as he comes across sometimes, there's no getting away from his musicianship and great piano playing...he started out as a pianist for a girl's dance school...the lucky guy!

But Alan...yep, he is the real deal for sure. There are a lot of great videos of him on YouTube. I encourage anyone who plays arranger or organ to check them out.

A real treat, and an eye-opener for sure.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#383604 - 02/03/14 09:49 AM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
Ian, thanx for the pedal lesson! I never played them, but now I think I can tackle a rumba! smile
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#383677 - 02/03/14 06:11 PM Re: PSR-S950 Style Programming Demonstration [Re: Dnj]
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14182
Loc: NW Florida
Basically (!), it was funk that killed the organ bass pedal player... Most music up to them was reasonably easy to play on pedals. In fact, most bands appreciated the bass part being simplified and cleaned up a bit by the limitations of what you can do with your feet.

But slapping and popping changed all that, and made copying contemporary pop a lot harder for the pedal guys. So it started to die out.

Funny thing is, a LOT of modern pop has got some pretty dumb, simple basslines (the poor kids today think it is OK to just whang away on repeated eighth notes all night long!), and playing them on bass pedals is a doddle! Take Coldplay... Huge band, not the most difficult basslines (on the whole) you've ever heard!

BTW, if you haven't got pedals yet, you can still get your LH into shape for when you do... Put the Bass Tone in the RH section of a split (transpose it back down into bass range). Now, have the arranger just play drums, play the bassline with your RH and work on getting the LH doing the comp and chords, etc..

When you go to playing with your feet, the LH now already knows what to do! RH now does melodies, counter melodies, other comping... and voilą! You are an organ player!
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