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#375132 - 11/13/13 11:38 AM Audya harddrive backup
underdog Offline
Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 72
Hi everyone. I apologize if this has been question has been answered before.
I now have my Audya set up exactly as I want and I would like to know if it as possible to make a complete exact backup of the Audya's internal drive on to another hard drive, so if the Audyas suffered a hard drive failure,I could simply replace the drive with the clone.
If this is possible,I would appreciate any information on how to do it. Thank you.


Edited by underdog (11/13/13 11:59 AM)

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#375154 - 11/13/13 02:56 PM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
necdetdoni Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/03
Posts: 351
Loc: Antalya / Turkey
open back cover of audya
unmount hdd
connect hdd to pc via ide usb converter
choose show hidden and protected system files from folder options
copy files to pc or other hdd

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#375169 - 11/13/13 03:54 PM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: necdetdoni]
underdog Offline
Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 72
Thank you necdetdoni.Can I please ask,is it an IDE 2.5" hard drive in the Audya and do I need to do anything with the new drive (format or put some operating programme) before I start copying.If I copy all the files across,will the backup drive then work exactly the same as the original drive if put into the Audya ?


Edited by underdog (11/13/13 03:57 PM)

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#375188 - 11/13/13 08:04 PM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Henni Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/08
Posts: 3456
Loc: South Africa
Hi my friend,

Yours is a very good idea. Just keep in mind your Audya will not work with a exact cloned HDD. Somehow the serial no. of your Audya and your HDD is referenced somewhere on your existing HDD and no one will tell you how to fix that. Also, some stuff definitely gets stored on your sound board, even some copy protected styles.

Good to have the backup should you mess up some files though.

Cheers mate,

Henni
_________________________
Make sure you'll fly forever!

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#375192 - 11/13/13 10:12 PM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: Henni]
sl72 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 25
Hi.
Henni, this is not true.
I upgraded my Audya with an Ajamsonic ssd. Then messed up the connectors of it. Managed to fix it enough so that I could connect it to a pc. But didnt trust the soldering enough to use it in the audya for live use.
So I bought a new SSd disk and cloned the old one using a free clone software. Everything works great!
The only thing is that you have to format the new disk to fat 32. Ssd disks will only format to ntfs or xfat. So you have to software for that. I found it on google.
I can post what software to use later, if you want to know.

Stian

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#375198 - 11/14/13 01:25 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: sl72]
underdog Offline
Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 72
Thanks everyone for your help.Will any 80GB IDE 2.5" work ok in Audya.
I opened mine today to check and label on hard drive said not suitable for laptop computer.Do I need a different drive for this.
Also,can I just copy everything at once or do I have to copy individual folders in a special sequence.
I am sorry but I am not very experienced at this.

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#375200 - 11/14/13 02:51 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
necdetdoni Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/03
Posts: 351
Loc: Antalya / Turkey
Originally Posted By: underdog
Thanks everyone for your help.Will any 80GB IDE 2.5" work ok in Audya.
I opened mine today to check and label on hard drive said not suitable for laptop computer.Do I need a different drive for this.
Also,can I just copy everything at once or do I have to copy individual folders in a special sequence.
I am sorry but I am not very experienced at this.


yes,80 gb ide 2.5 will work but you can change with a ssd hd via adaptor (i did)
you can copy everything at once..or you can take a disk image with a software (like acronis)


Edited by necdetdoni (11/14/13 02:56 AM)

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#375201 - 11/14/13 02:55 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: sl72]
necdetdoni Offline
Member

Registered: 05/20/03
Posts: 351
Loc: Antalya / Turkey
Originally Posted By: sl72

The only thing is that you have to format the new disk to fat 32. Ssd disks will only format to ntfs or xfat. So you have to software for that. I found it on google.
I can post what software to use later, if you want to know.

Stian

Stian what software did you use for this? thanks

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#375205 - 11/14/13 05:05 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: necdetdoni]
sl72 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 25
http://www.todo-backup.com/products/home/free-backup-software.htm
Used this for cloning the disk. Connected both disks to my computer via USB and cloned away.
You dont have to think about folders. Everything will be identical on both disks.

Stian

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#375208 - 11/14/13 05:40 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: sl72]
sl72 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 25
http://gparted.sourceforge.net/
I used this to format to FAT 32.

Stian

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#375217 - 11/14/13 06:39 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Henni Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/08
Posts: 3456
Loc: South Africa
Hi my friend,

Sorry for the misinformation, for this is what AJ informed me. I speak from his mouth as I put this very same question to him awhile ago. Glad to hear that this is not the case as I would really like to make a full backup of my SSD also.

He also said some info is embedded on the SSD itself which cannot be cloned...

AJ, would you care to comment please?

Keep well all my friends,

Henni
_________________________
Make sure you'll fly forever!

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#375219 - 11/14/13 07:02 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Snoopy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/23/11
Posts: 284
Loc: Northern Germany
Sorry guys,

Henni is correct !

The "serial-numer" of the keyboard doesnīt seem to be much relevant, it MUST BE the HDs serial number !

I did a sctor copy ( with "Acronis TrueImage" as well as with "file-zilla" ) of my original HD and restored it on a new HD.

MOST things work, but NOT THE COPY-PROTECTED STYLES as from the "Pen 2011 Update" or the "UK-Styles".

The same when I replaced my original HD with my SSD :

EVERYTHING BUT the 2011 and UK Updates worked fine.

The 2011 and UK-Pens are copy protected as well. If you used it in Audya once, there is no chance to use it again, even if itīs in the same keyboard with another HD!!!

Lucky who did a sector-copy of the stick(s) prior first use on Audya wink

@Stian : If you did a SECTOR copy there would be no need to format the new HD / SSD, because the restore would palce any bit exactly where it has to be.

MAYBE AJ found another solution... I ordered AJAMSONIC last week and Iīm very corious wink

Edit : Henni was faster than me, so letīs wait and see ...


Edited by Snoopy (11/14/13 07:03 AM)
_________________________
Greetings from East-Frisia ( Northern-Germany )

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#375220 - 11/14/13 07:10 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: Henni]
sl72 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 25
Henni.
Didn't mean it that way! You do a great job with this forum, so thanks.
I am just a newbie to Ketron who stumbeld over this because I broke my ssd.
Why didn't AJ say you could to this? Would you tell people how to copy your hard work?
This is business and he sells it. But AJ is a great guy who helped me a lot. He sent me a new connector for the ssd to.
I am just really happy for buying the Ajamsonic upgrade. It lifts the Audya to a different level I think.

Thanks
Stian

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#375221 - 11/14/13 07:16 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: Snoopy]
sl72 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 25
Snoopy.

I didnt try to sector copy at all. I just saw that my original ssd disk were formatted in fat32. So to be able to clone it I had to do the same format to my new disk. Or else it would not clone. I dont know what you mean when you say it dont work. I use it every day organ

Stian

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#375231 - 11/14/13 08:13 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: sl72]
Snoopy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/23/11
Posts: 284
Loc: Northern Germany
Originally Posted By: sl72
...I dont know what you mean when you say it dont work...


Hi Stian,

when running the Audya with the "copied disk" :

ALL ( copy protected ) styles of the Ketron 2011 Pen Update ( starting with a blue dot ) are displayed as "Corrupted file" and are not useable ! The same with styles from the "UK-Stick".

Replacing it by the original one everything is fine again.

MABE it depends on the keyboard itself ( Iīm using an Audya 5 built in 2010 ) or, as I assume, on the AJAMSONIC Update wink
_________________________
Greetings from East-Frisia ( Northern-Germany )

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#375234 - 11/14/13 08:26 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: Snoopy]
sl72 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/07/13
Posts: 25
Ok. I havent used those usb pens. So maybe there is something with those.
But have you tried to clone the disk, instead of copying it?

Stian.

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#375258 - 11/14/13 10:12 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Snoopy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/23/11
Posts: 284
Loc: Northern Germany
Hi Stian,

yes, I cloned it, first with "Acronis True Image" and second with "filz-zilla", with the mentioned results.

You didnīt have the pens installed ?

Well, thatīs the explanation why your "clone-disk" is working wink

If you ( buy and ) install it now, AFTER the hd / ssd change they will work.

But if you do a clone / copy after installation and restore it onto a new hd / ssd they wonīt work.
_________________________
Greetings from East-Frisia ( Northern-Germany )

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#375325 - 11/15/13 01:18 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Ketron_AJ Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 3583
Loc: Middletown, DE
Snoopy has answered accurately, which falls along Hennie's original answer (not all styles will work) ... however do note that if you did not purchase any of the additional USB or AJAMSONIC, and you simply COPY your original Hard Drive to another HD/SSD for a back up, the original factory styles and older sounds will all work on both Hard Drives.

If you did make a clone of your HD after installing the "paid for" upgrades, your AUDYA will still work (as it came from the factory) ... just not with all the styles you purchased that were 'locked'!

Hope this explains it better.

Thanks,

AJ
_________________________
[KETRON - USA]
Design Engineer & Product Specialist.
www.KetronAmerica.com

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#375329 - 11/15/13 03:03 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Bernie9 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/02
Posts: 5507
Loc: Port Charlotte,FL,USA
Can I assume that you will provide support for the paid for upgrade in the case of an HDD failure?

Bernie
_________________________
pa4X 76 ,SX900, Audya 76,Yamaha S970 , vArranger, Hammond SK1, Ketron SD40, Centerpoint Space Station, Bose compact

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#375373 - 11/15/13 10:37 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Ketron_AJ Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 3583
Loc: Middletown, DE
Bernie,

Whichever dealer that provides these upgrades to customers should be able and willing to provide support to their customers for these in the event of drive failures (caused by normal usage of the equipment). We are already doing so for ours.

It is sad though that these upgrades can't just be produced without 'anti' copy mechanisms ... but in today's market, had this not been done, companies would sell just a hand full, and everyone would have them (as has been proven in the past) and that leaves very little (if any) resources to produce even more!
_________________________
[KETRON - USA]
Design Engineer & Product Specialist.
www.KetronAmerica.com

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#375380 - 11/15/13 01:54 PM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Bernie9 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/02
Posts: 5507
Loc: Port Charlotte,FL,USA
Since you sold me the upgrade, I am in good hands then. Thanks AJ
_________________________
pa4X 76 ,SX900, Audya 76,Yamaha S970 , vArranger, Hammond SK1, Ketron SD40, Centerpoint Space Station, Bose compact

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#375401 - 11/15/13 10:56 PM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Ketron_AJ Online   content
Moderator

Registered: 03/21/01
Posts: 3583
Loc: Middletown, DE
:-)
_________________________
[KETRON - USA]
Design Engineer & Product Specialist.
www.KetronAmerica.com

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#382838 - 01/28/14 09:35 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: Ketron_AJ]
underdog Offline
Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 72
I would like to thank everybody who took time to help me.
Today I wanted to clone the hard drive of my Ketron SD1 (before I tried the Audya hard drive.)
I have connected the SD1 and an empty fat32 formatted drives to my computer with usb adapters
The computer will recognize the empty drive but not the SD1 drive.In disk management is shows unknown Not Initialized 5.59 Unallocated and says you must initialize it to continue.
It is not showing in Acronis True Image either.
I see in google that if you initialise a hard disk,you loose all the information.Does anyone know how I can proceed to make a backup. I certainly don't want to wipe the SD1 disk.
Thank you.


Edited by underdog (01/28/14 09:35 AM)

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#383073 - 01/30/14 03:51 AM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: underdog]
Snoopy Offline
Member

Registered: 05/23/11
Posts: 284
Loc: Northern Germany
Hi,

download "filezilla" ( or "Clonezilla" ), google helps you to find it, ( itīs an ".iso" file you have to burn onto a cd ) and run the pc with this CD.

In filezilla / clonezilla from the new created cd and choose "clone disk" ( or "track by track" ) [I donīt know the ecactly terms because Iīm not at home at the moment... ).

Itīs an "text based" software but that should work ( normally the "default" is a good choice).

To prevent you from data-loss of your existing ( windows ) hds : Disconnect them prior starting the pc from cd ( if necessary open your pc case and unplug the power-cable of the hd ! )

Or try to boot acronis from a "rescue media" ( you can create it in the "advanced" tab of TI ).

Maybe "AcronisDiscDirector" is able to copy your hd...

good luck !
_________________________
Greetings from East-Frisia ( Northern-Germany )

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#383122 - 01/30/14 01:15 PM Re: Audya harddrive backup [Re: Snoopy]
underdog Offline
Member

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 72
Thank you Snoopy. I downloaded FileZilla but I cannot get it to recognize the SD1 disk either. (The same result as with Acronis).
Today I tried Drive Image and this programme showed the SD1 disk as Unallocated and seemed to copy it to the other external backup hard disk ok and when finished,it showed the same as the original SD1 disk (Unallocated)but when I tried the cloned disk into the SD1 keyboard,it wouldn't recognise it.Message in keyboard said disk not formatted.
I tried to format it in the keyboard but it would only go to 11% and showed error message.(the disk I am trying to use as a backup is working 100%)

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