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#371360 - 08/30/13 10:40 AM Touch Keys goes into production
abacus Offline
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Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5050
Loc: English Riviera, UK
The unique part is that it can be fitted to any keyboard (Or so it says) details here

Enjoy


Bill
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English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#371363 - 08/30/13 11:40 AM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10598
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Are you adding it to your Wersi, Bill?

If not...why not?

The concept and application appear very cleverly done.

I'd only add it to an older instrument or, more likely, a cheap controller keyboard...not my Tyros4.

Ian
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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#371371 - 08/30/13 01:18 PM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
Diki Offline
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Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Cost?

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#371373 - 08/30/13 01:45 PM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10598
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
If the price is reasonable, it would be perfect on an inexpensive digital piano like Yamaha's NP-30 (which has Midi and 76 keys).

It didn't say if the pads were removable in case of need to replace.

Ian
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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#371388 - 08/30/13 07:51 PM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
I do not see this as being remotely affordable for a long time.

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#371395 - 08/30/13 09:50 PM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
Uncle Dave Offline
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Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12677
Loc: Philadelphia Pa, USA
One of last years graduates from my school was a music producer (FL Studio, mostly) and he always talked about the "touch sensitive keys" on his controller. Seems like the technology has been around for a while, and he LOVED it. You could slide your finger along the length of a key and trigger different effects. Seems impractical for a piano based technique, but if you're doing electronic recording of synth stuff .. who knows?
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#371398 - 08/30/13 11:31 PM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10598
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Dave,

Many years ago (well, early 80's), a friend of mine had a very strange synthesizer(actually, the keybed/keyboard) was the "strange" part).

It was called a "Buchla", and it looked exactly like this one: http://www.vintagesynth.com/misc/buchla400.php

No velocity response, just variable pressure sensitivity (a teensy bit like one of my first preset mono synths, the Roland SH-2000), but it was quite powerful in it's day and we used it for local CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation) radio work (mainly doing ads/jingles and "do-nuts"). It had a primitive music score feature, and we used a computer monitor (first time I saw one) to program it. Digital oscillators and 6-Voice polyphony were very advanced for the day, but it was tedious to program and required a rather "unique" approach to playing.

He sold it a few years ago to a collector in Japan. We had ended up using my Roland Jupiter 8 and Mini-Moog as they were more intuitive (and slower=more $$$ for studio time).

The Buchla's "white keys" looked a bit like the key covers/pads in this new Touch Keys product.

Maybe it was similar to the one your music producer friend was using? They are pretty rare, in any case.

Ian

PS...I think Diki may be right...it's probably going to be pricey.
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#371404 - 08/31/13 07:17 AM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
abacus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5050
Loc: English Riviera, UK
The article says it is being launched for all musicians, and as the vast majority of musicians are paupers (Or they say they are) it cant be made too expensive or it will fail.

Bill
_________________________
English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#371405 - 08/31/13 07:29 AM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10598
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
So Bill, to reiterate my first question, would you consider something like this for your present arranger if the cost was reasonable and reviews on it's operation were favorable?

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#371424 - 09/01/13 01:18 AM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: ianmcnll]
abacus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5050
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Originally Posted By: ianmcnll
So Bill, to reiterate my first question, would you consider something like this for your present arranger if the cost was reasonable and reviews on it's operation were favorable?

Ian


Stranger things have happened

Bill
_________________________
English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#371477 - 09/02/13 12:42 PM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Lot of if's...

Plus you have to factor in IF the synth engine it addresses is capable of handling the extreme amounts of data being thrown at it. Every single finger you have down will be sending a continuous stream of high resolution data in multiple axes... whether you use it or not.

None of our current arrangers can do that (easy enough to choke them with a bunch of aftertouch, pitch bend and continuous controllers already!) and doubtful if they are going to add this any time soon.

Tons of gimcrack ideas have been floated for the basic keyboard 'improvement' for a hundred years or more. Nothing so far has worked out practical enough, inexpensive enough and easily controllable enough with the exception of mono aftertouch yet.

The thing about all this one does is, sure the idea sounds great, but how do you tell the synth when what you are doing with your fingers is something you actually WANT to do, and what is simply the natural motion your fingers impart during the action of playing? That's really the big question. Is any interface smart enough to distinguish between your deliberate intent and accidental motion? Try looking at your fingers while you play... they aren't necessarily staying exactly where you place them, and where you strike each key depends a lot on what note it is, and what your hand position is in when you strike it, what comes before and after.

This thing seems to want more precision than most of us are capable of, and this may ultimately doom it to the pile of 'good idea, but never worked out' that is already pretty high! That Buchla, for instance! Who wants to play a Stylophone for four hours a night? LOL

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#371482 - 09/02/13 01:25 PM Re: Touch Keys goes into production [Re: abacus]
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10598
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Yes, but one doozy of a Stylohone, to be sure. It could be a real speaker ripper...and it was beautifully made and of very high quality (and a little heavier and more bulky that a Stylophone). wink Plus that cute little Stylophone was monophonic. The Buchla we used had 6-note Polyphony (the equally expensive Prophet 5 was still only 5-voice). The touch-plate instruments (you could get a regular keyboard) are worth much more to collectors, as well as those who like using unconventional controls.

There were incredibly complex sounds that were made on the Buchla literally impossible on any of the current synths at that time (and a few since then), and actually it wasn't that difficult to play. The tuning was very stable. Electronic music composers/performers Morton Subotnick and Ramon Sender managed to use them in live performance. Magnificent clangorous sounds were the instrument's specialty, although it still had a lot of analog warmth due to the design of the filters.

The fault lay in the immediacy of programming, something so much easier done with sliders and knobs on a regular analog like a Jupiter 8, Mini-Moog (or a Prophet 5, for that matter) and, in the studio, time was money.

The Touch Keys idea looks interesting all the same, but I wouldn't dare stick those pads on my precious Tyros4, hence the suggestion of a cheaper controller or an inexpensive digital piano with midi, such as an NP-30. I can't imagine Bill sticking them on his big old Wersi. wink

Good luck to the inventor.

Ian

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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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