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#294199 - 09/23/10 03:58 PM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Thanks, Ian...

Mind you, putting your not inconsiderable weight behind this need, rather than shooting it down constantly MIGHT help it happen

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#294200 - 09/23/10 05:47 PM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10592
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
Thanks, Ian...

Mind you, putting your not inconsiderable weight behind this need, rather than shooting it down constantly MIGHT help it happen



I don't have any sympathy, empathy, or need any excuses for those who can't accept reality.

I wish you all the best of luck on your little campaign. I really do.

Just so you know, I've put in many requests for a 76'er, either in Tyros or PSR-S series. Still do.

The reality is they are not going to make one.

I'm using the words "are not" instead of "No" because you haven't yet grasped the latter, and maybe two words will work better than one.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#294201 - 09/23/10 07:33 PM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10592
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
...Yamaha's illogical decision to ignore this market segment,


I think King Frog summed it up quite nicely on another thread...

Quote:
Originally posted by Kingfrog:
Peter Baartmans did a demo Monday at the store. One of the T4 Engineers from Japan was there. A little language barrier but I was able to bring up the "concerns" of many here (mostly non Yamaha users) Do not expect a 76 key Tyros.....Not gonna happen. Seems to me Yamaha is not going after or feels threatened at all by Roland or Korg or any other Arranger maker. They play to their crowd and most do not want a 76 keyboard in the Tyros by a long margin.

Yamaha does research and apparently surveys current owners as to what they want and provides what they can. PKowner is a good site for information for them as is Motifactor for the Motif...... They seem to peruse the YAMAHA owners forums, nothing is arbitrary. They apparently do not poll Korg or Roland users as to what "would make them consider a Tyros?" Their OWN market is more important to them and primarily the HOME user who does not want a CVP and those who play out that want a light smaller keyboard that can cover a lot of bases. They don't seem to care about sounding like a "live" band. People in their homes don't know or care what a live band sounds like. They want to hear CD like quality. Those who do play out play to an older crowd who don't care about drums....They listen the whole.

One thing Yamaha has they won't mess with are LOYAL users. Yamaha users are as loyal and protective to the brand as they come. Their focus seems to be on CURRENT users not those who might be a user "if".




[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 09-23-2010).]
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#294202 - 09/23/10 07:42 PM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
leeboy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 2144
Loc: Columbia City, IN USA
Gary,Ian,
WOW...I wish somene around here would do the clinics like you are having in your area.
It would be fun! It wouls be great to go to them to meeet locals with similar interests and maybe even visit one a nothers homes etc.

Sweetwater sound is 20 minuts from me and they do a lot of Guitar stuff...but not much keyboard. Once a year they have gearfest and the mfgs do come...Last one Korg and Roland were there with everything including arrangers..Yamaha didn't even bring a T3...only Motif!

Non of the sales folks at Sweetwater know th arrangers and do not demo them. Afer all they are PRO audio and arrangers are not typically used in live music on stage (Rock Groups)

Damn it's boring around here!

Ian...want to move to Indiana??
Lee S.
_________________________
Lee S.

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#294203 - 09/23/10 07:53 PM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10592
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by leeboy:
Non of the sales folks at Sweetwater know th arrangers and do not demo them. Afer all they are PRO audio and arrangers are not typically used in live music on stage (Rock Groups)
Ian...want to move to Indiana??
Lee S.


It's a shame because you have to sell a few guitars to make the same profit as selling one high-end arranger.

I also do on-line followups to clients, and answer any questions...sometimes it's over the phone...I also direct them to YPKO and PSR Tutorial.

Many of my clients have become friends due to the clinics, and help each other.

Thanks for the invite, Lee...Cape Breton Island is a pretty awesome place to live...I'm stuck here willingly.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#294204 - 09/23/10 10:35 PM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
I am still waiting for an answer to how making a 76 is going to 'mess' with Yamaha's current users... (particularly as they ALREADY make several 76's and 88's)

Are they all going to see one and run screaming from the store?

"The sky is falling... the sky is falling!"

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#294205 - 09/24/10 12:30 AM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
abacus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 4839
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
I am still waiting for an answer to how making a 76 is going to 'mess' with Yamaha's current users... (particularly as they ALREADY make several 76's and 88's)

Are they all going to see one and run screaming from the store? laugh

"The sky is falling... the sky is falling!"

As with all manufactures you dont have to prove concept to musicians or engineers, just THE ACCOUNTANTS, and no matter what statistics you come out with, unless you can prove profit with virtually no risk, they will just politely tell you to go away.
So get your accountancy hat on and prove your assumptions and beliefs, or continue to bang your head against the wall.

Bill
_________________________
English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#294206 - 09/24/10 12:51 AM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
Tonewheeldude Offline
Moderator

Registered: 01/21/10
Posts: 1529
It may be that the people who buy Tyros in the UK (and this is a big home user market) have the money available and are willing to spend it on something they enjoy, after a couple of years they are ready for change. It would be a nightmare trying to get them to do a Ketron type upgrade as they are mostly in their late 70s and up. Changing after two years keeps them loyal to Yamaha, otherwise they run the risk of losing customers to the competition.

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#294207 - 09/24/10 01:06 AM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
Kingfrog Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/24/08
Posts: 1099
Loc: Myrtle beach SC
The way I see it is there is likely a $1500 spread between a used T3 and a new T4. Many will upgrade to the T4 just as the T3 outsold the T2. I think Yamaha feels that a three year upgrade cycle places too much of a financial gap between upgrades. A T2 to T4 would be quite a stretch. The additional features may or not be worth the $1500. But if one can afford a $4000 toy or tool they can afford a new one for $1500 or so every two years,

I do this with DAW software. I upgrade every other year because the price is the same. Only I cannot sell my old version. So for $150 I get the new $500 version (which in reality contains many extras and softsynths samplers etc anyway wirth the UG price.

When I finally see the official dealer -10% price I will subtract $500 and someone will get a slamming deal on a T3. In fact anyone who would be in the market for a 910 would be foolish to pass on a T3 for a few hundred more. and I would be foolish not to buy a T4 for a few hundred more than that.

I won;t so the same with the Motif because The Tyros covers based the new Motif has. As well the Motif XS will be getting most of the Software upgrades of the XS, Yamaha wants to make a show of supporting legacy products.

The T4 is worth a look for anyone who is interested. I am disappointed Yamaha added an XLR port but no Phantom power. That is kind of foolish but the European market was asking for this $3 upgrade...LOL. I plugged an SM58 into mine and it sounded just fine with the hi impedance jack.....Yamaha got off easy on that. I would have also liked to see 8 audio tracks of on board recording with the massive HDs available......but still only two and still no direct to USB recording to my knowledge. The flash ROM (from the XF) is a great idea.

I use mine solely at home. It has never seen the light of day outside the house and I have the mike and preamp covered...but I think they should have offered the opportunity to plug an Beta 87 into the thing for live use.
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros 4
Yamaha Motif XS8
Roland RD700
Casio PX-330
Martin DC Aura
Breedlove ATlas Solo
Bose MOD II PA

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#294208 - 09/24/10 05:30 AM Re: Why this early release of the Tyros 4?
kbrkr Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 2816
Loc: Tampa, FL
Quote:
Originally posted by ianmcnll:

One thing Yamaha has they won't mess with are LOYAL users. Yamaha users are as loyal and protective to the brand as they come. Their focus seems to be on CURRENT users not those who might be a user "if".
(edited 09-23-2010).]


I have to disagree on this. There is no such thing as a "LOYAL user". If a competitor has the same product or better product with better service or more importantly a better price, they would switch in a heartbeat. There are countless studies and research on brand loyalty; that is the HOLY GRAIL of the sales and marketing industry.
_________________________
Al


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