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#294055 - 09/22/10 03:28 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Just for once, I'd like to see a list of features that makes an instrument 'pro' as opposed to 'home'.

I, for one, can't think of a single thing on any arranger that a talented home player would not want...

And, I'm sorry, Ian, but I am NOT looking for a truck, when Yamaha DON'T make trucks... Yamaha make trucks. Just really bad ones. I'd like them to make a GOOD truck, as good as their cars. That doesn't seem, to me, to be asking too much...

The thing that disappoints the most, though, in what you post and write is the assumption of the mantle of spokesperson for Yamaha, which you are NOT... I simply wish that your sympathies and empathy extended to your fellow arranger playing musicians, rather than your dogmatic devotion to your chosen brand's policies, no matter HOW unresponsive they are to quite legitimate needs.

I have said, many times, that IF Yamaha made a 76 TOTL arranger, your enthusiasm for it (despite you maybe not using it for gigs... after all you don't use a T3 or CVP either, but will 'defend' them to the last breath) will know no bounds, and you will go 'OF COURSE Yamaha should make a 76 TOTL, it's an obvious need for the home player' or some other form of fanboy gushing...

I'm sorry, but 'Everything Yamaha does is good, and everyone is a moron for suggesting otherwise' is nothing more than dogma. You should show your fellow musicians more consideration than a Japanese corporation, IMO. You have a LOT more in common with us than them, at least. Or at least, I HOPE you do...

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#294056 - 09/22/10 05:44 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10592
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Thanks Diki.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#294057 - 09/22/10 07:23 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
zuki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/20/02
Posts: 4187
Gosh people, cut Ian some slack.

Let's put it this way. A Mercedes dealer (for example) doesn't want a poor man's business and I'm sure they don't frown upon them either. They prefer to cater to a specific demographic, just like Yamaha.

T4 designers stepped outside the box to bring more professionals in the fold. They seem to forge ahead and add just a bit more each time without sacrificing the platform that makes them so successful.

I kind of admire Ian for sticking to his guns. He believes in his product and not for material gain. I think I'd be insulted too if all I ever read is how the styles are for old people, plastic - you name it.
_________________________


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#294058 - 09/22/10 07:40 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10592
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by zuki:
I kind of admire Ian for sticking to his guns. He believes in his product and not for material gain. I think I'd be insulted too if all I ever read is how the styles are for old people, plastic - you name it.



Thank you, Zuki...I appreciate your kind words.

I work for Yamaha because I want to...they sought me out...and, I am grateful they did...they are great people to work for, and were especially supportive when I was in dire straits many years ago. They have a soul, believe it or not, and very high work ethics. It's a well run, beautifully organized company.

Our Canadian Head Office in Scarborough Ontario is run by real human beings, most of which are accomplished musicians.

I would defend Yamaha as I would an old trusted friend.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#294059 - 09/22/10 07:57 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
Dnj Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 39513
Loc: NJ
Quote:
Originally posted by zuki:
Gosh people, cut Ian some slack.

Let's put it this way. A Mercedes dealer (for example) doesn't want a poor man's business and I'm sure they don't frown upon them either. They prefer to cater to a specific demographic, just like Yamaha.

T4 designers stepped outside the box to bring more professionals in the fold. They seem to forge ahead and add just a bit more each time without sacrificing the platform that makes them so successful.

I kind of admire Ian for sticking to his guns. He believes in his product and not for material gain. I think I'd be insulted too if all I ever read is how the styles are for old people, plastic - you name it.



oh boy zuki I see that T4 coming closer day by day .....enjoy it!

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#294060 - 09/22/10 09:17 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
Kingfrog Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/24/08
Posts: 1099
Loc: Myrtle beach SC
Peter Baartmans did a demo Monday at the store. One of the T4 Engineers from Japan was there. A little language barrier but I was able to bring up the "concerns" of many here (mostly non Yamaha users) Do not expect a 76 key Tyros.....Not gonna happen. Seems to me Yamaha is not going after or feels threatened at all by Roland or Korg or any other Arranger maker. They play to their crowd and most do not want a 76 keyboard in the Tyros by a long margin.

They put an XLR jack on the Tyros because "Europeans" asked for it...(why I have no clue. SM58s work as well with 1/4 cables. This "upgrade" made a lot of people happy who believe they need a 6 foot balanced cable and cost Yamaha maybe $2 to implement.

I inquired as to why no phantom power (which would have been a real reason for an XLR jack) Apparently no one asked for that and I figured it is not considered a single solution home/professional "studio" keyboard anyway. (Think Motif) It is a "performance" keyboard used by older people to entertain older people and a home organ replacement for those who yearn for the Lowery days. Neither of which requires a condenser mike.

Yamaha does research and apparently surveys current owners as to what they want and provides what they can. PKowner is a good site for information for them as is Motifactor for the Motif...... They seem to peruse the YAMAHA owners forums, nothing is arbitrary. They apparently do not poll Korg or Roland users as to what "would make them consider a Tyros?" Their OWN market is more important to them and primarily the HOME user who does not want a CVP and those who play out that want a light smaller keyboard that can cover a lot of bases. They don't seem to care about sounding like a "live" band. People in their homes don't know or care what a live band sounds like. They want to hear CD like quality. Those who do play out play to an older crowd who don't care about drums....They listen the whole.

Bottom line is Yamaha will sell Tyros 4 like they sold Tyros 3 and 2 to their fans and 910 owners who will move up to Tyros.
They have sold more with each version, They have continued where others have dropped out of the arranger market. They own the WS market. They already have the Motif for the live players and own 47% of the WS market. Korg's M3 was not match for their M1 or Triton success. Fantom has the Trance and Hip Hop looper crowd. "Kurzweil" is not Kurzweil anymore....

Tyros gets all of Yamaha's new technology first....From there it trickles down to the CVPs and the Motif.

Not to forget this is a TWO year update....Maybe they should have kept it at three? The 910 was a minor upgrade and worth the $50 increase. The Motif XF is a give and take away upgrade. No price increase. Tyros is a decent upgrade.....Is it worth 2 1/2 times the 910? Most of my customers say no by a huge margin.

If I was walking in from the street and after having a Tyros 3 and knowing the 910 would I buy a Tyros? Not at $4500 over $1750. I think either the 910 is under priced or the Tyros overpriced, The gap between is too wide.

One thing Yamaha has they won't mess with are LOYAL users. Yamaha users are as loyal and protective to the brand as they come. Their focus seems to be on CURRENT users not those who might be a user "if"


[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 09-22-2010).]

[This message has been edited by Kingfrog (edited 09-22-2010).]
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros 4
Yamaha Motif XS8
Roland RD700
Casio PX-330
Martin DC Aura
Breedlove ATlas Solo
Bose MOD II PA

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#294061 - 09/22/10 09:57 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
miden Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 3353
Loc: The World
Thanks Kingfrog, that post made a lot of sense.Well at least to me it did.

And it also validates/vindicates (NOT that it was needed imho) what Ian has been saying all along.

Great posting!

Dennis

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#294062 - 09/22/10 10:32 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
Dnj Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 39513
Loc: NJ
Did you ask him about the T4 Vocal harmonizer upgrade VH2?... or did he demstrate it?

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#294063 - 09/23/10 06:13 AM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
trident Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 08/22/04
Posts: 1457
Loc: Athens, Greece
Well, at least someone with hands on, or "ears on" experience. Thank you Kingfrog.

How did you like the sound? Please comment on that. Since you own a T3, it would be easier for you to make a comparison, I think. Did you get excited? Or it was like "better but not that much"?

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#294064 - 09/23/10 12:36 PM Re: Tyros 4 Exclusive
lahawk Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 2251
Loc: Lehigh Valley, Pa.
The scat voices sound similar to the Technics KN7000, and that is now years ago. I guess better late than never.
_________________________
Larry

" Always Do Whatever's Next "

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