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#262642 - 05/09/09 02:42 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
hammer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2397
Loc: Texas
Well, great discussion here. I have two L1s so I guess I could run both and see for myself how much it "improves" the sound. Suppose the "classic" and the "Compact" will make a decent test?

Hammer

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#262643 - 05/09/09 02:53 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14208
Loc: NW Florida
Without two of the same, although it will give you the 'impression' of stereo, you'll lose a bit of the detailed stereo imaging because of the different responses of each speaker....

Stereo has always been about two identical speakers. Anything less is a compromise, although two different Bose may make less of a compromise than say a Mackie350v2 and a Podium 802 due to frequency response differences.
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An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#262644 - 05/09/09 02:55 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14208
Loc: NW Florida
Oh, and few update their PA's as often as their arrangers, Ian Most of us, no matter WHAT we buy, or how much or little we pay, tend to stick with it for a LONG time...
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An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#262645 - 05/09/09 03:28 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
hammer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2397
Loc: Texas
Ian,
I am curious. What type of music do you most often play at your gigs? I can't imagine getting much better sound for an audience than what I have been getting from my Classic L1 and Tyros 3 combo. If we are debating for the sake of a debate mono vs stereo that is one thing - but for practical use I just don't see the advantage of stereo for audience appeal or satisfaction.

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#262646 - 05/09/09 04:11 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14208
Loc: NW Florida
We've had this conversation ad nauseam before, hammer.

However, most of the world listens to music in stereo, whether in their car, on their iPod, on their computer speakers, on their home stereo, or when listening to real live music (if the guitarist is on the left, that's where you hear him play, violins on the left, cellos on the right at the symphony, no matter WHERE you sit in the room).

And, as you have just been reading, several quite important aspects of modern arrangers' sounds suffer when collapsed to mono. Quite easy to hear, I believe (you REALLY haven't noticed it?). So, staying in stereo, the way the instrument is designed (not to mention how most of the world experiences music) seems pretty reasonable. What ISN'T, IMO, is how much a stereo Bose system costs you, compared to most conventional systems of similar output capacity...

Put it this way... I'd rather make a 'one time' investment of $3000 in a quality stereo PA, than a $5500 one
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An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#262647 - 05/09/09 04:51 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
hammer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/27/08
Posts: 2397
Loc: Texas
Diki,
All good points and true. The reason I probably have not noticed is when I started playing arragers about 3 years ago I was using a pair of M-Audio BX5a speakers. Ok for what I was doing but not the world best by any criteria. I changed from them to a single Bose L1. I often use headphones at the house but most of the time I am not playing for my own personal enjoyment but to work out styles or tunes for a gig.

I'll have to setup both Bose systems and see how they sound - even though I would never take both to a gig because I am trying to lighten my load not ad to it.

Hammer

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#262648 - 05/09/09 06:24 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
Oh, and few update their PA's as often as their arrangers, Ian Most of us, no matter WHAT we buy, or how much or little we pay, tend to stick with it for a LONG time...


Not most of us, Diki...I seem to see many on this forum change arrangers every few years (3-5), if not more often...you (and Fran, maybe) might be the exception, my friend.

I like to stay current with the new technology, and it advances every so many years...the excellent SA voices of the S900 lured me in pretty easily, and it will smoke many a TOTL arranger of only a few years ago.

Add up the difference from the PSR-3000 I sold and the cost of an S900 and it's not much money, especially if you think of it over a year or so...a small price to pay for having the latest and best sounding technology.

The same goes for any company, I guess, but, since Yamaha has the the sound I like to hear coming out of my speakers(in stereo, no less) that's going to be my choice.

The last PA I bought was over 15 years ago (my two Yamaha MS-60S, which still work perfectly)...I'm pretty sure the Bose, with the quality that it has, will last me at least that long...certainly till I retire.

Ian






[This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 05-09-2009).]
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Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#262649 - 05/09/09 06:59 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Quote:
Originally posted by hammer:
Ian,
I am curious. What type of music do you most often play at your gigs? I can't imagine getting much better sound for an audience than what I have been getting from my Classic L1 and Tyros 3 combo. If we are debating for the sake of a debate mono vs stereo that is one thing - but for practical use I just don't see the advantage of stereo for audience appeal or satisfaction.



Hammer,

I play a large variety of music, from old country and western, to Latin, to Jazz, R&B, Pop music, Movie themes, even some classical and jazz solo piano....it depends on who's hiring, I guess.

I don't do vocals, but I have several singers I can call, and then I usually sing backup harmony, and maybe a few tunes myself.

Primarily my music is instrumental.

A single Bose covers very well, but the fact that it's in mono does not do my instrument's stereo effects and sounds any justice.

I hear the difference immediately when using two Bose systems...the sound is almost three dimensional, and with the marvellous coverage, it makes my S900 sound awesome. The T3 is even more awesome-er.

As they say, the devil is in the details, and I'm not going to spend long hours setting up effects and registrations, only to have them sound one dimensional in mono.

The Bose in stereo is glorious, and room filling, and perfect for concerts and any gigs you want to have lots of coverage and the sound equally distributed.

I don't need honkin' bonkin' drums, so the Yamaha percussion is perfect for the music I play...the sound of the fills panning from side to side is impressive with the Bose in stereo, and the drums actually sound more "live"....I know I'm very pleased with them.

To really get the perfect stereo with the Bose, it's important to use identical systems, although using the two you have, might do okay, you get the best results with the same on each side.

It's the best money I've ever spent...no regrets.

You know, when it comes right down to it, we are actually "playing the speakers", they are the last link in the chain, and to use a TOTL, or MOTL arranger through a budget system is a cryin' shame, in my opinion.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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#262650 - 05/09/09 07:19 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
btweengigs Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 2204
Loc: Florida, USA
Quote:
Originally posted by ianmcnll:
"....using two Bose systems...the sound is almost three dimensional, and with the marvellous coverage, it makes my S900 sound awesome."

"...perfect for concerts and any gigs you want to have lots of coverage and the sound equally distributed."


Ian... Given the dispersion of sound that the L1's provide, can you explain how seperation of stereo is achieved?

If you have L1's to either side of you, I can understand your appreciation of the stereo effect. But, are you sure that is how your audience and the rest of the room hears it?

Eddie

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#262651 - 05/09/09 07:48 PM Re: First Report on My New Bose L1 Compact
ianmcnll Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 10606
Loc: Cape Breton Island, Canada
Eddie,

I put a Bose on either side, about 8-10 ft behind me, and it sounds excellent.

It's weird, but because the way the Bose covers the room, the stereo effect seems to be more equidistant than a conventional sound system...it really does sound almost three dimensional.

It sounds the same up close as it does 100-200 ft away....I really can't explain it because I'm no expert on acoustics, but I do know what I hear.

I play one of my MIDI files and walk around the room, and it sounds really, really good everywhere.

I also don't do any extreme hard panning of sounds either, and that may be helping as well.

The biggest draw for the Bose, especially for concerts, is that everyone hears basically the same thing at the same volume, no matter where they are sitting.

I think a single Bose is perfect for a guitar player/singer, but for our stereo arrangers, you really should be using two...and, sure it's expensive, but so is a decent arranger, and judging by the number of people looking to buy the Audya, and the bunch that bought T2's and T3's, people don't mind spending money to have what they feel is the best.

To play a great instrument through a pair of cheap, questionable quality speakers is a crime....they should be the best we can afford.

Ian
_________________________
Yamaha Tyros4, Yamaha MS-60S Powered Monitors(2), Yamaha CS-01, Yamaha TQ-5, Yamaha PSR-S775.

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