After tonight's gig I won't be quitting my day job for a full time one in music. I had the worst experience I've had in the 3 plus years I've been playing gigs. Tonight's gig really put into prospective the respect I have for those of you who do this full time.

Here's what happened, a friend of mine and OMB, booking agent and sometimes leader of a big band set up me for a great paying gig for 4 hours. (not a member of SZ). He has done this gig for years but had another one so he was nice enough to ask me to play it.

Here's where the trouble started. The gig was in what use to be a very large funeral home, but converted into a restaurant. It's a beautiful old historic building and in it's day I'm sure it was a considered a mansion. There are power problems in the building because the waiter tells me not all the outlets work. Anyway I plug my equipment in, then fire up the Bose and there's a POP. Gotta be a fuse, but I don't have any fuses with me. No problem I live about 15 minutes away and have plenty of time to get the Barbetta. 30 minutes later I'm back and plug in the Barbetta OUCH!!!! There goes the Barbetta, it blows a fuse. No problem there' a Radio Shack 8 blocks away. I get a 4 pack of fuses for the Bose, but not the Barbetta

I attempt to mount the new fuse into the Bose, when I finally get it in it still doesn't power up. But seems I've screwed up the plastic housing where the fuse sits. DAM I'm not having a good night and I'm now in the middle of " "Nightmare on Broadway" Another trip to Radio Shack, get the fuses, get the Barbetta fired up. It's now 8:30 PM I was scheduled to play from 6:30 to 10:30 PM. Started on the wrong foot, but got the crowd doing some Christmas sing alongs, played some dance music, the laptop wasn't necessary it was an older crowd, but had the laptop to do a DJ role just in case. The pay for the job was renegotiated, I ask the customer were you happy she said no, "I was not happy, you didn't fire up the crowd enough for the Christmas singalong. Oh it's not your fault your friend usually plays this and we really like him. OK, thanks lady, now I'll crawl back into my hole and disappear

As I say I have new found respect for people like Mikey Maestro, Gary D., DNJ, Don M. Bill from Dayton and Joe Avayla( not sure of the spelling Joe) and any of you who gig full time. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year, now time to call it a day 5:30 AM is just 4 hours away. The good news is next week I'm playing gigs that are repeat business for me, so I won't have to crawl into a hole after playing them Yes there were lessons learned tonight for sure!!

[This message has been edited by Stephenm52 (edited 12-11-2008).]

Stephen
It happens...and, while not your fault that her power was not up to snuff, it doesn't sound like you held HER accountable...which in fact, was the case.

I understand the problem and how such employers couldn't care less about the challenge you faced.

Recently, I quit an Amvets that ignored my concerns about their over-taxed electrical outlets. If I have to share outlets with crockpots I am outa there.

Eddie

Those things happen sometimes! I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. It was the faulty wiring that caused the problem anyway. I always take along a little Radio Shack voltage tester to plug in and check to see if the current is right.

I had a bit of a bummer myself tonight.
I had a banquet for the Sheriff's Dept. at 5:00, then across town for my regular weeknight job at 7:00.
I have two of everything except keyboard right now, so I borrowed HankB's E50. I could leave everything set up after the first party and get it tomorrow, and leave everything at the second job so all I had to do was finish one, hop in the car and drive 5 minutes, walk in and start playing.
Everything went great, EXCEPT, I dropped Hank's keyboard on the floor while I was setting up and mashed the speaker grill. It didn't fall but about a foot, but made a nasty dent in the grill.
I'll have to see if there is a replacement part, or just buy him a new keyboard.
Glad it wasn't an Audya! I made enough tonight to buy an E50 if I have to, but it won't come to that. . . I hope . . . will it Hank?
Normally borrowing stuff is a big NO-NO but Hank is just like a daddy to me and we swap stuff around all the time. Just equipment, not women. Anymore
Oh, before anyone questions leaving the gear overnight, it's in the middle of the Sheriff's substation, locked, fenced and guarded!
DonM

P.S. By the way, Bose L1 owners, you may want to order a couple of spare fuse holders. I had one break and there is no place to get them except Bose. They are quite inexpensive, in fact they sent me a couple free. Can't be too careful

Steve...I couldn't resist plugging into your story here, especially since I'm presently in a writing mood. You confirmed that I made the right decision to cut my schedule in half in Dec/2006. Can't deal with the "attitudes" any more. It was easier to "tighten my belt," accept a pay cut and spend more time at home enjoying myself playing the piano.

Lucky

[This message has been edited by Lucky2Bhere (edited 12-14-2008).]

I'd really like to see this thread used as a platform to indulge other members here as to how they're adapting to the "new" audiences.

I've been a full time musician all my life and never thought I'd see the day when musician's became 2nd class citizens!

Anyone else feeling the crunch? Relative to what it used to be like!

Lucky

Moral of the story....

never use an Agent

I try to carry a spare everything in the van, spare amp, spare mic, etc.. At one point I even had a spare keyboard in a box, but I stopped carrying it along because I've never had a complete keyboard failure--ever.

As for being treated badly, that happened a couple times, but you just smile, take the check and say goodbye. These things happen, and more often than not when booked through an agent. Agents, at best, are frequently a pain in the ass. And, in this part of the world they tend to collect a very high fee, often as much as 40 percent. That's one of the many reasons I no longer book through agencies.

Gary

I have much respect for you guys that do this full time. I did the full time musician thing for a few years. The money was really good too.., but man the hours and stress can eat at you pretty fast. I did most of my playing in a group.., but did the OMB for a while. OMB was much easier IMO..., because with the group we had to schedule our practice sessions.., and they changed EVERY 3 hours because something somewhere was going on with another member... It was just nuts.., but the pay was good.

I think it's safe to say we've all run into some crazy issues such as this one posted here... I've got a few horror stories myself... Try having a beautiful (just a few months old) Korg Trinity..., and some dipsh&%^ (during the groups break) climbs on the stage (drunk) and spills a bottle of beer on your keyboard!

Much respect to you guys that continue to do this. I know that even now with the wife and child.., and other obligtations I don't even have the desire to do it part time. I still get calls and emails though asking me to sit in for this.. Pick up this regular gig (but just on weekends).... Thanks but "no thanks".

Steve,

Sorry to hear about this one.

One more point to make. When booking a job, I am a stickler for managing expectations. I work a lot with Brides, Brides mothers, event planners, etc. it is MANDATORY for me to find out what they expect from me and what I expect from them in terms of facilities, schedule, sound, lighting, location, and the program. If I don't get that information (and it's in my contracts), I don't do the job. If I do a club and the owner expects me to pack the dance floor for 4 hours, then that's what I do.

The other thing you should look at Steve, is a power conditioner for your setup. I always use an ARC Power conditioner which maintains good clean power for my keyboards and amp. Make sure it's the right wattage (1000) for your equipment. I'm sure you've learned this lesson now! LOL

------------------
Al Giordano
Visit us at ARRANGER WORLD! http://www.arrangerworld.com

Korg Pa2xpro, Roland VK8-M, DW Collectors Series Drums, Roland TD-12 Vdrums, Roland SPD-S.

I feel your pain, pal!

My contribution to this thread is a story about an agency gig that was dropped on me on the morning of the day of the event. Mind you, this was less than 3 months into me doing this full time, and if I only knew then what I know now, lol...Anyway, Agency out of Cbus calls...another guy got sick, could I drive to Columbus in time for an afternoon business party? Party started at 5:00pm, yes, I can make it. Got the directions and contact info. I went to my 1st gig that afternoon in Dayton, then headed straight to Cbus.

The description provided to me by the agency was, "very basic holiday party from 5-7...yes, they want vocals."

I arrive at the club, meet the contact exchange pleasantries and set up with time to spare. At 5:00pm I begin to play some Christmas songs...mixing a few non holiday jazz things in to break it up a bit...I notice that people are looking at me kinda funny, which I'm used to, but something was up and I didn't know quite what.

Finally, the contact strolls over to me and says "Bill, you're brilliantly talented and have a great voice, but didn't the talent agency tell you what group you'd be performing for?" I explain that I'd gotten the call at the last minute and things had been rather rushed to put this together. The she says, "Ok, you're performing for a jewish business association gathering. I suggest you stick to the non Christmas stuff, ok?"

I felt like a fool and appreciated the grace with which she handled it. She said she totally understood how things had been rushed and that no one was offended at all.

2 hours work, $300 plus a $50 tip and an annual stream of private parties from that night...(Non agency, of course, lol...)

Carry on!

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Bill in Dayton

[This message has been edited by Bill in Dayton (edited 12-12-2008).]

[This message has been edited by Bill in Dayton (edited 12-12-2008).]

Great experiences!

I just want to ad my recent tales to the bunch...

For more than 5 years I have been playing my KB at 3 venues weekly. I am a VOLUNTEER OWB (one woman band).... My venues are all Senior citizens....

I went on a 5 month trip this Spring and Summer. When I returned to resume my gigs there was a new administrator at my oldest gig.... She fired me and all others who played there on other days.... She sent the 2 old resident dogs packing and ordered no stimulus of any variety during meal time!

Another of my venues, also voluntary had replaced me with a group I have often played with... single instrument players. I was told they did not want me to join them as they did not like the styles on my KB. When I asked them, they all denied saying that..... HOWEVER.... they did not ask me to join them.

So now I have 1 gig each week and I am glad to have it... two more would be too much right now and probably forever!

If you are getting paid fine. If you are not it is just as fun to volunteer if you love entertaining an audience with your music and snappy patter.
ELIZABETH TECHNICS player

haha my Day & Night job is music

Steve,

Sorry to hear about your horrifying job, especially the slam from the classless girl - who needs that??? I'm sorry for you to hear about that rude remark.

Working full time music takes a huge toll. It takes a full time practice commitment. I don't believe there's a way to work another job and cover every music scenario like you encountered. You are gainfully employed and it's a tough road that way.

Remember, no matter how good you are or how hard you prepare for someone, there is always someone who likes someone better and it could even be non music related! Not everyone likes Stevie Wonder or Frank Sinatra.

But keep going for it. Don't let this immobilize you. I never let myself have 2nd thoughts after a bad job, because an hour later I might be the toast of the town

The reason I bomb at a job is because I have not prepared for it. I know I have a long way to go to cover ANY room. It all boils down to music selection and a complete songlist - simple as that.

This is the start of my 3rd full season of full time playing. I've weened out the jobs that could care less about talent, or have ridiculous ADs/mgmt running the show. The result is having enough qualified jobs who pay and appreciate you. That said, I never let my guard down (talented competition out there) and am finally finding time to practice as much as I need to.

Anyway Steve, thanks for sharing. I hope we all made you feel better

Thanks for the comments and the feeback. It certainly was a learning experience and you folks who are in the trenches everyday have good advice. Zuki and Eddie Shoe leaving your names out as one of the full time pros was not intentional. Today is a new day, I wiped the dust off and look forward to the coming weeks gigs I have scheduled.

Gary on the spare equipment, if I had known there was a chance the Barbetta would go I would have taken the Roland amp back to the gig with me. Who would have thought the Barbetta would go out too. You can bet my equipment case now has spare fuses in it LOL.

The better news is my day job is located 20 minutes from the Bose repair facility in Framingham. I've been on the phone with Bose tech support and I'll be delivering the base unit to them today for repair. With any luck I'll have it in time for next week's Thursday, Friday and weekend gigs.

[This message has been edited by Stephenm52 (edited 12-12-2008).]

Steve, sorry to hear about your night ... knowing you, I KNOW you wouldn't try to put the blame on the client for the faulty electric ... Is this the venue the party is usually at? ... if so, how does the other guy manage? ... Also, Ii would like to know the name of the place in case I get a gig there ...
t.



Not necessarily true ...
Although there are a LOT of bad agents stories, I get a fair amount of work from an agent and I would say that 99% of the experiences are good ... The 1% generally comes in when he doesn't tell me something about the gig, like playing for a Jewish holiday party , or that the bride wanted some 'off the wall' first dance (happened only once, but that was enough). ... Now if it is a wedding or a private function of that sort, I tell him that I want to speak to the client to work out details, special requests, etc. ... The upside can be NOT having to deal with a lot of the clients ... go in, set up, play, leave, get check in mail - eventually ...

t.

1- Book your own work

2- Let your talent be your calliing card

3- Make them "come to you" always

4- No Agents

nuff said...

Donny ... all good points ... but ALL not NECESSARILY so for ALL the people ALL the time ...
'"nuff said"

t.

BB ... that is a REALLY tough situation ... hope you are better real quick !

t.

BB, talk about a bad gig!! I wish you the best and hope you can get out there playing soon.

Stephen please remember My equipment is here for your needs if yours is not repaired in time for the next gig.

God Bless good Buddy

------------------
God Bless,
Mikey

www.mikeymaestro.com
www.myspace.com/kidconcert
www.balloonanimal.com
www.1000colorcards.com

T.

many just dont give a crap......& want everyone else to do the hard work for them & they're only concern is the almighty dollar...on top of that they are lazy and won't improve their act enough so that they will be in constant demand & would never need an agent (mostly used for small acts locally if the venue soley books thru an agent) because they think in their mind they are too good when it's the opposite.....you gotta soar above the rest & stop being like the rest.

"If you have it ....They will come"

d.



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 12-12-2008).]

Hope that's not serious and is just a temporary thing. In the meantime, might as well milk it for all it's worth. Like if you happen to forget your anniversary or your wife's birthday. Also, it could possibly do permanent damage if you continue to have to take out the garbage.....surely your wife can understand that .

Kidding, of course. Get well soon.

chas

Guys, Thanks for sharing...
Very interesting...for sure.
I'm still practicing to see if some day anyone would want to pay me to play!

I'm 60, so still have some time (good lord willing)

All the best to everyone out there.
BBBB, get well soon!

PS. Wish I had someone close here to tutor me some!!! :-)

Lee

Wow - I gotta say guys, it's VERY different here in the land of Oz. We book PRIMARILY through Agents as they often look after the bigger Clubs/Gigs/Corporates. They only take 10%-15% commish (MAYBE 20% although I personally don't know of any) and they often ensure a DECENT gig, that is, (usually), our best experiences have been Agency gigs, and the worst, Client to Artist bookings...

Don't get me wrong, we book direct as well, and we're not absolutely Pro-Agent, but we find if you just deal with a handful of trusted, honest Agents, life is gravy.

You make it sound soooo easy! Don't care how terrific one is, they still have to exercise all the marketing tools to stay constantly booked, at least in this area of the country.

Zuki as in any marketing strategy 101....

Supply & demand...if they ain't demanding "YOU" SOMTHING IS WRONG with your product, it's either LESS then all the rest or SAME as the rest & that is NOT Good enough if you want to make it as a Pro Musician in this business my friend plain & simple.

I have 437 jobs booked for 2009. I am in demand, but it doesn't come from sitting on my ass at home and waiting for calls - my point!

1- how many of these jobs are 1 hr?

2- what is the average hourly rate?

1 - 2 hour gigs.

About the same as you earn.

OK...Good luck in 2009 Zuki

Thanks Donny - you too

I owe a lot to you for your help as I started out in February 2006. Your willingness to go overboard on any and all my requests will always be appreciated.

Your very welcome...I know you'll do very well out there.

Have a great Holiday!

I wish I could find someone to tutor! Seriously, my kids aren't interested. I could pass on a lot of know-how. I'm afraid arranger play as we know it is a dying art.
DonM

Zuki-That's terrific given how long you're been at this...

Q: How much do you sing during your performances?

The reason I ask is because there is an act or 2 in Dayton and a few more in the Pittsburgh market (my home town-family still lives there) that exceed 400 shows per year (one claims to exceed 500). I hear a steady stream of criticism towards these acts because vocally they often aren't at their best. Some AD's have said they almost feel cheated if their voices aren't in good shape when these acts perform for their residents. Frankly, there's more negative chatter about these acts being in poor voice or appearing fatigued on stage than positive remarks about "how busy these guys are..."

I've done as many as 430 shows one year...I'm prone to pretty severe bouts with allergies from time to time that just kills my voice. I've added more and more instrumental material through the years but for me, you get much past 400 jobs a year and its too much. I turn a fair bit of work away because time with my wife & kids is really appealing. For example, in the last 3 years, I've walked away from a few clients on Friday nights because my wife & I love to go watch our middle daughter perform with the high school marching band. We travel to all the away games, competitions and invitationals. Its awesome and I'm not missing that stuff...

Regards-

------------------
Bill in Dayton

[This message has been edited by Bill in Dayton (edited 12-13-2008).]

A legacy is remembered its not enough to just tutor or take lessons.....you have to have REAL LIFE MUSICAL EXPERIENCES to absorb from others & that is whats gone from main stream society........just thank the lord that you have the gift of Music & can share it with others while your here.

Hi Bill,

When my voice fails one day, I'll be the first to admit. I've sung correctly, since I was 14 and have no problems singing 90% of my hour performance. I never get sore or unable to reach notes.

In 2007, I played over 500 gigs and will probably so do again. However, I am only playing about 8 times total on the weekends and trying to keep Friday nights open also.

2009 should be fun. I have some new things up my sleeve to make it increasingly interesting.

Life goes too fast to work 7 days a week. No more....

Donny, Would you NEVER take a gig through an agent??? Suppose a reputable agent calls you and says "I've got a 2 hour gig for you 2 miles from your house and it pays $1000.00." .. would you NOT take it because it is through an agent ?!?!? ....
Just askin',
t.

t.

My thoughts on this subject cannot be discussed here on SZ but I will gladly speak with you in private......give me a shout sometime.

d.

I joined an agency group last year for $79 - 3 months. I got 2 bookings for $700, so the roi was sufficient. I let the membership run out, but may join again to add an extra buck or two.

Like Tony says, who knows what could be lurking as an opportunity. I leave all options open these days.

Stephen,
My biggest problem is the turn over of the folks who do the hiring. I play basically senior gigs - will do about 200 of them this year and just about time I get established with a place the AD leaves and I get to start all over with a new person.

Some of the places I play use an agency who has tried to "wrap up" the senior venues but I told them I wasn't interested in sharing my fee unless they wanted to pay me a hell of a lot more.

I guess my worst gig experience happened about 40 years ago. I got in a car along with 6 other players and 2 other cars, drove from Dallas to Alburque-about 14 hours with trailers-for a gig and when we got there we found out we were a week early. We got paid for the gig and returned the next week and got paid again.

Hammer

That's...remarkable...500 gigs...

Given our proximity to each other, we really should hook up some time soon...



------------------
Bill in Dayton

DonM,
I live in N.E Indiana...are we close??
Lee

Don lives near Shreveport, LA, which is the other end of the world from Indiana.

Gary

Hammer I hear you on the turn over of ADs, more it's common here where I live as well. Unfortunately 2 ADs who were fans of my performances recently left and as you say time to start over.



Mikey many thanks I appreciate the offer! Looks like my Bose has been repaired and is being shipped back to me. Since my office is just a short drive from the repair center I should have it back in plenty of time for this coming Thursday evenings gig.


[This message has been edited by Stephenm52 (edited 12-13-2008).]

Not really. I live in northern Louisiana. A little far for a casual drive!
DonM

In more ways than distance !!! ...

t.

Another problem is with the 'contracts' agents work out with certain venues ... I was on the cusp of at least one monthly gig a month at a very nice local CC ...worked 2 gigs ... lots of compliments, members were really happy with the addition of live music at members functions, the manager loved it, etc., etc. ...
The agent who has a 'contract' gets wind of it, and I'm out of a gig, and one of his guys has it ..
t.

Thanks Stephen for posting this interesting story. It sure makes me glad I don't perform... although, the songwriting biz is certainly not a bed of roses. Lots of competition and few places to "peddle" one's wares without knowing people in high places and having tremendous talent.

Hey Don M., I'm hoping to pick that brain of yours some more at the Shreveport Jam. There are so many things I don't know about arrangers that would probably make songwriting and recording even easier. I never use registration memory, can you show me some straightforward approaches? Right now, I just re-play and re-cut a song until I'm satisfied... including vocals, from scratch. Dave Rice
http://www.showcaseyourmusic.com/DaveRice

I guess what I've seen in the last 10 years is the reduction of the respect that top musicians get around here. Part of that is because the liquer laws changed, making a restaurant liscense available at very little cost. All of a sudden, instead of 6 or 7 major venues, every local place was a candidate as a music venue. Music became part of the mix, and not the primary draw. These are local spots, where it's part televised sports, part food, sometimes darts and then music. Add to that a supply of several hundred "pickers and grinners" all willing to work the 25 available jobs for little or nothing. Price is a more important "decider" that talent. Then, there's all the horn players playing over tracks. Most could never work with a band because of timing problems, but simply spend the night working for nothing and playing "catch-up" with their tracks. Many advertise themselves as offering "live jazz", which is an insult.

House jobs have all but disappeared. Many places change entertainment nightly, but don't bother to advertise, so they're not taking advantage of the individual "draw" factor.

Finally, instead of letting talent prevail, many musicians use politics....begging for work and using reduced pricing only to secure
jobs and generally, reduce the status of those serious about the art of making music.

My only salvation is longevity...I was here long before things went "south" and get the choice "society" and restaurant jobs. It's certainly not all talent, but things like billing clients, instead of trying to get paid at 1:00 PM on a busy Saturday night, always showing up and delivering what's needed and handling all business issues professionally.

It's a different day, for sure. House jobs pay about the same as they paid in the 70's.

And the "bottom feeders" have negatively impacted everything.


R.

Dave, speaking of Songwriting - what do you think of TAXI?

Hi Hellboy:

Sorry to be so late in responding. I'm in the middle of a project that is taking up more time than I planned.

What do I think of TAXI? I suppose it is a valid service for those willing to pay to join, then pay to pitch each song submitted. I've heard stories from both sides of the coin. Some who praise the reviews and success they've had submitting a song... and on the other hand, those who've really been jerked around, spent alot of money getting a new demo prepared, only to have the reviewer deny that he/she requested it.

As for me, I can live without it. I don't need an "intern" to tell me whether a song is good... or not so good. Songwriters have too many expenses without adding more cost to the "pile." It is a time consuming, risky business with sharks around every corner.

Hope I answered your question. If not, please let me hear specifics in a PM or E-mail.

Regards,

Dave