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#239308 - 08/03/08 03:15 AM Using an arranger with a sound module
Nick G Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 1042
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
is anyone using an arranger keyboard synced to a sound module or synth?

i am looking at buying a PSR S900 and syncing it to my motif XS for the sound output.

just wanted to get some ideas from some people who have experienced this?

thanks
Nick
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Roland G70 / Roland BK9 / Yamaha Motif XS6 / Logic Pro X

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#239309 - 08/03/08 06:13 AM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
zuki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/20/02
Posts: 4230
Loc: Michigan
Interesting. I don't have an answer and I'm about to hook up a JV 10101 (module) to the PA800 (controller) to use as a sound source for my AX-1.

Never an end to the new many things that can be accomplished musically - fun!!!!
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Korg PA3X / Yamaha P125 / Yamaha MX61 / QSC 8.2s / Zed mixers / Blue mics / Roland BR800

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#239310 - 08/03/08 07:53 AM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
Bluezplayer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2195
Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY
I've done it using a Motif ES and both the Tyros 2 and One Man Band as the style hosts.
It works but it isn't plug and play, meaning that you'll have to some tweaking to get the sound module to sound right. A lot of times you have to manually setup the drum patches, because the ES doesn't "read" the drum bank patch data as sent from the Tyros 2.

Also, you need to know that the megavoices aren't always set up the same from board to board, meaning that all you're going to get on some of the megavoice driven styles are very high pitched sounds, or in other cases you will hear megavoice effects, only the wrong effects, when you use what appears to be the corresponding megavoice on the Motif. At least it's that way with the Tyros and ES. There is an app from Michael P Bedesem that "fixes" megavoice styles so that the mega data is eliminated. When I use T2 styles with the ES I use the modified ones, where the megavoice data has been removed.

It isn't the ideal situation if you plan on using the XS and S900 in a live setup, but it can work in a studio.

I actually find it better going from One Man Band into the Tyros 2. A real easy shortcut exists for taking converted styles and getting them to sound pretty good without a lot of effort. I load them up in One Man Band while I set the T2 up so that it does not accept Patch and Bank data changes. Then I pick a similar style on the T2, and call it up on the board. The OMB style will now send the style data, while the T2 is set up with the right instruments and corresponding effects. It isn't always perfect, because for instance, channel 12 of a PA80's rock style might call for a piano, while the corresponding style on the T2 uses a guitar, but somehow it usually comes out sounding ok anyway, and sometimes makes for more interesting variations. All I can tell you is that it works aand almost always sounds much better than trying to load the same untweaked style directly in to the T2, where the T2 will try to pick the right instrument ( usually a default XG patch ).

If the XS has the scene store function like the ES, you could pretty much do the same thing. I used it when I used OMB and the ES together,. The caveat of course is that you have to manually select the best sounds yourself and then store the scene. I have several stored up.

Hope all of this helps a little.


Regards,

AJ




[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 08-03-2008).]
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AJ

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#239311 - 08/03/08 07:54 AM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
Impuls Online   content
Member

Registered: 02/24/02
Posts: 574
Loc: Netherlands
I use a Roland VK8m module, in combination with my Tyros 2.

Impuls
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Genos,Nord Electro 5D

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#239312 - 08/03/08 08:12 AM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 40927
I feel anything that is hooked up to a kb is a pain in the butt.....more wires....more carrying, more hooking up, & of course more tweaking & more problems...especially in live play......as you can see I am not a fan of extra paraphernalia, less is more

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#239313 - 08/03/08 09:04 AM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
The main problem is the 'dumbing down' of MIDI capabilities in the 21st century arrangers, IMO.

I have seen a definite trend towards much less comprehensive external MIDI control over the last ten years or so. When MIDI was around in the first place, it was kind of EXPECTED that you would be hooking up different things to your arranger, and the ability to route individual Parts to either internal or external gear was more common. But as arrangers have gotten better, fewer and fewer players actually need to do it as much, so, as in all things, it's 'use it or lose it'.

If I remember rightly, I was informed that sending external Parts from an S900 was an 'all or nothing' affair, at least as far as the Style Parts go. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you can't send, for instance, the drum part in a style to a much better module without sending ALL the style parts to it. I am not sure about the Keyboard parts, but from what I remember, it's not exactly a walk in the park, either.

Especially if you want some registrations using the external gear, and some to NOT use it.

Roland are one of the better arrangers to allow Parts from the Song and Style section to address external gear on a registration (UPG) by registration basis, but even they forgot completely about the Keyboard Parts, which CAN address external gear on a UPG by UPG basis, but can't (without a convoluted workaround involving the sequencer) select ANY CC0/32/PC#, and can only send the codes that address it's own internal voices. So, if you need to send something that doesn't already exist, you are out of luck.

It's stuff like this that really gets up my nose...

If I were you, I'd download the manual for the S900, and take a look for yourself. But don't expect much flexibility, especially from such a mid-line arranger...

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#239314 - 08/03/08 09:37 AM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
rb293 Offline
Member

Registered: 07/18/07
Posts: 132
Loc: Binghamton, NY USA
I use a PSR900 and a Motif Rack ES. It seems to work fine. Some sounds are better than others but that is to be expected. I also connect my Fantom X8 and it also works fine. With all of that I use different speakers for each board. I use a Traynor K4 and Yamaha MS50 and sub for the Fantom. then the sound module is thru Roland Cube 30 monitors and Samson Resolv 65a with a sub. The PSR900 is thru onboard speakers and the Cube 30's..... I also have expansion cards in both the Fantom and the Rack ES. Overall it sounds really good... Hope this helps.... Good Luck

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#239315 - 08/03/08 11:06 AM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
Bernie9 Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/02
Posts: 4791
Loc: Port Charlotte,FL,USA
I,regularly, use my G70 and Nord Electro, and it works very well for my purposes, which is to assign a keyboard part to trigger a program in the Electro. This is rather straight forward, and even so, I have to trigger the program change from an existing program in the G70. If I was trying for ultimate control, like Diki says, I would encounter many obstacles.
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pa4X 76 ,Audya 76,Yamaha S970 , vArranger, Hammond SK1, Ketron SD40, Centerpoint Space Station, Bose compact

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#239316 - 08/03/08 01:36 PM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
miden Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 3353
Loc: The World
Actually MIDI capabilites have increasd beyond measure. Not just GM2 either.

Which makes these sorts of combinations even more possible today.

And if you get your head around sysex you can do anything on the modern synth.

Although Yamaha do tend to use a lot of CC data instead, which does make it easier to program.

As you would already know Nick, you can still do pretty much anything as they have developed their own CC commands for the many unused CC slots.

Nick, I reckon the PA2 and the Motif ES make a great combo.. The Motif XS and the S900 would be AWESOME!!! Go for it.

I use the PA2xpro with a Motif ES Rack. You can specify any or all of the arranger parts to be transmitted. It is the same on the Tyros, so I imagine it would be the same on the S900.

Dennis

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#239317 - 08/03/08 04:35 PM Re: Using an arranger with a sound module
Diki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 12861
Loc: NW Florida
Quote:
Originally posted by miden:

I use the PA2xpro with a Motif ES Rack. You can specify any or all of the arranger parts to be transmitted. It is the same on the Tyros, so I imagine it would be the same on the S900.

Dennis


Anyone want to confirm or deny this? I was informed that it was either all or nothing on the S900 (and it's unsurprising that a $1600 arranger have less capability than a $3500 one).

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