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#229812 - 03/22/08 01:08 PM
Re: Yamaha SA Sax or Korg Pa2x You be the judge
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Senior Member
Registered: 08/22/04
Posts: 1457
Loc: Athens, Greece
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#229814 - 03/22/08 03:18 PM
Re: Yamaha SA Sax or Korg Pa2x You be the judge
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Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14194
Loc: NW Florida
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I don't get it... Do any of you guys actually listen to REAL sax players?
That Korg demo was unbelievable even if bone dry. And I mean unbelievable in a BAD way! I have NEVER heard a sax player sound like that, all air and wooly, and just plain weird at the legato note boundaries. He's after that Stan Getz sound. Go listen to some real Stan Getz, then play that again. Yuck!
Look, Yamaha may not have that particular breathy tenor sound, but what it DOES have is believability when you play a line. One note does not make a sax sound. Any keyboard out there has decent sax sounds, AS LONG AS YOU PLAY DETACHED. But the minute you string a line together, the SA technology stands head and shoulders above everything else. Everybody else can get the attack of the note right, but ONLY Yamaha get the 'ending' of the note right, because legato and detaché playing have totally different note-offs.
Sorry, Korg, but back to the drawing board....
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!
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#229827 - 03/23/08 02:17 PM
Re: Yamaha SA Sax or Korg Pa2x You be the judge
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Senior Member
Registered: 03/10/04
Posts: 1247
Loc: New York
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Originally posted by TommyF: Donny,
I think it has a lot to do with how you formulate the criticism. Like many others I do value constructive criticism, but try to reread Chony's and Zuki's entries in this thread. They might be right in their criticism but as I see it the sole purpose of these statements are to offend and provoke.
Kind regards, Tommy Definitely not. I was comparing the Korg keyboard to the Yamaha keyboard, not the guy who performed on the Korg. (In fact I thought he was pretty good.) In my opinion the Korg sax sucks compared to the Yamaha. In my opinion as well, the Yamaha drums, pianos, and bass, suck compared to the Korg. Why do you take personal offense to this? Why should I have to post a disclaimer "I'm not here to offend anyone" / "Just my 2c", etc. We're not in kindergarten... To sum up: In my opinion Korg is great at certain things, and Yamaha great at others. At the same time Korg sucks at many things, and Yamaha sucks at others. And I do not judge anyone here on their skills and / or preferences. In fact I think that many of the people who I disagree with are better musicians than I am. But I still think the Korg sax sucks... Could I be clearer?
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#229830 - 03/23/08 02:57 PM
Re: Yamaha SA Sax or Korg Pa2x You be the judge
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Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14194
Loc: NW Florida
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And, to be honest, the SA sax is NOT the 'best sounding' sax out there...
But it IS the best PLAYING, and the only one with any degree of realism once you actually PLAY a line. Which, in my book, makes it the 'best'.
The degree of legato control you have in your technique can go a LONG way towards making sax emulation with non-SA saxes more believable. But most of the time here at SZ, I hear everybody making the same basic mistake of holding a note fractionally too long while the next one starts. A sax CANNOT make more than one note at a time, but the slightly long release time (to prevent single notes chopping off unnaturally) causes great problems when playing a legato line. VERY fine control of legato can make this less apparent, but it's never totally successful.
The SA saxes are the only thing that change this note off behavior depending on how you play. All automatically, you just play... It's amazing to hear.
One can only hope this isn't patented technology, and eventually Korg and Roland (who we see have something like this in the pipeline on their Atelier organs) can incorporate it on to the already excellent SOUNDING (but not playing!) sax sounds...
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!
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#229832 - 03/23/08 03:20 PM
Re: Yamaha SA Sax or Korg Pa2x You be the judge
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Senior Member
Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 6020
Loc: NSW,Australia
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Hi Spalding, well said. Makes one a bit nevous about sharing stuff in general, if it can get hijacked by another forum, & your work gets critized by outsiders. I certainly wouldn't be happy to have one of my user styles put up for critism against a keyboard Factory style. I know they're not as good, but that's why the companies pay expert programmers to do theirs. Users share because, maybe, someone else will get some use from what they've created apart from themselves, you use it , fine, you toss it, the creators none the wiser. best wishes Rikki Originally posted by spalding: and please gentlemen I know the guy thatdesigned that sax sound. He didnt do it for any other reason than to add another sound to the Korg library over at the Korg forum. It is a really healthy forum where members help each other and contribute music, styles and sounds ... maybe we should hold back on the critisism . He did not put up his work to be compared with anyone else and certainly has nothing to hide. We could learn and benefit from people who give of themselves like this.
_________________________
best wishes Rikki 🧸
Korg PA5X 88 note SX900 Band in a Box 2022
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#229834 - 03/23/08 04:36 PM
Re: Yamaha SA Sax or Korg Pa2x You be the judge
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Senior Member
Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 6020
Loc: NSW,Australia
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Hi Chony, I know, but it is still a user created sound being put up against a factory sound. He's included the sample set, so I doubt he's just tweaked an onboard sax sound. Some of the Korg users use the sample section of their keyboards an awful lot. If one needs to do comparison's, between Korg & Yamaha compare a korg sax factory sound to a tyros sax sound. Korg's big enough to withstand critisism. Personally I'm not that big a fan of the korg sax sounds , but this guys sax "sound" doesn't deserve critism. He's sharing his work. Maybe someone can provide a User created Tyros sample set demo to compare it with. best wishes Rikki Originally posted by chony: Please remember that the headline of this thread is: "Yamaha sax or Korg Sax - you be the judge." Nowhere in that post does it say anything about any individual musician - its just a comparison of two keyboards, not a judgement of anyone's performance.
_________________________
best wishes Rikki 🧸
Korg PA5X 88 note SX900 Band in a Box 2022
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