Would you play it on gigs? Would you cover up the name?

Of all the manufacturers, it might be that Casio could possibily pull it off... a 76-key lightweight arranger with the most universally accepted feature set to date... at an incredible price.

One keeps thinking that one of the industry leaders will announce the killer arranger that doesn't have some obvious glaring weakness but it hasn't happened yet. Casio, seems to me, could pull it off. That would be something.

------------------
Bill
Yamaha PSR2000

I'd use it in a minute if it did what I wanted.
DonM

PS: Bill, do you want to go with me today?

As Don said, me too.
As a matter of fact, it would be pretty cool seeing as Casio is always rated at the light end or less professional...
when people heard greatness and saw the name Casio, they would have to think, that guy sure is talented

Kind of like a pro bowler just grabbing a bowling ball off the rack and beating eveyone in the house that has their own personal, customized equipment.

I always liked my Casio boards, a lot!
I think Casio gets an unfair rap.
Of course there is limitations there but you get more than you paid for.

It could happen!

The technology and resources are there!

------------------
www.tagworld.com/vicentelopez


HE'S COMING, MAKE MUSIC, GET READY!

Yep, but I can't, I got a gig. Actually, hmmm, I might go for awhile with you since yours is early. Lemme think on that, I'll call if so.


------------------
Bill
Yamaha PSR2000

I can easily see Casio doing it. The MZ-2000 was proof enough of Casio taking a lead. The MZ has many featurs that rivaled the PRS-740.

Just look at their newer models they have out now. Compare the WK's with the YPG's. There are quite a few features the WK's have that the YPG's don't that are very useful such as voice voice editing, drawbars, way more indepth DSP's, Pitch and Mod wheels (of good quality too), and one HUGE FEATURE that's unheard of in the price range, and that's the ability to load in new samples. NO current Yamaha arranger under the Tyros2 has the ability to do that.

I think Casio has the ability to do it, but it would place the board in a much higher price range than the typical Casio. Folks were not ready for the MZ-2000. It was a Casio that cost over $1,000 with more "pro" features. The newbies didn't take to it because of all the features they weren't familiar with, and the Pro's laughed at it just because it was a Casio.

Time will tell.

Squeak

But what if? What if they built this absolutely kickbutt keyboard and it was priced competitively or maybe even a bargain. That would get interesting.


------------------
Bill
Yamaha PSR2000

Bill,
Grab that model and do a video.
You'd be all over YouTube and the ohers.
I can see it now "The little Casio that could"


Bill, could you handle all that publicity?
The next person that comes along with their video of Swan Lake (part Allegro simplice - Presto) being played on a slide whistle will have 80,0000 viewing hits and 1000+ will want to buy his music


[This message has been edited by MrEd (edited 09-02-2006).]

I'd buy it in a heartbeat! I've been waiting for them to release something to replace the MZ-2000. Geez they could release the MZ-3000, keep the same body, and update the sounds and styles, add a USB port, and they'd still have a killer arranger. The MZ still blows away the PSR's in voice editing, it still holds over the PSR's for real-time control (it has 9 sliders for drawbar control and other functions), had an arpeggiator, and other very useful features. Even though it didn't have a vocalizer it had a mic input with separate volume control and effects assigned to the mic jack.

Squeak



[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 09-02-2006).]

If it was considerably better than what I'm currently using I would buy a pair of them. Thus far, IMO, Casio has not come close.

Cheers,

Gary

------------------
Travlin' Easy

And Gary, I don't think that they would plan to come close.
Adding all of the features that would bring up to par would put them in competition with the other makers building 'pro' level.

They have there own niche with a large enough market for it. I think they will pretty much stay right there.

Guys:

If a new arranger keyboard arrived on the scene (that I could afford) and provided all the things I need for writing and recording songs, I would not hesitate to buy it. I don't care if it is made by Parker Brothers Games or Mattel for Heaven's Sake.

I'm not hung up on brands or manufacturers. All I want is the most "bang for the buck" I can get. In reality, my PSR-2000 Yammie is probably all I'll ever own. Right now, I'm searching for newer styles and "voices" (I call them instruments) so I can spiff up my songs. Anybody got a dobro that sounds real?

All my best,

Dave Rice http://cdbaby.com/cd/daverice

If a new arranger came to the market that had fantastic sounds, styles, 76 weighted keys, superb editing facilities, full ability to record your songs and edit them more like you can do on a PC using eg. Pro tools and also had an internal CDRW, also had the ability to load my own collection of samples into it quickly (not like the slow T2 lol) I would buy it immediately.
If it did say Casio on the back that's not a problem, it's the features and price that matters not the company name.
Then again with what I've listed the price would probably be sky high, although the Wersi and Mediastation have some of these features already.

I agree with Mr Ed. Casio does not seem to have an interest to manufacture revolutionary products.

They surely can hire "a few" professionals and develop a new product. They surely have the funds for that, and they have slowly built a reputation and good enough products.

But competing with the likes of the 3 big Japanese manufacturers means a lot more things should be done, besides simply developing a revolutionary product.

Marketing, sales, support and infrastructure would need to be at the same "professional" level with the product, and also they would have to overcome the "toy brand" reputation, which many of you Casio owners have seen in the eyes of many friends-colleagues. This is not something they can achieve overnight, and this will probably cost more than the product itself.

And then it is a question of ROI. (Return on Investment). Will the hypothetical "revolutionary new product" line be succesful enough to justify the cost AND send Yamaha to the drawing board AND wipe the smile off Michel Voncken's lips AND be profitable down the line?

Or simply releasing evolutionary products is a safer way to profit?

My money is on the latter....
but I secretly hope it is the former
Theodore

Well lets look at it like this..., Take the former MZ-2000 and up the poly (which casio currently has the ability to do), add some new sampled sounds (which clearly they have the technology to due), add a USB port (they've already added them to the WK's and other models), and freshen up the styles (the MZ already has 4 variations ect).

It really wouldn't be hard. Just look at the general specs for the MZ-2000

Specifications
61 full size keys with touch response (initial/after).
64 note polyphony
16 channel multi timbre
MIDI
562 tones (487 normal tones, 20 drawbar tones, 15 drum sets, 40 user programs).
Layer/split
Auto-accompaniments (start/stop, intro1/2, fill in back, normal, next, break, variation 1/2/3/4, syncro start, syncro stop, rit., fade in/out, ending1/2)
130 rhythms (120 preset, 10 use programmable)
Pattern sequencer: 8 part (drum, percussion, bass, chord 1to 5) x10 patterns, up to 22.000 notes,
real time record,
step record
Registration memory (8 sets x 8 banks)
One touch presets (480 factory presets, 10 user programmable)
Arpeggiator
Auto harmonise (12 types)
Mixer function : 14 channels, external : 16 channels, mic/line : 1 channel)
Song sequencer : 17 tracks x10 songs, up to 40,000 notes, real time recording, step recording, punch in capabilities
Pitch bend wheel Modulation wheel Assignable switch
Size (WxDxH) 1150x425x202 mm
Weight 12.4 kg
--------------------------------------------

If the MZ had a USB port, more updated sounds and styles along with a bump in poly it without a doubt will be a contender. Those few things aren't beyond Casio's abilities.

No matter how good a keyboard they make their name will always their curse

CasioProKeys

There you go!

------------------
www.tagworld.com/vicentelopez


HE'S COMING, MAKE MUSIC, GET READY!

[This message has been edited by ViLo (edited 09-02-2006).]

I remember back to the 70's when the name Toyota was laughed at in the U.S., but no more.

Hi,
ask any dedicated Technics owner if they would care if the never to be released
"KN8000"
had Technics or Casio written on the back, I don't think the brand name would matter as long as the quality was there.
I thinkit's the features, functions etc that matter.
best wishes
Rikki

best wishes
Rikki
[QUOTE]Originally posted by SemiLiveMusic:
[B]

Maybe Casio should do what some other companies do. Take Fender for example. They have the Squier series. Even though the headstock says Squier, it also says "by Fender".

Maybe Casio can come up with a new name associated with a more pro level arranger--or even a synth (a synth would be cool). Casio did have a cool synth line in the 80's called the CZ series.

They could make the new name be the Larger label, and say "by Casio" in smaller print.

Squeak

Casio newer Privia pianos are nice. I'm sort of a fan of the Casio PX-555, and I nearly bought one. I didn't buy it because of the 32-note polyphony limitation, but design-wise it's not bad (nice and light to carry, good keyboard action). I'd love to see Casio improve on this with 64+ polyphony and other pro-level features.

I did buy a Radio Shack rebranded copy of the Casio CDP-100 to use as a graded-hammer MIDI controller with my Yamaha 9000 Pro, and yes I did cover over the Radio Shack name on it. I wish Casio would simply call their keyboards "Privia" and leave off the "Casio" label on the audience-facing back (or "Radio Shack" as in my case). In fact I have a Casio keyboard bag for the Radio Shack piano and it simply says "Privia" on it.


[This message has been edited by Esh (edited 09-02-2006).]

never understood why Casio wouldn't put tap tempo
in their kb's..I find it essential for playing what you feel
and catching th next grrov just right..
Miami Mo

Casio's business model has always been about the needs of the masses. The Privia is for the masses that want a decent sounding/feeling piano. The arrangers are OK and very reasonably priced. They will add features like the T2 SA voices or the G70 guitar mode when it makes economic sense for a product that can sell at GC AND at Circuit City and Sam's Club. If it can be used for prosumer or professional uses then yea for us. But the focus has been and most likely will be consumer for Casio.

For me, I would have no problem playing out on a Casio keyboard. My first keyboard twenty five years ago was a Casio and I played out with it proudly.

Tap tempo,to put it charitably,*sucks*fermented goat puss.
What is really needed is a "tempo tracker" function.All you do is play something and the TT would give you the readout in bpm.
Much,MUCH faster!

Hi Bill,

I purchase and play a keyboard for its sound quality, reliability & one which includes features (tools) that best match my personal playing style. Whether it ends up being: Casio, Roland, Ketron, GEM, Korg, Yamaha, Techincs, or brand X, doesn't matter to me whatsoever.


Good question, especially considering the fact that I admit to having done this when I performed on a Technics KN5000 keyboard a few years back. Actually, it was the club I worked for that requested I honor their request, as the club's owner felt the Technics name wasn't as widely respected as a professional keyboard like Roland and Yamaha were, and that somehow the Technics name might detract from his restaurant's prestige. I personally have no problems with manufacters (whether Roland, Ketron, GEM, Korg, Yamaha, Techincs, or Casio) displaying their name & logo on the back of my keyboards (facing directly to the audience), as long as its dislay size is kept within tasteful (relatively discrete) limits, and not merely emblazened across the back of the keyboard in GIANT letters simply to tactlessly promote their product name as a form of FREE advertising.

Scott

Nice metaphor!!!! but who has the readout item you
say would be better than tap..I'll buy one..until then
having tap tempo beats no tap tempo by a goat's
foreskin!!

To do what you require, the computer would need to know the time signature and the notes played, (Half note, whole note etc) however in the future, it may be possible for the computer to read your mind to obtain this information, but we are not there yet. (Fortunately)
Tap Tempo is currently the most professional way to achieve the speed you require, and is the equivalent of 1….2….1.2.3.4 in, that professional musicians and bands use.
Enjoy whatever you play.

Bill

I LOVE the tap tempo feature and use it ALL the time. I can't wait to set the tempo with a floor fool of dancers ... it needs to be right when it starts. It also allows me to set the tempo silently b4 I start the selection.

Well,the computer apparently DID know what it was supposed to know,about ten years ago I'd say.
On the back cover of "Keyboard"(Cover date March 1997-Harry Connick Jr.)is an ad for MOTU's "Free Style 2.0" that featured something called "Sense Tempo" that did basically what I was suggesting.
Now if THAT was possible 10 years ago,I am sure it's possible NOW.

To put it charitably, Tap Tempo USED to suck...... it never was very reliable on my G1000, but the G70 is spot on. Must be the faster processor......

Umm...CraigUk - why did you say this? :

"If a new arranger came to the market that had fantastic sounds, styles, 76 weighted keys, superb editing facilities, full ability to record your songs and edit them more like you can do on a PC using eg. Pro tools and also had an internal CDRW, also had the ability to load my own collection of samples into it quickly (not like the slow T2 lol) I would buy it immediately."

When you have (if I remember - correct me if I'm ...etc) a PAX-1 Pro????

Doesn't it (practically) do all that (and more!) ??????

Unfortunately, I agree. My friends, even those who don't get a bit of synths, know Casio manufacture cheap products.

What I mean, when they come to my home and see the "Casio" name on my keyboard they'll be prejudiced the music the music they are going to listen to will be of low quality.

As for me, it doesn't matter what brand my keyboard is as long as it entertains me. I'm afraid I'm too much accustomed to Yamaha and it is unlikely that I'll switch brands in the near futured.

Regards,
George

I do demo all Brand name keyboards, including Casio, and I would definitely consider it. Since I don't play out, the Casio brand is not an issue, but I have to agree with George I am becoming a loyal Yamaha customer. I will soon sell my Roland keyboard, leaving me with 2 Yamahas. Those sweet voices are hard to beat.
Starkeeper