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#146540 - 06/17/05 01:24 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Vquestor Offline
Member

Registered: 12/14/00
Posts: 554
Quote:
Originally posted by Bluezplayer:

I cannot comment on Forte, except that I believe it may now be discontinued.


Where did you get this information?

As far as best free host to use Hypercanvas,
I would suggest Hermann Seib's VSTHost.

No one here has addressed the .sty file
xg drum bank and patch select issue that
Frank has elaborated upon many many times.
I believe LiveSynthPro is still the only soundsource that will call up the XG drums
properly, and since it is a DXi(and there are
no free DXi hosts that I know of), I would
suggest "Console" as a host.
Of course, to bypass all of this, you would
have the grueling task of remapping XG to GM/GS kits as I believe Frank has done(or is still doing?).

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#146541 - 06/17/05 01:36 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Frank L. Rosenthal Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/18/00
Posts: 1008
Vquestor & AJ, forte Ensemble is still alive and going strong. I like forte since it is specifically designed for use in live performances. I am currently testing a Beta version which should be released fairly soon. In addition, the 2 guys who develop this software are always available to assist their clients/customers - very good customer service. However, forte is not free.

Also, note that forte allows for Audio input so that you can use things like Guitar Effects, Vocal Harmonizers, etc.

[This message has been edited by Frank L. Rosenthal (edited 06-17-2005).]

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#146542 - 06/17/05 02:40 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Bluezplayer Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/10/00
Posts: 2195
Loc: Catskill Mountains, NY
Ok... maybe it was Live Synth Pro, or maybe something else. I know I read somewhere that one of the App hosts was recently discontinued.

That's a nice feature Frank. I think I can do something similar with Chainer, and I do play my Les Paul into the computer at times using Amplitube as my effects rig, but usually hosted in Sonar or SQ01. I like using Chainer as it also has an audio record function, so that inside of Sonar or FLS I can open it up and have the Vst output record directly to it as I play, rather than having to render it to a seperate audio track later.


I have not experienced the remappong problems that you describe V. One reason perhaps though is that I use very few Yamaha styles in the first place. The KN 7000 styles that I use seem to sound best with Hypercanvas, followed by the Roland VA and G1000 styles. Between those and the 25 or so PA80 conversions I use, I maybe need / use 10 or 12 Yamaha styles ( from the PSR 2000 and 740 ) at most, and have noticed no mapping issues with those.


The biggest challenge for me thus far is to try to get Hypersonic and Ravity to recognize GM or XG patch changes properly or sometimes at all. Not happening at this point, although it was a known issue with Hypersonic and BIAB and a fix may ( or may not ) be in the works.

I find both of these to be sonically superior to Hypercanvas, but if I can't change patches on the fly, then they aren't worth the bother in a real time setting. For something precorded, I don't care, because I can save a "scene" for each style or song in Chainer and open it again later at will.

In the end, we can give you the basics to get up and running. Any more than that, and I think maybe it starts to become like the usual fare we see here.. " which is better.. Yamaha , Korg., Roland , etc ". Since each of us has our own ears and likes / dislikes for operating systems, there is no definitive right answer, except that in the software realm, it isn't plug and play in the way a hardware arranger is, but there are many more choices and customizing that can be done to suit your individual needs, and you can get much more realistic in the sound dept.

AJ



[This message has been edited by Bluezplayer (edited 06-17-2005).]
_________________________
AJ

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#146543 - 06/17/05 04:34 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
rikkisbears Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 5236
Loc: NSW,Australia
Hi AJ,
that explains why you don't have the same problems with drum mapping as some of us do that use majority of psr styles.

Hi Vquestor
Actually one of the fonts Frank put me on to
called Pro Vitamin http://www.reasonbanks.com/pvitamin_map2.html
appears to have same drum mapping as xg, even though it's not an xg font.

I was really pleased to find that one even though it wasn't free.
I'm learning how to replace drum samples I don't like in the font with ones that I do. It's an easier font ( as far as drums go) to edit, because of the way the samples are set out. It really simplified the process for me.
In the end, I may not even have one of it's original samples left, but it's been a great template.

best wishes
rikki
_________________________
best wishes
Rikki

SX900, P121 Piano, Band in a Box 2019
V Arranger/Ketron SD2

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#146544 - 06/17/05 04:57 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Scott Langholff Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/09/02
Posts: 3106
Loc: Pensacola, Florida, USA
In a pursuit to make this easier for me and I'm sure a lot of other people, I have taken some of my ideas and some of your ideas and sent them both to Jos Maas of OMB and Norbert Stellberg of Live-Styler.

I have asked to have a step by step for the complete novice in soft synths make it easy by listing step by step how to use their programs along with a specific freeware and demos so anybody can get this rolling very quickly without all the questions all beginners must have.

I'm just thinking about some of the questions I've posed above. You can see I am trying to find square one. I am a player and do well on arranger keyboards or organs. But, the computer techie stuff is such that I don't even know what questions to ask. You all have been very helpful in steering me along on this. Now I am hoping that other people may express their ideas on this post so that Norbert and Jos can make these things as easy to start using as a regular PSR/Tyros keyboard. (Well, within reason anyway.)

I feel this is what I need to get going on this, rather than try and learn each program that is needed to make it work, have the authors of their excellent programs of OMB and Live-Styler spoon it to us pre-novices step by step.

If I can get the steps to easily follow and use, I am very likely to go forward with this project, if not, I suppose I will call it quits again. I've tried this a few other times and quit. I'll bet there are a LOT of people in the same boat as I am in.

Well, it will be interesting to see what Jos and Norbert can do to make life easier for us and to make their products more saleable.

Best

Scott

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#146545 - 06/17/05 08:59 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Scott Langholff Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/09/02
Posts: 3106
Loc: Pensacola, Florida, USA
So, after my latest tests, Jammer Live is now in 1st place. I actually got this program to work using my Tyros kb. It is so easy and intuitive to get around on this program. I really haven't read any directions to this particular program and it's practically as easy as sitting down to an arranger keyboard.

Live Styler is giving me all kinds of grief. Errors reports, it freezes. GRRRR

One Man Band I have had some success with, but I can't get it to work on my Tyros among other things. Ahhh, these learning curves.

Jammer Live has got me very interested now. To be able to just sit down and play, press a couple buttons to see what they do, and it's pretty obvious what they will do.

Scott

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#146546 - 06/17/05 11:01 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
rikkisbears Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 5236
Loc: NSW,Australia
Hi Scott
I must admit I like Jammer Live. It's very straight forward to use. Only thing I don't like, is that there isn't a great variety of styles available. I use a lot of piano arpeggio styles, but I haven't managed to find one.
As for OMB http://www.1manband.nl/omb.htm
at the bottom of the page, Jos has a number of tutorials.
To use the Tyros, I think you have to put it into a NON arranger mode ie a mode that makes it function more like a synth not an arranger keyboard. The manual should tell you how to do it. The info would probably be in the section to do with various midi settings.

I gather midi is via usb? if so
Go to Settings & set midi in & midi out to usb.

Set Device Type to XG

Chord Fingering to Full Fingered

User Interface. I normally set it to P.C. 2 I prefer to trigger variations via computer keyboard.

It might be worth your while getting used to the programs first, rather than jumping in and trying to learn everything at once.

I started off by learning how to use OMB with my Clavinova piano & it's xg sounds . Then when I was comfortable with the various functions, I started to delve into the world of softsynths.
For me, one step at a time is usually best.
best wishes
Rikki
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Scott Langholff:
[B]
_________________________
best wishes
Rikki

SX900, P121 Piano, Band in a Box 2019
V Arranger/Ketron SD2

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#146547 - 06/20/05 08:07 AM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Starkeeper Offline
Member

Registered: 09/16/02
Posts: 1704
Loc: Toronto
Quote:
Originally posted by Scott Langholff:

Live Styler is giving me all kinds of grief. Errors reports, it freezes. GRRRR

I've had the same exact problem with Live-Styler, so it's not unique. Unfortunately the errors are in german or danish.
Starkeeper
_________________________
I play Roland EM20 and Yamaha PSR550

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#146548 - 06/20/05 01:21 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Frank L. Rosenthal Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/18/00
Posts: 1008
Starkeeper & Scott as you know my software arranger of choice is Live - Styler. I have been able to get it to work but you do have to pay close attention to the input/output ports. This is where I have had most of my problems but once it is up and running it runs flawlessly. I use it for live performances.

Jammer Live is a very worthy alternative. I like the others given there are so many styles available. Plus there is so much software out there to manipulate such styles.

I also serve as a beta tester for Live - Styler, OMB, forte Ensemble and others.

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#146549 - 06/20/05 02:50 PM Re: Need soft synth crash course.
Scott Langholff Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/09/02
Posts: 3106
Loc: Pensacola, Florida, USA
Are there any advantages of using the computer keypad as the control buttons vs using the buttons, sliders and knobs on a midi controller kb?

It almost seems to me that it could be just as easy to use the computer keyboard.

The only thing that seems to be a necessity on the controller kb would be the pitch bend.

Scott

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