Why does the single "L/R Out" (sum) from the P120 sound so poor? It sounds out of phase, tiny and thin compared to using both the seperate Left and Right Outs. It does not seem to be properly summed to mono. What's up with that, did they engineer it poorly?

I'm mad at Yamaha... no mono piano samples in their P120....

I was playing the L/R sum Out from the P120 through just one of my Mackie SRM 450 speakers and it was so awful sounding that I thought it was the Mackie. So as a result, I SOLD BOTH OF MY MACKIE SRM 450s TODAY. It was the fault of the ******* P120 L/R sum Out, which sucks. It lead me to believe my Mackies sounded bad.
No wonder the single Mackie SRM 450 sounded so bad when I A/B compared it to the Bose L1, I was using the Yamaha L/R sum out jack which craps up the sound!



[This message has been edited by rintincop (edited 02-08-2004).]

It's about sounds being out of phase when using only one of the outputs.
Terry

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jam on,
Terry http://imjazzed.homestead.com/Index.html

Those Mackies would still have sounded lousy when compared with the Bose L1. The L/R composite output from the board is not a true combination of the left and right output combined, but instead an electonic hybrid, at least that's what Yamaha's tech guy explained to me. You still made a good choice with the Bose L1 and you're not going to regret selling the Mackies--at least from my perspective.

You know, of course, that you can take both the keyboard's left and right outputs and hook them up to separate inputs on the amp and achieve wonderful quality. Many of us do this when playing small venue jobs where two speakers are not required.

Good Luck,

Gary

Thanks Gary and trt,

Yes, Yamaha did not provide mono samples on the P120.

"you can take both the keyboard's left and right outputs and hook them up to separate inputs on the amp and achieve wonderful quality."

I was told by Lee, who endorses the Bose L1 that there are phasing problems when running a stereo signals into the Bose L1. I need to get back to GC and test the Bose with both the the seperate L and R outs of the P120 connected to it and see how it sounds.

rintincop

[This message has been edited by rintincop (edited 02-08-2004).]

I remember Scott Yee saying that the "right" output (not the summed L/R one) sounded better in mono on his psr2000. Maybe try that? or use 2 channels on the Bose and EQ them differently to offset the phasing problem.
I use electric piano saounds more than acoustic and I have no complaints so far in mono.

OK, I went back and forth with a single cable and listend to the Grand Piano 1 from the L/R sum output and then the R output.

The R output sounds rounder and duller, less harsh, BUT still somewhat phasing and it lacks detail (hi freq or overtones?)... I would guess is using the more "Mellow Piano" part of the sample.

The L/R output, which is suggested for mono use is brighter and realy thin sounding, it has more of an exagerated attack portion (you get a "tack-ah-tack-ah-tack" phrasing when you play a scale, not a legato sound), there is not much tone behind each note, AND I notice phasing that sounds like some sort of bad Chorus effect.

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"It has been discussed that a 'stereo piano sample' output only only only sounds good in stereo, if you try to sum or use one channel, it sounds unpleasant.

Whereas ... a mono sampled piano sounds good in mono, with one or two speakers. I learned this in reading about and test driving the Nord Electro piano sounds."




[This message has been edited by rintincop (edited 02-08-2004).]

Though I found using a single R (or was that the L/R) channel better than the sum of the two, neither is really acceptable sounding to me. The only REAL solution (for me) was to go out stereo. Thank God for the recent release of the 'all in one unit' Motion Sound KP stereo keyboard amps: KP200S & KP100S. I use & highly recommend them: http://motion-sound.com/keypro_amplifiers.htm

Scott

Thanks Scottyee

Where did you buy you KP100S ?
How does it sound compared to a pair of Mackie SRM 450s? How does it sound compared to a a pair of Barbetta Sona 31 (35 lbs, 225 Watts, two 8 Inch Woofers)?

I thought the Bose PAS was the answer but it seems to not be suited for stereo digital piano samples.

So, I want a light weight, ready to plug in system. I have been considersing a pair of powered 10" FBT or Yorkville cabinets. I have been using Mackie SRM 450s, which are too heavy and louder than I need. I play solo jazz piano and duets in small venues. I use a Yamaha P120.

Thanks
rtc



[This message has been edited by rintincop (edited 02-08-2004).]

If you have the opportunity, try the Barbetta Sona 32-Cs, 450 watts, 36.5 pounds, 15-inch woofer, 10-inch horn, incredible range, 4-channel mixer, and lots more. I'm sure you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Gary

He's already tried the Barbetta Sona 32c's Gary. He didn't think they sounded pristine enough. He plays Jazz piano basically with a buddy who plays the Bass. Small venues in a quiet atmosphere.

I think the Bose PAS would be his best bet but he would need two of them so he could utilize his stereo Grand Piano samples to their fullest. Either that or sell his Yamaha P120 and buy a Motif ES or S90.

Both the Motif ES and S90 have MONO Grand Piano samples included in the Voices. That way he could use just one Bose PAS system and still sound great.

Best regards,
Mike