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#108520 - 11/22/00 01:43 PM Information about KN5000 please
tonkan Offline
Member

Registered: 07/16/00
Posts: 75
Loc: Sweden
Hi!

I'm going to get an autocomp keyboard with organ flutes that I can assign differentely to left, right and a pedal board.
I checked the PRS740 but if I understand corectely it can't do this, else I liked it. I will also check out the Casio MZ 2000.
Anyway, I've found a dealer that had a used Technics KN5000 that I was told cold do the flute thing. I will go and check it out this weekend.
I would be thankfull to get any input on it. Is it a good board? What do you think about the sound and styles compared to PSR740? The price would be about the same as for a 740. Is that reasonable?

Thanks

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#108521 - 11/22/00 02:35 PM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10423
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Tonkan,
I may be biased (as I am a dedicated KN5000 devotee/owner), but the Technics KN5000 is by far the "hands down" winner in my book. If you can get it for the price of a Yamaha PSR 740 then that sounds like a great bargain because the KN5000 is Technic's top of line board while the PSR740 is Yamaha's mid-price line board. Both the KN5000's sounds and styles are no less than superior. I've owned mine for almost three years playing it professionally 3-4 days a week without a single problem (extremely reliable). Another standout is in its' "ease of use". The buttons, controls, and sub-menus on the 'full color screen' are the easiest (in my opinion) to navigate of all the competing arranger keyboard brands out there. I even prefer the KN5000 over Yamaha's top of the line models: PSR8000 & PSR9000.

I highly recommend the KN5000, especially because the prices have dropped because of Technic's newer arranger model release: KN6000 (another excellent choice but more expensive (1499 street price). The KN6000 has even better sounds than the already great sounds on the KN5000 but for value and price, I think the KN5000 will certainly provide years of satisfaction.

I'm curious to find out "how much" you can get the KN5000 for. Also, check out the prices at Whitley Bay Organs: http://www.whitleybayorgans.co.uk

Good luck,

Scott
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#108522 - 11/22/00 03:03 PM Re: Information about KN5000 please
tonkan Offline
Member

Registered: 07/16/00
Posts: 75
Loc: Sweden
Scottyee!

Thanks for your opinion.

I live in Sweden and I think the keyboard prices are higher here than in US and UK. PSR 740 costs more than USD 1400 here. I would get the KN5000 for USD 1500 and then an additional pedal board, Roland PK-5 for USD 250. It's very hard to find any used PSR8000 or KN5000 here. I think the price for a new KN6000 is close to USD 3000.

Anyway. Does the KN5000 have strong midi features? Do you know if it merges midi in to midi out (if I understand correctely not all keyboards do that)?

Anyone elses opinion on KN5000 would also be appreciated.
Thanks

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#108523 - 11/22/00 04:11 PM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10423
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Hi Tonkan,
The KN5000 includes a detailed MIDI menu screen page where you can set and customize the following MIDI setting:
1) Part Settings
2) Control Messages
3) Realtime Messages
4) Common Settings
5) Input/Output Settings
6) Midi Presets
7) SysEX Bulk Dump
8) General Midi
9) Prog Change Midi OUT
10) Computer Connection
11) Midi Settings Load Option

The KN5000 has three midi terminals:
Midi IN (midi data frm another Midi device)
Midi OUT (midi data transmitted from KN5000)
Midi THRU (midi data directly from Midi IN)

If you want to "merge" the incoming midi data with the KN5000 midi-OUT data then you need to build or purchase a simple inexpensive "midi-merge" box. Just connect the Midi-Out and Midi-Thru on the KN5000 to the two Midi-Ins on the "midi-merge" box. The Midi-Out on the "midi-merge" box should then give you your desired merged midi signal. As far as I know, there is not an arranger keyboard out there which can merge the incoming midi data with its' outgoing midi data without the addition of a "midi-merge" box.

Check out Midi Solutions: http://www.midisolutions.com/prodmrg.htm

Good Luck,

Scott
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#108524 - 11/22/00 04:50 PM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 37440
Loc: NJ
Hi,
I will agree with Scott on the KN5000, it is a super arranger keyboard on a much higher level then the PSR740 for sure. Although at this time I would waut to recomend the KN6000. It seems a few musicians I know are sorry they switched from the K5 to a K6 at this time. There seems to be many flaws in the OS of the K6, one being that when you change from eg: Var1 to VAR2 there is a little glitch and split second delay in the timing of the syles rhythm before it continues to the next variation, making it very annoying to a pro musician. This can throw you off and needs to be fixed by Technics. I almost bought one myself but I am very satisfied with the Solton X1's performance on a whole at this time. You will not go wrong with the KN5000 especialy at a great price like you mentioned. Also the merge box is no big deal :>)

Good Luck

Donny

Donny

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#108525 - 11/22/00 06:42 PM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Clif Anderson Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/00
Posts: 532
Before anyone assumes that no arrangers support MIDI merge, check carefully. I think the high-end Yamahas do, and probably others.

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#108526 - 11/22/00 10:23 PM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10423
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Hi Clif,
Perhaps I was jumping to conclusions to quickly? I am anxious for a confirmation that the high-end Yamaha PSR arranger boards (or other arranger brands) include a "built-in" midi-merge function thus eliminating the need for an external "midi merge box".

Perhaps you and other PSR8000 or PSR9000 owners (Don Mason & Paul Ip?) could check and report back your findings.

Scott

[This message has been edited by Scottyee (edited 11-22-2000).]
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#108527 - 11/23/00 05:35 AM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Paul Ip Offline
Member

Registered: 11/26/99
Posts: 241
Loc: Austin, Texas, U.S.A.
Scott,

I wish I could help in this scenario but I could not because I do not process a top of the line Yamaha arranger keyboard. However, Bob Gelman runs an excellent Yamaha PSR Styles Egroup (tons of messages everyday) and there are lots of Yamaha PSR-9000 owners there that can answer your question. Anybody interested can refer to this egroup URL:
http://www.egroups.com/group/yamaha-psr-styles

Paul Ip
from Texas

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#108528 - 11/23/00 06:30 AM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Clif Anderson Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/00
Posts: 532
Hi Scott

Yamaha has its manuals online. In response to Paul's suggestion, I doubt many PSR9000 owners have their arranger configured so that they can resolve the issue. Frank Rosenthal might be a good person to ask, since he has used a PSR9000 with an MFC10 foot controller. (I would be very surprised if the foot-controller info could not be sent out one of the two midi outs of the PSR9000.) I could only test on a PSR8000, which nobody is planning to buy anyway. I also think midi merge is likely to be built into high-end arranger modules, like the Solton X4 and the Korg i40m. Also, it is likely to be found in any arranger with two midi ins. To me this is not an important issue, since I have a controller with multiple midi outs and a module with two midi ins.

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#108529 - 11/23/00 10:17 PM Re: Information about KN5000 please
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 14975
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
I didn't bring my 9000 home from the club. Don't know if it has midi-merge. I don't remember seeing that terminology in the manual, but they might call it something else. Tell me exactly what you want it to do, and I'll see if it will do it!
DonM
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DonM

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#108530 - 11/24/00 12:17 AM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10423
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Hi DonM,
I personally don't have a need for "midi merge" but it is my understanding that fellow Synthzone board member Tonkan wants this feature. He wants to be able to take the original midi source data entering his keyboard (at the "midi-in" port) and to MERGE this data with the midi data created on his keyboard and then send this "merged" midi data out thru the keyboard's "midi-out" port.

Clif had thought this is possible (without having to purchase an external midi-merge box) on the higher-end Yamaha PSR boards.Please check your PSR keyboard and let us know if there is some kind of midi setting feature which would allow you to turn "midi merge" on/off? As far as I know, this would be the only way to find out if the Yamaha PSR keyboards support an internal midi-merge feature function. If the PSR keyboards don't include this type of setting then the only way to perform the type of midi merge function Tonkan desires is by connecting an external midi merge box to both the "midi-out" and "midi-thru" ports on his keyboard.Curious to hear your finding.
-Scott
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#108531 - 11/24/00 03:36 AM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Clif Anderson Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/00
Posts: 532
Hi Don M

Here is what I would try. Make sure your Host Select switch is set to "MID". Connect the MIDI OUT A of the 9k to a sound module. Make sure that you can control the module with the 9k keyboard. If you cannot, try various MIDI modes, "All Parts", "Kbd&Acmp", "Master Kbd1" and "Master Kbd2". One or more of these should allow you to control the sound module.

Once you have the 9k controlling the external sound module, connect a MIDI controller to MIDI IN B. Set the Receive mode to "Keyboard". See if you can control the module using the controller. If you can, then the controller data is being merged with the 9k data.

Depending on what the objective is, different settings may be used.

HTH, Clif

[This message has been edited by Clif Anderson (edited 11-24-2000).]

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#108532 - 11/24/00 04:37 AM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Fran Carango Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 05/26/99
Posts: 8567
Loc: Levittown, Pa, USA
The Roland G1000 can achieve the results of a merger. It has 2 sets of midi in, out, and thru[A and B]The settings can be changed to transmit and receive, interchangable from A to B and vice versa. For example You can play a JV2080 from the G1000 upper 1 realtime part connected from midi A out, andhave a bass pedal controller connected to the midi B in, assigned to a selected midi channel of the A midi out...Fran
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www.francarango.com



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#108533 - 11/24/00 08:47 AM Re: Information about KN5000 please
Clif Anderson Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/00
Posts: 532
More thoughts on MIDI merge and the PSR9k.

From the PSR9k manual on page 149, it sounds like there is may be a MIDI-merge function at least in some cases. With a computer coupled to the TO HOST port and the appropriate selection made for the TO HOST selector, and with "THRU" set as the MIDI mode, it sounds like there MAY be MIDI merge.

The next question would be whether connecting an external controller to MIDI A IN with the TO HOST selector on MID and the MIDI mode set to "THRU" would result in MIDI merging. This is the same as the test I described in my previous post except the external connection to to MIDI IN A instead of MIDI IN B.

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