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#108311 - 05/05/06 03:58 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
DonM Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 06/25/99
Posts: 16735
Loc: Benton, LA, USA
It's hard to beat the Barbettas. I particularly like the 31Cs. Even though they are smaller than the 32Cs, I prefer their sound.
If I ever go away from the Bose, it would be back to them.
DonM
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DonM

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#108312 - 05/05/06 04:04 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
Alex K Offline
Member

Registered: 12/03/99
Posts: 732
Loc: Phoenix, AZ USA
Quote:
Originally posted by kbrkr:
Wow! I always thought low frequencies traveled at a lower speed / Sine wave than higher frequencies and thus it was the other way around; low frequencies lag behind high frequencies. Is the effect that measurable that it creates a noticable difference in the sound?

wow...

Al,

The speed of sound is the same (depends on temperature and density) in the medium, e.g. air. The higher frequency results in shorter wavelength, and conversely, lower frequency sounds have longer wavelengths.

Donny, that writeup from Mackie is a bunch of BS. The difference in distance between the horn and bass to the front of the speaker is negligible. If anything, it would have been easier corrected by physically placing the woofer deeper inside the speaker.

In reality, when one plays guitar (or any other string instrument), the low-frequency notes are made by the entire string, while the higher ones are made by a short portion of the string. There is easily half a foot of difference between the two, but to our ear they sound pretty natural.

While you will quite possibly find coils and capacitors in the other speakers, they are used as filters/crossovers, rather than time delays.

While Mackie does use high-quality electronic components, they also use a fair dose of bull, which makes me suspect that they are not nearly as technologically advanced as they claim to be (or charge for).

Nonetheless, I hope you enjoy yours.

Regards,
Alex
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Regards,
Alex

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#108313 - 05/05/06 07:43 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Quote:
Originally posted by MrEd:
Donny,
You being a fan of the Barbetta product, why not something like the Barbetta Sona 32's or the 41's? They are about 10lbs/cabinet lighter, they are a bit more expensive though.

Based on Pro reviews on these Barbetta models, I myself would be looking hard at them.

Is it the SRM450's for sure?


Ed I forgot to mention that I have also owned and performed with the Barbettas 32c's and they are exceptional also...great flexability....with the mixer in the rear too....nothing is for sure but next week I will have a pair of something right now I'm using a vintage Silver ROLAND 100KB CUBE I borrowed from Fran Carango & my Yorkville 100 KW .....Im performing 4 days straight and wont be able to get to a store till Mon Morning ....more to come

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#108314 - 05/05/06 07:47 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Quote:
Originally posted by Alex K:
Quote:
Originally posted by kbrkr:
[b]Wow! I always thought low frequencies traveled at a lower speed / Sine wave than higher frequencies and thus it was the other way around; low frequencies lag behind high frequencies. Is the effect that measurable that it creates a noticable difference in the sound?

wow...

Al,

The speed of sound is the same (depends on temperature and density) in the medium, e.g. air. The higher frequency results in shorter wavelength, and conversely, lower frequency sounds have longer wavelengths.

Donny, that writeup from Mackie is a bunch of BS. The difference in distance between the horn and bass to the front of the speaker is negligible. If anything, it would have been easier corrected by physically placing the woofer deeper inside the speaker.

In reality, when one plays guitar (or any other string instrument), the low-frequency notes are made by the entire string, while the higher ones are made by a short portion of the string. There is easily half a foot of difference between the two, but to our ear they sound pretty natural.

While you will quite possibly find coils and capacitors in the other speakers, they are used as filters/crossovers, rather than time delays.

While Mackie does use high-quality electronic components, they also use a fair dose of bull, which makes me suspect that they are not nearly as technologically advanced as they claim to be (or charge for).

Nonetheless, I hope you enjoy yours.

Regards,
Alex

[/B]


Alex, do you have any recomenndations for powered speakers ....you sound very knowledgable.

Thanx

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#108315 - 05/06/06 04:47 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
Alex K Offline
Member

Registered: 12/03/99
Posts: 732
Loc: Phoenix, AZ USA
Donny,

Trust your ears. If you like Mackie, go with them, just don't believe all the techno-babble they may be putting into their marketing brochures.

I like Yorkville too - I think their stuff sounds good and is very reliable, not like the older SRM 450s which used to go into thermal shutdown if you did not place them right. Hopefully, the new Mackies don't do that anymore.

Regards,
Alex
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Regards,
Alex

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#108316 - 05/06/06 11:36 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
royandreno Offline
Member

Registered: 03/15/02
Posts: 451
Loc: Sandnes, Norway
EV SxA360, a bit pricy, but 500 Watts and only 16,5kg. And great sound!
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#108317 - 05/07/06 06:16 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
If anyone thinks that Stereo doesnt make a difference in the sound when playing a T2 I beg to differ.After just doing 3 big gigs the last few days all in stereo with two speakers which sound outstanding wit the T2....Today I played at two different gigs ....First one was a small family 50th anniversary in a restaurant upstairs so I only used my (1) Yorkvile 100 KW mono Boy what a difference!!! The T2 became lifeless, Pianos were lacking body, & the overall sound in general was much different then the past few days I performed with Two Powered speakers in stereo......later on in the evening I played at a church affair wih 300 people and used Two speakers on stage and I was in heaven again!!.....the T2 shined like a champ soundwise... The T2 IMO wa created & designed to be played in Stereo plain & simple, between the efx, SA Sounds, styles etc, etc, it really makes a big difference....after todays senario I will NEVER play the T2 in MONO again....I will get a small stereo system FOR INTAMATE GIGS & another big stage sound system to play the big jobs...asap. This is what my ears tell me .....try it your self



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 05-07-2006).]

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#108318 - 05/07/06 06:47 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
MarcK Offline
Member

Registered: 07/27/01
Posts: 205
This is a topic of interest to me. I have been gigging for years as a one-man band with Yamaha PSR boards (630/2000/3000) going directly through a lone Motion Sound KT-80 (100 watts) 2-way amp. It does not have a pole mount and as such I normally place it on the floor either directly in front of my keyboard or to the side where necessary. Recently the idea of selling the amp and replacing it with a full-blown stereo system (perhaps with subwoofer) has been floating in and out of my mind but as of yet I have not felt any impetus to make the switch. I'm quite comfortable with the one-amp setup because 1) it's MUCH easier to shelpp and setup with the one amp compared to a stereo setup (which in any case would likely include a powered mixer of some sort) and 2) while I as a musician obviously hear and "care about" the loss of stereo imaging in the sound that the audience hears, I really can't help but wonder how much of a difference it makes to the audience. We're not talking about concerts -- I do mainly reception and dinner-type event where people spend most of the evening eating or listening to speeches. Some events do involve dancing but I get the impression that people care more about having a beat to move their feet to than whether or not the guitar and horn parts are coming to their ears from the same direction. In addition, many of the venues I see have what can only be described as poor acoustic qualities, and besides for the lucky few seated within reasonable range of the speakers, it doesn't seem that the stereo effect would carry throughout most of the room. I guess ultimately the question for me boils down to 1) will I get more business with a stereo setup and 2) if yes, is the increase worth the extra expense/bother of having a stereo setup? Your thoughts are appreciated.

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#108319 - 05/07/06 07:00 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
I cant agree with you ....its like saying if you were a Chef that you would put out sub par quality food to the patrons of your restaurant because its cheaper & you dont think they notice the difference?......why not go A/B your Motion sound against a good stereo setup & tell me it doesnt sound better.....but believe me Im doing this 35+ years dont underestimate your audience they definitly know what they hear.....& deserve your best music every performance
@ 200%...I also see many acts that shouldnt even be called musicians & are just there for the Bucks, but on the other hand, Im glad they are out there working because every time they play it means MORE WORK FOR ME because my friend hey will not get hired again



[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 05-07-2006).]

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#108320 - 05/07/06 09:42 PM Re: Stereo and the Real World
Alex K Offline
Member

Registered: 12/03/99
Posts: 732
Loc: Phoenix, AZ USA
MarcK,

I don't know what the audience hears, but I agree with Donny, that the first person who must like the sound is myself - when my music sounds good to me, I can entertain my audience better, even if the audience does not know the difference between mono and stereo.

As for one-box setup, I have a Motion Sound KP100, which I am considering selling (and just sticking with my large system). The KP series of Motion Sound is designed to reproduce stereo sound from a single box (I am sure you can find many posts here on this topic). I find that my gigs are mostly in front of larger audiences, and most involve dance music, which is why I find that I am not using the KP100 lately.

The other single-box solution used to be Fender Keyboard SFX - really nice stereo separation, 160 watts. I heard it in a music store, and liked it, even though it was kind of expensive. Fender stopped making them, but you can still find them on Ebay sometimes. I have not heard anything negative about them, other than the fact that it is on a heavy side (but has wheels).

Regards,
Alex
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Alex

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