SYNTH ZONE
Visit The Bar For Casual Discussion
Topic Options
#102268 - 01/23/01 12:11 PM Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
To: Sandro (Bell Solton)
From: Scott Yee (potential buyer of the Solton SD-1)

Re: Solton SD-1 Chord Recognition Table

I am seriously considering purchasing your new SD-1 arranger keyboard. I was particularly impressed with the new acoustic piano patch, many excellent styles/sounds, and newly added features which make the SD-1 easy to navigate. I am a professional jazz influenced keyboard player & vocalist . One important feature I find missing is your arranger's chord recognition for 'rootless voiced chords' which are such an integral part of jazz & blues style piano playing.

Currently your arranger keyboard's (including the SD-1) chord recognition table interpretes the following notes (played as a chord from left to right) as:
(F - A - C - E) : Fmaj7
(F - C - E) : Fmaj7
(F - B - E) : Fmaj7b5
(E - A - D) : A sus
(B - F - A) : F 5b

two hand voiced chord (full keyboard mode):
(Eb - A - D) - (G - C - F) : EbMaj5b
(left hand) - (right hand)


Though theoreticallly correct, the chords you have chosen to assign to the above chord voicings are not the chords most professional keyboard players associate with these specific chord voicings. Instead, most pro keyboard players (especially jazz influenced) associate these same chord voicings to the following "rootless" style chords made popular in the 1950's to present by legendary keyboard artists like Bill Evans and Wynton Kelly, Diana Krall, and countless others contemporary keyboard players:

(F - C - E) : Dm7(9)
(F - B - E) : G13
(F - A - B - E): G13
(E - A - D) : C69
(B - F - A) : G7(9)
(B - E - F - A): G13

two hand voiced chord (full keyboard mode):
(Eb - A - D) - (G - C - F) : F13
(left hand) - (right hand)

Here is another important reason I am requesting that you change your SD-1's chord recognition table. As you know, the II - V - I chord progression is the most common (basic) chord progression in Pop music. This means that in the key of C: the II - V - I chord progression is Dm - G7 - C. A popular (jazz voiced) equivilent is Dm9 - G13 - C69. The (F-C-E) - (F-B-E) - (E-A-D) progression is a popularly played jazz influenced "rootless" chord variation of this chord progression. As you can see, this "rootless chord" progression includes smooth (piano) voice leading (moving only one finger between each chord). Thus, these "three" rootless chord voicings "work well together" to form the most important (popular) chord progression in American Pop music. If I thought the chords you had chosen to assign these chord voicings were more commonly used in actual practice, I would discard my notion of asking you to assign these chord voicings to the "rootless" chords I am requesting here; but I don't think that this is the case as there aren't many (if any) keyboard players who play these chord voicings to trigger the types of chord voicings you assigned (though they are indeed, theoretically correct).

In the case of the two handed chord voicing (full keyboard mode) . . .
(Eb - A - D) - (G - C - F)
(left hand) - (right hand)

This is an immensely popular "two handed" piano keyboard comping style which provides a wide "open sound" played on 12 bar blues tunes. Though this specific voicing is not a "rootless" voicing per se, it is a popular piano voicing used to play an F13 chord, not a EbMaj5b as your arranger keyboards recognizes it.

In conclusion I want to emphasize that your arranger keyboard competitors (Yamaha PSR99000; Yamaha9000pro; Technics KN5000; Technics KN6000/KN6500) have all chosen to recognize the below keyboard chord voicings as follows ( I hope you will seriously consider doing the same):

(F - C - E) : Dm7(9)
(F - B - E) : G13
(F - A - B - E): G13
(E - A - D) : C69
(B - F - A) : G7(9)
(B - E - F - A): G13

two hand voiced chord (full keyboard mode):
(Eb - A - D) - (G - C - F) : F13
(left hand) - (right hand)

I think the market for arranger keyboards is becoming an increasingly popular alternative for many seasoned professional keyboard players who have played in live jazz combo bands for years and want to now go solo. Being able to play the arranger keyboard in the 'same' professional comping style as when playing with "live" musicians is an important factor for professional jazz/blues influenced keyboard players shopping for an arranger keyboard.

Respectfully,

Scott Yee

scottyee@aol.com

[This message has been edited by Scottyee (edited 01-23-2001).]
_________________________

Top
#102269 - 01/23/01 12:19 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
go get em Scott!!!!!

great letter. but will it make them think?

donny

Top
#102270 - 01/23/01 12:52 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Hi Donny,

I dunno, but this is my "LAST final" attempt at trying to get Solton to listen. As you remember, Dan O'Brien (Solton dealer-Guitar Center, NY) told me to "Get over it".

All I "do know" is that my many professional keyboard musician friends/associates will NOT even consider the Solton SD-1 or X1 unless Solton address's this important issue.

BTW, changing the chord recognition table should be fairly easy for Solton to do via a FLASH ROM OS update. In fact Technics did this on their recent KN6000 FLASH ROM OS update.

- Scott
_________________________

Top
#102271 - 01/23/01 02:29 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Clif Anderson Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/00
Posts: 532
There is nothing preventing any company from allowing us to choose chord recognition tables. Why not include a jazz mode with rootless voicing recognition?

Top
#102272 - 01/23/01 03:47 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Hi Clif,

You are absolutely RIGHT.
Actually the "newest" model Lowery electronic Organ (The Royale?)- basically an organ version of an arranger keyboard, which premiered at the NAMM show last week goes "even further". It allows "US" the 'end user' to define our own custom "user definable" chord recognition table(s): both for defining our own custom chord voicings as well as deciding what chord we'd like our custom chord voicings to be recognized as. This all came about because my best pro keyboard buddy, Chris Mesnickow (a fine organist/keyboardist and former officially sponsored Technics & Lowery touring keyboard Artist) had requested it.

I wonder if the arranger keyboard manufacters are listening?

Keepin' my fingers crossed . . .

- Scott

[This message has been edited by Scottyee (edited 01-23-2001).]
_________________________

Top
#102273 - 01/23/01 05:12 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
J. Larry Offline
Member

Registered: 12/14/99
Posts: 521
Loc: University, MS 38677 USA
If some allow a custom-designed chord recognition system, how about going further and allowing potential buyers to "special order" only the features they desired? I guess that's a rediculous notion. But I'd easily trade several features of the 6000 to get others, if that were possible.

Top
#102274 - 01/23/01 06:47 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Clif Anderson Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/00
Posts: 532
Scott

I see what you are doing. It is not "wishing and hoping" (Dusty Springfield), but lobbying. I think it will make a difference and everyone will benefit from it.

Clif

Top
#102275 - 01/23/01 07:22 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Scottyee Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 10427
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, CA, US...
Clif-
I emailed George Kaye a copy of my above posted letter to Sandro (Solton), hoping he will make sure that both Sandro as well as any other important people at Solton might listen. I trust that George will keep us abreast of any developments as well.

I know there are many people on this board who "don't care" about my chord recognition request but there are many more other potential Solton customers (professional jazz-style keyboardists)who WILL CARE. If Solton doesn't listen, then they WILL surely lose this large potential "pro-musician" market to Yamaha & Technics.
- Scott
_________________________

Top
#102276 - 01/23/01 07:49 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
Clif Anderson Offline
Member

Registered: 02/17/00
Posts: 532
Hi Scott

There is an obvious chicken and egg problem here. Musicians who would require rootless voicings cannot have been playing arranger keyboards very long, since arranger keyboards prior to the KN-5000 did not have this feature. Thus, Tom's poll shows that not many arranger players use rootless voicings. So the fact that only a few people use rootless voicings with arranger keyboards is not surprising nor indicative of the future.

I think Yamaha and Technics will benefit from their early support of rootless voicings. First, they will attract musicians who require this feature; second, those musicians (who tend to be relatively skilled) will serve as good word-of-mouth advertising for those companies.

However, evey manufacturer has different "crucial" features and targets a slightly different group of musicians. Some require audio loops, e.g., for drums, some require vocal processing ala Roland's Variphrase, some require dynamic accompaniment (which Y and T both lack), some require multipads. So manufacturers missing one market might be hitting another dead on.

Top
#102277 - 01/23/01 08:42 PM Re: Open Letter to Solton - Re: Chord Recognition Table
George Kaye Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/24/99
Posts: 3305
Loc: Reseda, California USA
Hey Scott,
Yes I got your email and i attached it to my eamil to Lou in New York, who is the distributor here in the US and also to Sandro in Italy. Lou is a good man and he has the best direct link to the owners of Solton, Italy. Hopefully, we will get a response as soon as possible. Thank you for taking the time out to document this beautifully.
Regards,
George Kaye
_________________________
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene (Closed after 51 years)
West Hills, California
(Retired 2021)

Top

Moderator:  Admin, Diki, Kerry 



Help keep Synth Zone Online