Here are a few interesting quotes from the recent review of the Yamaha Tyros in the (August 2003) issue of Keyboard Magazine, reviewed by Ed Alstrom:

"Tyros is derived from the Medieval Latin for 'young soldier'. In recent years, it's taken on the connotation of 'AMATEUR' or 'DABBLER', which, it turns out, is one type of player who's likely to be very interested in this keyboard."

"Players who do one-man band gigs like intruments such as this because of the portability, versatility, and pro sound quality. Semi-pro keyboardists with a gadget-freak bent seem to buy these on a steady basis, too. Songwriters are using them more and more as well."

"Unlike many portable keyboards, the Tyros doesn't have built-in speakers, which gives it a bit more of a 'PRO' image."

"In terms of playability, the Tyros is terrific. It makes you want to play. It's easy to find what you want, easy to get started, and easy to keep going."

"If you're looking for a high-quality accompaniment and arranger feataures and your main interest is live playing rather than production, the Tyros is a beautiful, well thought-out music machine with pristine sound, and a lot of convenient and thoughtful touches to recommend it."

Scott

Sorry Scott, but I disagree with his assessment of the Tyros having "a bit more 'Pro' image" mentality. And I also disagree in his reasoning as to Live Play versus Production in that the Tyros is better off without speakers if you're going to use it for Live use. Although most people who engage in Live Playing have stage monitors to monitor the Mix, as when your using it in a Band, etc., sometimes stage monitors aren't accurate in accruing the sound proportionately to the Keyboardist, etc. In other words, "I" get lost in the Mix sometimes, and I have to strain my ear to hear me in the Mix. And I cannot always just turn myself up by way of the Master Volume (which would increase my volume in the Sound System, ie., the Monitors and other Speakers), especially in a tight musical moment. THAT is when onboard speakers can provide that extra 'boost' to "me" in a Live situation to be able to better hear "me" with everything else that is going on sound wise onstage. Part of his reasoning I would guess is in the fact that the Tyros would be more portable without speakers and easier to set up and take down. But my PSR 2000 HAS onboard speakers and it is 'lighter' than the Tyros. And the Pro Image thing just doesn't cut it IMO. Especially when nine out of ten Tyros owners probably use the add on speakers during Live use anyways. It is then no longer a case where it's easier to set up and take down the Tyros and it sure doesn't give the Tyros a more "Pro" Image IMHO with those add ons plastered to the Tyro's casing. And other Musicians or even the audience could care less if a Keyboard has or doesn't have onboard speakers. So how he or anyone could suggest that because a Keyboard doesn't have built in speakers it gives it a more polished or Pro Image just doesn't cut the mustard imo.

PS: Sorry to rant Scott but I also realize you love your Tyros and I am pretty sure you would like everybody else to love it as much as you do. Which is fine; but in posting these Tyros reviews you're just providing fodder for me to shoot holes through them. Don't take it personal though.

Best regards,
Mike

hi Mike,

Actually, my intention of posting those specific Keyboard Magazine reviewer's quotes was not intended to promote whatever love I may have for my Tyros, but quite the contrary, to ruffle feathers and promote feedback & debate, to which you're the first to have taken the bait.

In addition to Mr Alstrom's obviously controversial remark about speakerless keyboard's as being more 'pro', his interpretation of the word 'Tyros' as to insinuate that this keyboard is geared for the 'amatuer', the 'dabbler', and mere 'gadget freak' afficiandos should also stir some feathers amongst our midst as well. Interested to get comments & feedback on this as well.

Scott

It worked Scott... I'd like to say a word about one of his remarks...

"In addition to Mr Alstrom's obviously controversial remark about speakerless keyboard's as being more 'pro', his interpretation of the word 'Tyros' as to insinuate that this keyboard is geared for the 'amatuer', the 'dabbler', and mere 'gadget freak'"

What kind of crap is that? The Tyros is not by any means an amatuer keyboard. That keyboards features allow it to hang with the big dogs. I haven't had the luxury of playing a new Triton Studio, but I will tell you the Tyros acoustic sounds blow the Triton Classic out of the picture. The Tyros is a professional arranger, and until these dipwads in the keyboard magazines start giving these keyboards the credit they deserve there'll always be that line between arrangers and non arrangers (synth/workstations).. Personally if I was given the choice of a Korg Karma, Triton Classic, Roland Fantom, and a few others I'd take the Tyros hands down.. The sound alone on that keyboard is outstanding, and the features are quite desirable as well.. Ok I'm done now

Squeak

[This message has been edited by squeak_D (edited 07-29-2003).]

I agree with Squeak - These people seem to listen with their eyes. If they see on board speakers it's amatuer; if they see arranger features it's amatuer etc. Yet they seem to rave about the sound. If it sounds good why not call it a "Pro" unit. Having more features shouldn't exclude it from that category.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Ed

I'm going to take tht other side of the argument here: Jim Aiken is "warming up" to arrangers more than he has in the past, and while some of the comments may seem a little derogatory, it's because they are taken out of context. I read his entire review of the Tyros and it is positive overall. Read the entire article before judging it. The Keyboard magazine (not done by Jim Aiken) and Electronic Musician reviews of the 9000 Pro by comparison were rather cold-shouldered, and I think both magazines got their fair share of negative feedback for not giving arrangers the credit they deserve. Arrangers are coming up in the world of pro keyboards and as they acquire more features that put them on par with well-known workstations then they'll get their due.

And I know we have a lot of "internal speaker" fans here, but the truth is that your very arguments, such as Mike's about "not being able to turn up the Master Volume without affecting the Sound System" only shows why internal speakers on a keyboard are a limited-use-only option. A true, separate stage monitor system would allow you to change any aspect of your monitoring while sending an unchanged signal to the main mixer/sound system.

The only place internal speakers serve adequately even only for stage monitoring is low-volume solo gigs. What's the most powerful internal speakers system made now in an arranger? 40 watts? (2 x 20 stereo). Most aren't even that powerful - regular car stereos are often better as are most ghetto blasters. That would be a waste of money and unnecessary cartage on any keyboard for people like myself. The Tyros has the best approach: make external powered speakers optional. Korg's new PA1-X and PA1-X Pro also have the right idea: make a small 61-note version with internal speakers for those desiring such and a 76-note pro version without it.

Your first paragraph about me being able to turn up "my" volume without affecting the Main Mix through the system CAN be accomplished Jim, but I haven't taken that approach yet. The solution would be in using my 'Aux Outputs' and run them to the "Snake" which in turn runs to the "MainBoard" and out the the "System". That way I could use my Master Volume to turn me up without affecting the Main Mix. It would then be the sound man's job to regulate my volume in the Mix which is his job anyway. My main point is not me turning up or down the volume whether it be through my Master Volume or if I use the Aux Outs, for the sound man to do it. My point is having those onboard speakers in front of you, looking up at you and PROVIDING you (ME) with a "personal" Monitoring system can only be plus to in my view. With the Tyros I wouldn't have that ability unless I take the extra effort it requires to keep setting up those add ons and breaking them down and all the while looking ugly plastered to the rear of the Tyros's shell while I'm performing. No thanks... Also with the Tyros I wouldn't have the capability to use any Aux Outputs, because the Tyros DOESN'T have ANY. So much for High End Arranger feature advances. At least on the Tyros anyway. Thanks for your reply Jim, for it just now got me to thinking about using my Aux Outputs for the Main System Mix and then I could independently use my Master Volume to turn ME up without affecting anything else. Now all I have to do is go to GC and get the right Cabling wire and adapter to make it work.

I will also give you my evaluation of your second paragraph. First off, even if onboard speakers are only 20Wx2 that sure beats a kick in the pants doesn't it? Or 'nothing' at all as I'm trying to say. And also show me an Arranger Keyboard that has internal speakers costing MORE than one that DOESN'T have onboard speakers and I'll eat my hat. Whether it be a 61 Key Arranger or a 76 Key one. Also my PSR 2000, which has onboard speakers and 61 Keys, actually weighs LESS than the 61 Key Tyros which DOESN'T have onboard speakers. And just because the best speakers on the market for an Arranger are 20Wx2 (actually the Technics KN7000 has 66 Total Watts of power) does that negate the fact that they serve a valuable purpose? And the Manufacturers will only increase the Output Power of the speakers in their future Arranger products IMO. Just think, maybe in 5 years we will see a High End Arranger that has "76" Keys, with onboard speakers producing an incredible 150Wx2 Output Power Rating "BEFORE" taking into account the 60W of Bass Output, and all the while the the Arranger weighing in at "under" 40 lbs. Could it be possible you say? Not only could it be possible imo it could very well be a strong probability within 5 years.

Ouch! I just looked at the clock. Gotta Run!


Best regards,
Mike

From a person who does not have a lot of discretionary income, the PSR2100's cost, features, and the number of "Professionals" on this forum using it, makes me consider the PSR2100 to be a professional instrument. To insinuate that the Tyros, costing thousands more, is not professional, is ludicrous. I can't forsee ever owning such an instrument. It's only for professionals.
Star

Mike:

You're working too hard to miss my point. I'm not advocating the Tyros' little add-on speakers anymore than internal speakers - I'm advocating using a real keyboard amp. If you have a serious on-stage keyboard monitor, such as a Motion Sound KP-200s as I use, then you just turn up or down the volume or adjust the eq of your keyboard amp however you like it and let the sound man do what he will with the main signal, which is taken direct from the keyboard amp's lo-z stereo outputs, not from the keyboard. In my case, the KP-200s can also take a vocal monitor feed from the main mixer without passing that signal back through the direct outputs, so it can double as a vocal monitor. There is nowhere in this instance where any existing (or imaginary) internal keyboard speaker system would serve any purpose, and being "lost in the mix" isn't even a question. I've recently done some band gigs with this setup - no problem hearing myself clearly or being heard. As I like to say, if you gotta go then go-rilla!

Just in case some of you may have missed reading it in Keyboard Magazine, here's a link to the entire Tyros keyboard review (written by Ed Alstrom) which appeared in the August 2003 issue of Keyboard Magazine:
http://keyboardmag.com/archive/0803/0803_r3.htm


Scott