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#64242 - 05/15/00 01:50 AM Singing with KN6000
pmart Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/12/00
Posts: 17
Loc: Nice, France
When I sing with a microphone connected to the KN6000, I use only the preset reberb define as "Karaoke". The reverb is, in my opinion, too heavy, but it's easy to decrease this effect.
My question is : is it possible to adjust the tuning of the voice, in order to obtain a sound with less bass and more treble, i should say more "christallin" ?
I imagine that the equalizer works for the overall instrument and not for the voice only, then a solution should consist to use one of the many DSP filters, but which one ???
Perhaps it is my microphone which is not a good one, what king of microphone would you suggest me to buy (characteristics, model, trade mark)?

Thank you for helping me.

PS: I do not use the harmonizer function !


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Pierre
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Pierre

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#64243 - 05/15/00 07:10 AM Re: Singing with KN6000
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
Pierre,
I'm not sure about the KN6000, but on my X1, the EQ controls for the mic input were part of the harmony processor. Maybe, check that out. Otherwise, you can use an external EQ
(like a guitar pedal) BEFORE you put the mic into the input. I remember the Karaoke echo on the KN5000, and it IS way too dark for my taste. I think it's a very low rez effect, and I could never use it in a pro situation. If you don't plan on using harmony, and the EQ is NOT internal - I'd recommend a good vocal processor that's dedicated to your mic before it goes into the keyboard. I really like the "acous-TEC" unit by DOD. It's made for acoutic guitar, but all the essentials for voclas are in it. EQ, Rev, Del, Chorus - it's pretty cool, and it's small. You also have built in footswitches to turn the different effects on & off. Check it out. It's about $150 US.

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Uncle Dave
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No longer monitoring this forum. Please visit www.daveboydmusic.com for contact info

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#64244 - 05/15/00 08:20 PM Re: Singing with KN6000
Mike Daniell Offline
Member

Registered: 05/15/00
Posts: 143
Loc: Brisbane, Qld, Australia
Pierre,

I don't know much about singing with the KN6000 but I do know a bit about microphones. The most widely used mic for vocals is the Shure SM58. It's not cheap, but it is a quality mic.

See http://www.shure.com/sm58.html for info.

Regards,
Mike

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#64245 - 05/15/00 11:50 PM Re: Singing with KN6000
peter castanos Offline
Member

Registered: 11/25/99
Posts: 59
Loc: sydney australia
I think I can help!
I also found the mic sound a bit too bassy.
I'm not at the keyboard at present so I'm only working from memory.
Bring up the mic settings page, select multi effect set(I think its called that), scroll through the various effects until you find parametric EQ, then select TOO BRIGHT (I think thats what it's called), then go back to to the first mic page and switch the multi effect ON. It works independently of the multi button on the face of the keyboard.
You can permanently save that setting perhaps as the custom panel mic setting or in a panel memory.

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#64246 - 05/15/00 11:51 PM Re: Singing with KN6000
peter castanos Offline
Member

Registered: 11/25/99
Posts: 59
Loc: sydney australia
I think I can help!
I also found the mic sound a bit too bassy.
I'm not at the keyboard at present so I'm only working from memory.
Bring up the mic settings page, select multi effect set(I think its called that), scroll through the various effects until you find parametric EQ, then select TOO BRIGHT (I think thats what it's called), then go back to to the first mic page and switch the multi effect ON. It works independently of the multi button on the face of the keyboard.
You can permanently save that setting perhaps as the custom panel mic setting or in a panel memory.

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#64247 - 05/16/00 12:34 AM Re: Singing with KN6000
pmart Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/12/00
Posts: 17
Loc: Nice, France
I only want to thank all of you for your kindest help. This is how I understand the use of Internet (i.e. the opposite of the stupid "ILOVEYOU" and similar makers !).
The best way will be for me going on answering, when possible, to the various requests posted in the many forums.
I share this hobby of electronical music, and I will keep you informed of my progress in this matter.
Cheers !

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Pierre
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Pierre

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#64248 - 05/16/00 02:05 AM Re: Singing with KN6000
pmart Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/12/00
Posts: 17
Loc: Nice, France
Quote:
Originally posted by Mike Daniell:
Pierre,

I don't know much about singing with the KN6000 but I do know a bit about microphones. The most widely used mic for vocals is the Shure SM58. It's not cheap, but it is a quality mic.

See http://www.shure.com/sm58.html for info.

Regards,
Mike


============

My dealer suggest me a Sennheiser e845 (détail on page : http://www.sennheiser.com/evolution/evomic/e845s.html).
What would you prefer ?
I'm really disabled to make any choice in this matter !
Please, help...


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Pierre
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Pierre

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#64249 - 05/16/00 03:36 PM Re: Singing with KN6000
Uncle Dave Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/01/99
Posts: 12800
Loc: Penn Yan, NY
The Sehheiser is nice - so is the EV ND/YM series. The SM58 is one of the bassier mics around. It was built a LONG time ago and things have improved alot over the years. I have three of them, and I won't part with them, but I can't sing into one anymore - it just sounds like there is a sock on the mic compared to my EV 767. Some people sound great on them - I need the high end "sizzle" without pumping up the EQ. Also check out the Samson s12 - darn good mic for the money.

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Uncle Dave
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No longer monitoring this forum. Please visit www.daveboydmusic.com for contact info

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#64250 - 05/17/00 12:14 AM Re: Singing with KN6000
pmart Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/12/00
Posts: 17
Loc: Nice, France
Quote:
Originally posted by peter castanos:
I think I can help!
I also found the mic sound a bit too bassy.
I'm not at the keyboard at present so I'm only working from memory.
Bring up the mic settings page, select multi effect set(I think its called that), scroll through the various effects until you find parametric EQ, then select TOO BRIGHT (I think thats what it's called), then go back to to the first mic page and switch the multi effect ON. It works independently of the multi button on the face of the keyboard.
You can permanently save that setting perhaps as the custom panel mic setting or in a panel memory.


GREAT !
Many thanks Peter for your tip.
I tried yesterday evening this setting which solves most of the problem I had. And the best thing is that this setting to "TOO BRIGHT" showed me very obviouly that my microphone is only... a toy ! (many unwished noises). The most surprising is the consequence of this setup : now the Karaoke reverb sounds well !
I will buy on saturday a good mic : I assume that all my difficulties will be solved.

By the way, I phoned yesterday to a dealer who affirmed that no owner of a keyboard like the KN6000 would accept to sing with a mic connected to the keyboard. He invited me to buy a full system (mic + amplifier + speakers + ...) amounting about
FRF 6000 (US$ 850). He states that the song task is an overwork for the keyboard which deteriorates the overall performance. He also affirms that the life of the kn6000 speakers will be considerably diminished.
Do you think this guy is right or is only a baited trader ?



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Pierre
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Pierre

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#64251 - 05/17/00 07:47 PM Re: Singing with KN6000
Mike Daniell Offline
Member

Registered: 05/15/00
Posts: 143
Loc: Brisbane, Qld, Australia
Pierre,

Regarding the mic, I have to acknowledge that Uncle Dave has more personal experience of mics than I have, and so I respect his opinions. My experience is mainly from the mixing side.

It is certainly true that SM58's are old - I have been using them for probably in excess of 10 years. However, SM58's are still being manufactured and sold because they are recognised as being good mics. I have never had any trouble with them, and do not have to apply any EQ due to the characteristics of the mic.

In my opinion, the best test is your ears. With an amplifier running at a nominal level (neither too loud nor too soft) a singer should sound as close as possible to their natural sound, assuming you are not adding reverb, etc, and that all EQ settings are at their midpoint or completely bypassed. This needs to be true over the full frequency range and dynamic range of the singer.

There are other characteristics too look for, but these are fairly common to all good quality vocal mics. For example, a cardiod mic minimizes extraneous noises, such as sound from a nearby drum kit (including the drum kit in your KN6000). I notice the mic you mention (e845s) claims to be super-cardiod. That maybe good provided it does not give you too small an angle of pickup. If it is too small then your amplified volume may fluctuate if you move around too much in relation to the mic.

Good luck

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