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#509176 - 11/14/23 07:00 AM Advice on BK-7m
zuki Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/20/02
Posts: 4716
Got myself the module from a forum friend (awesome). Having fun exploring the styles and sounds and plan to use in conjunction with my 4X.

The editing is so menu driven *omg. So I am thinking of getting the iPad to simplify and speed up the process.

Please advise which iPad to get and whatever else I might need or any other comments appreciated.

I went to hook up midi to my DGX670 (huh, no midi on the Yamaha?)

Thx in advance. zuki


Edited by zuki (11/14/23 07:02 AM)
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Studio: Korg PA4X/Yamaha DGX670/Yamaha PSR SX900/Boss BR900CD/Tascam DP24SD/MTM Iloud/Senn 935/K&M stand/Shure SM57/Sony C80 (2)/Blue Encore 300

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#509177 - 11/14/23 10:56 AM Re: Advice on BK-7m [Re: zuki]
Kabinopus Online   content
Member

Registered: 11/11/04
Posts: 698
Loc: Russia
Well, looking at the BK-7m's page on Roland's site I see nothing about its capabilities to work with iPad or anything like it. Maybe I didn't understand what exactly you plan to do with it.

The DGX indeed can only connect through USB, perhaps you'll need to use a computer or some sophisticated device in order to connect it with something else.

A module like this can be fun to use with some small MIDI keyboard, although today a lot of them don't have this type of MIDI output either.

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#509180 - 11/14/23 12:12 PM Re: Advice on BK-7m [Re: zuki]
Gunnar Jonny Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 04/01/01
Posts: 4333
Loc: Norway
Hi.
Roland has a BK app, but if it support any of newer iPads OS, that's a big question:

https://apps.apple.com/us/app/bk-partner/id591061937
_________________________
Cheers 🥂
GJ
_______________________________________________
"Success is not counted by how high you have climbed
but by how many you brought with you." (Wil Rose)

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#509181 - 11/14/23 01:01 PM Re: Advice on BK-7m [Re: zuki]
Bill Lewis Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/12/08
Posts: 2442
Loc: Bluffton/Hilton Head SC USA
Yes , the newer Ipads work with the BK App
_________________________
Bill in SC --- Roland BK9 (2) Roland BK7M, Roland PK5 Pedals, Roland FP90, Roland CM30 (2), JBL Eon Ones (2) JBL 610 Monitor, Behringer Sub, EV mics, Apple iPad (2) Behringer DJ mixer

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#509233 - 11/20/23 12:56 PM Re: Advice on BK-7m [Re: zuki]
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14194
Loc: NW Florida
I’m not a big fan of apps taking the place of built-in software. For me, the issue is that I may use the arranger for 20 years or close to it. But I have no guarantee that app software will be updated and continued to be supported for that long. This makes selling the product at the end of your need for it a lot more difficult if major functionality is no longer available because the app that enables it is no longer supported or available on the Apple store.

You also have the issue of, if the app is no longer available, if you lose or break your iPad, you will not be able to get a new one to work with the old software because once it is unsupported, it is removed from the Apple Store. So you’re screwed even if you don’t sell the arranger!

Case in point, the Lyrics Viewer iPad app, almost essential for the BK7M (the tiny screen can’t display lyrics, which leaves you trying to find a small LCD TV with the rapidly disappearing RCA connector on it) and all the hassles that adds. Dropped by the Apple Store, no explanation for why from Roland, one day there, next day gone, no warning.

Sadly, I got my iPad just after Roland discontinued the app. I know it worked with the iPad’s iPadOS at the time of sale because a friend was using an updated iPad to run it on HIS iPad, no problem. But once an app is gone from the store, there’s no way in hell of ever getting it again.

The pace of computer/tablet OS upgrades is FAR faster than the arranger industry’s update path, you can’t even guarantee devices with the old connectors will be around in ten year’s time..! And the odds of software for iPad still being supported that long are low. And I can’t for the life of me understand that the BK9 Editor is still available for a product discontinued for three years or more is still up, but the app for lyrics display that should work fine on BK3/5 (still available in stores) has been dropped. No logical reason at all!

The more that essential tablet tools are needed for primary function, the more important it is that they get supported and updated for LONG after the product itself is discontinued…

A perfect example is the G70… it had a great tactile touch screen and software inside to do full voice, Makeup Tools, Sequencer and Performance editing built-in. The day I sell it, it will STILL have that functionality. But the day (if ever!) I sell my BK9, I will not be able to have visual/tactile editing controls as a feature to help it sell, unless Apple haven’t changed their OS so it still runs, or Roland updated the Editor app so it runs. Maybe five or more years from now! Fat chance…

I hope that manufacturers move away from apps to complete needed functionality. The life cycle of them is too short. 🎹😢
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#509244 - 11/21/23 05:39 AM Re: Advice on BK-7m [Re: Diki]
abacus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5347
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Originally Posted By Diki
I’m not a big fan of apps taking the place of built-in software. For me, the issue is that I may use the arranger for 20 years or close to it. But I have no guarantee that app software will be updated and continued to be supported for that long. This makes selling the product at the end of your need for it a lot more difficult if major functionality is no longer available because the app that enables it is no longer supported or available on the Apple store.

You also have the issue of, if the app is no longer available, if you lose or break your iPad, you will not be able to get a new one to work with the old software because once it is unsupported, it is removed from the Apple Store. So you’re screwed even if you don’t sell the arranger!

Case in point, the Lyrics Viewer iPad app, almost essential for the BK7M (the tiny screen can’t display lyrics, which leaves you trying to find a small LCD TV with the rapidly disappearing RCA connector on it) and all the hassles that adds. Dropped by the Apple Store, no explanation for why from Roland, one day there, next day gone, no warning.

Sadly, I got my iPad just after Roland discontinued the app. I know it worked with the iPad’s iPadOS at the time of sale because a friend was using an updated iPad to run it on HIS iPad, no problem. But once an app is gone from the store, there’s no way in hell of ever getting it again.

The pace of computer/tablet OS upgrades is FAR faster than the arranger industry’s update path, you can’t even guarantee devices with the old connectors will be around in ten year’s time..! And the odds of software for iPad still being supported that long are low. And I can’t for the life of me understand that the BK9 Editor is still available for a product discontinued for three years or more is still up, but the app for lyrics display that should work fine on BK3/5 (still available in stores) has been dropped. No logical reason at all!

The more that essential tablet tools are needed for primary function, the more important it is that they get supported and updated for LONG after the product itself is discontinued…

A perfect example is the G70… it had a great tactile touch screen and software inside to do full voice, Makeup Tools, Sequencer and Performance editing built-in. The day I sell it, it will STILL have that functionality. But the day (if ever!) I sell my BK9, I will not be able to have visual/tactile editing controls as a feature to help it sell, unless Apple haven’t changed their OS so it still runs, or Roland updated the Editor app so it runs. Maybe five or more years from now! Fat chance…

I hope that manufacturers move away from apps to complete needed functionality. The life cycle of them is too short. 🎹😢


A good option is to get a 2in 1 computer laptop, as the program will always be available somewhere, and will usually still work on the latest OS. (Although you may have to do some tweaking)

Most Monitors/Screens accept HDMI input with plenty of adaptors available on Amazon to convert RCA (And many others) to HDMI for little money.

Bill
_________________________
English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#509252 - 11/21/23 01:16 PM Re: Advice on BK-7m [Re: zuki]
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14194
Loc: NW Florida
Those iPad apps were never released as computer apps. Not even Surface apps.

This is part of the problem… once you decide to offload important functionality to apps, you really need (if you want to do it right) to develop for Windows, Android, MacOS and iPadOS. That’s way too big an ask for an already underfunded and staffed arranger R&D team! The answer is to have the arranger do it all, problem solved. One OS, one device, no issues with hardware or software longevity, no plethora of dongles and converters to have to set up and break down every night (if you gig). The dev team has only got to code it once (and the code can often be ported wholesale to the next model).

Roland had the answer with the G70. Do it all onboard using the touchscreen and the sliders and buttons. The BK9 was a big step back, no touch screen, and even the sliders didn’t work on the Makeup Tools or Sequencer etc.. Most modern TOTL arrangers nowadays got good touchscreens and sliders etc.. There’s no need for computer or tablet apps.
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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