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#505516 - 04/20/22 09:20 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: abacus]
Giovanni Offline
Member

Registered: 09/12/04
Posts: 489
Loc: Norwich Norfolk England
I agree with John c. Aka bruno123

Please no offence to anyone let's move on
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Giovanni

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#505518 - 04/20/22 10:03 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: abacus]
travlin'easy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 15560
Loc: Forest Hill, MD USA
Diki, my dad had some great, old sayings, one of which was "There's only one thing that money can't buy - POVERTY!"

It's called the music industry, music business, etc... Maybe you may enjoy living in poverty, but I, for one, do not. I treated this as a business and I was in it to make a profit. I was not a home, hobbyist player, though I enjoyed playing every instrument I laid my hands on. I was the booking agent, bookkeeper, tax accountant, advertising agent, repair guy, and most of all, I was the onstage performer. All this took lots of time, dedication, hard work and discipline. Through it all, though, I still managed to find time to spend with my family, took the wife and children out on the boat to go fishing and sailing, went to my son's little league games, and sat in the audience while my daughter performed gymnastics at a very young age, doing back flips, which was very scary.

I taught myself how to play a 6-string guitar at age 12, then graduated to a 12-string guitar at age 21, a mandolin at age 23, then graduated to an arranger keyboard. I was a self taught piano player at age 5, and while my parents thought I was very talented, I just was not happy with that instrument. While I am self taught and can read music, but not enough to hinder my playing and entertainer skills.;) I guess it would be fair to say that I would be a better player had I attended Peabody Institute in Baltimore for a few years, but despite the lack of formal training, I did manage to get along in the Music Industry. Almost forgot, I did take a college course called "Voice and Articulation" which was taught by one of the mid-Atlantic Region's best jazz singers. I learned a lot from Maryanne P. and she really put an emphasis on diction. I later encountered a lady in Nashville that taught diction to many of the top singers throughout the nation, including Elvis and many other country and rock stars.

So, Diki, is it about the money, or is it the love of playing? Well, from my viewpoint, it's both. I damned well would not be very happy if I could not support my wife and children and I have always been of the opinion that if a person is not happy in their job, they should do something else where they would be more productive and happier. Ironically, many of the full-time entertainers I came across during my years as a musical entertainer, included a lot of great, pro musicians that switched from other instruments to an arranger keyboard. Some of which frequented this forum in past years, and many of them called upon me for my technical expertise when they encountered difficulties with their keyboards. For the most part, I was able to help them overcome the problems. I still do this today, and two days ago, helped an old friend with creating a special, setup registration on his SX-900. I still solve problems for individuals on this, and a couple other arranger keyboard forums.

I sincerely wish you and a few others would stop this incessant squabbling about who is a pro and who is not, and who's keyboard is better, etc... This kind of activity usually leads to the demise of what was a great forum just a few years ago. Just in case you have not noticed, most of the individuals that made this a great forum have left. I have been here for a lot of years, and still believe that I can continue to help others with their technical issues, and assist them in making a livable income in the Music Industry. When I can no longer do this, I will check out, just like my friend Zuki (Jim) did yesterday.

Good luck,

Gary cool
_________________________
PSR-S950, TC Helicon Harmony-M, Digitech VR, Samson Q7, Sennheiser E855, Custom Console, and lots of other silly stuff!

K+E=W (Knowledge Plus Experience = Wisdom.)

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#505519 - 04/20/22 10:40 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: abacus]
travlin'easy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 15560
Loc: Forest Hill, MD USA
Taike, I guess you could call this a question, but the title makes an assumption that ALL PROS THINK THAT ARRANGER KEYBOARD PLAYERS SUCK!

In reality, I believe this statement only applies to a few "so called" pros on this particular forum. For the most part, I have found that most of the pro musicians I encountered in my lifetime don't think that way at all. And, many, many of them eventually transitioned from whatever instrument they were schooled on to an arranger keyboard, if for no other reason, the financial aspect. When I did encounter a pro musician, some of which were retired, they often came up to me and said "Wow! I cannot believe how much you are able to get out of that keyboard - it really sounds incredible." Not a single one of them every said "Arranger keyboard players suck." This never happened. And, I seriously doubt that you would ever see this statement other than an internet post. I would not even consider making such a statement to someone, in person, or online, even if I didn't like their instrument of choice.

Good luck,

Gary cool
_________________________
PSR-S950, TC Helicon Harmony-M, Digitech VR, Samson Q7, Sennheiser E855, Custom Console, and lots of other silly stuff!

K+E=W (Knowledge Plus Experience = Wisdom.)

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#505524 - 04/20/22 11:32 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: travlin'easy]
Harold123 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/13/10
Posts: 439
Loc: Harrisville Pa USA
I honestly believe Nigel Spencer would have shut down this Topic long ago. I feel bad for Mrs. Spencer seeing how this forum is going south since her husband's passing. Sincerely Harold

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#505525 - 04/20/22 11:48 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: Harold123]
captain Russ Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 7285
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
How SAD! I actually thought things were getting better around here.

So sorry, Kerry.


Russ

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#505526 - 04/20/22 01:14 PM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: captain Russ]
bruno123 Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 06/04/02
Posts: 4912
Loc: West Palm Beach, FL 33417
We are victims of what is happening around us. We are doing the best to stay positive – parts of our thinking are troubled. I had to write my thoughts to get to our subject;

I love SZ, Nigel created something beyond the normal forum. It was more like a family that loved music and keyboards – and people. Made some of my best music friends. Some have passed on. Some, I still have contact with.

I am asking for a change in mind that will search to rebuild what Nigel created. If you feel disappointed, look at yourself first – that is where it all starts.

I hope I have not said to much, if I have, I apologies. If I write another post, it will be in the Bar, or PM.

I LOVE SYNTHZONE ZONE, John C.

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#505533 - 04/21/22 09:33 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: bruno123]
captain Russ Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 7285
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
I joined Synthzone while in Graduate school, studying the differences between face-to-face communication, conventional communication (telephone, conventional writing, etc.) and on-line communication.

I bought my first arranger after I joined. The group was perfect because the main subject involved something (music and musical equipment) that had been a big part of my life and livelihood.

Very soon, what rally mattered were the members...Chas...Gary....Zuki Nigel...Kerry, Rachel and a number of others.

I use my arranger in a different way then most, so the technical information has become less important to me, while the interaction between my now very good friends is life-affirming.

WE are ALL better than what this group has become. For years, I had minimal contact with Gary(Travelin' Easy), because of differences about literally everything musical, medical, social, political and MORE. Think Trump hater and Trump supporter. Think global warming differences.

But one day, I thought of all the good that my friend represents....what he has accomplished. The great family man he is. The unselfish help he has given anytime he is asked. His success an an arranger entertainer.

Now, if I don't talk to him for a few days, I get worried.

And that, is a part of who I now am.


Please, let's all see the good in each other. We need to maintain our ideals, but allow others the latitude to be different. And, if the differences are not harming anybody, SO WHAT?


I think I'll go call my buddy Chas now. Talked to Gary yesterday.


Differences and all, you folks are ALL important to me.


Best PERSONAL wishes,


Russ (sentimental old fool) Lay


Edited by captain Russ (04/21/22 09:39 AM)

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#505534 - 04/21/22 09:42 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: abacus]
captain Russ Online   content
Senior Member

Registered: 01/02/04
Posts: 7285
Loc: Lexington, Ky, USA
I think a group-wide re-evaluation of this group and ourselves is warranted.

Please see my post above:


Russ (old softie) Lay


Edited by captain Russ (04/21/22 09:43 AM)

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#505536 - 04/21/22 11:20 AM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: abacus]
montunoman Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 3208
Loc: Dallas, Texas
I think Bill (the OP) has some valid thoughts, and was trying to perhaps start a well meaning discussion, but the title of this post is a bit ill mannered, negative and condescending.

_________________________
It not the keyboard, it's the keyboardist.

www.youtube.com/channel/UCV94i--V-A8kZShmGTKyDOw

https://www.facebook.com/elgrupocache

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#505539 - 04/21/22 04:10 PM Re: Why do arranger players suck to pros? [Re: abacus]
travlin'easy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/08/02
Posts: 15560
Loc: Forest Hill, MD USA
In reality, Captain Russ and I have a lot more in common than you may think. Sure, we disagree on politics (I'm right- he's wrong. wink ), but we both did a lot of the same things throughout our lifetimes, broadcast TV and Radio, photography, video editing and production, voice overs and many others. However, I sincerely believe the thing both of us enjoyed most was helping others in any way we possibly could. Over the past few years, we have kept in touch on a weekly basis, often discussing the various aspects of music. Now, I only played and owned 4 guitars and a mandolin before transitioning to an arranger keyboard. Russ owns more guitars than most music stores in my part of the world. wink I think he owns guitars that cost more than my van. ;), but now he's in the process of selling many of them.

Love ya, Russ, keep in touch,

Gary (the old codger.)
_________________________
PSR-S950, TC Helicon Harmony-M, Digitech VR, Samson Q7, Sennheiser E855, Custom Console, and lots of other silly stuff!

K+E=W (Knowledge Plus Experience = Wisdom.)

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