The Ewww OMG!! You Play Other Peoples Songs? post got me thinking.

Had my PA 4X 76 for 1 1/2 years & I have NEVER ONCE used the pre-done songlists live. I messed around for fun at home for say 30 minutes with "Let it Be".

But I have only used my PA4X for Worship & I just learn the song and pick a style and play "live" piano with it. I set up my own songlist with styles chosen, but have not once used a pre-done tune so to speak.

I guess I don't play "Arrangeresque". And I ALWAYS play piano as a rhythm rather than ever using a lead instrument. It gives the feeling & sound of me playing keys with a live band.

So I never once have gotten a KARAOKE reference. It's like me sitting at the keys and the boys following me

Maybe I'm using an Arranger wrong, but it is more organic for me I guess...

Hi - I don't use arranger "songs" either. I use Styles (on Tyros) all the time, but I play the song myself, with the Style adding the bass and drums (and a few other sounds; I often mute out some of them if the style is too "Busy" or "Full"). I play rhythmically with my left hand a lot (more than just laying a chord down), and my right hand is either playing rhymically or doing fills (if I am working with a singer), or playing a melody or "solo" if I am playing w/o vocals.

I don't really know what an arranger "song" is, unless maybe it's a MIDI file of a song? Anyway, I've never used any sort of "Song"; I use the Styles, play the chords and song myself. I know there a lot of ways to use an Arranger keyboard; this is the method I've used for many years. I kind of thought that was how most/many people used an Arranger keyboard?

-Jim

As many people have said over and over these arranger KBs have so many features that many don't ever utilize and that's a sin,....keep an open mind to your music, dig deep into your machine, ask questions,watch youtube videos, and you will be amazed at what can be done with it's tools.
There are NO rules just great music....have fun!

Over the years, I created my own song list, one song at a time, entered them into the Music Finder Directory and registrations, which amounted to a little over 700 songs that I performed regularly. The big advantage of this for a live performer is that you can instantly access the song, the correct style, tempo, etc... and pretty much eliminate dead time between songs. That said, there are some really good settings already in most arranger keyboards for specific songs, and as Donny said, they are rarely explored, which I too believe is sinful not to utilize those tools. You don't have to use them religiously, and you can delete the ones you will never use and create your own custom directory. Until he passed away, there was a guy here that did nothing but worship songs in three different churches with his Tyros 2. He went through a hymnal and set up a massive music finder directory of those songs, all ready to play at a single touch of a button. How neat is that?

Good luck,

Gary

Whenever I start to learn a new song, I will first go to the songbook to see if there is a 'song' listed similar to the one I want to play and check out the style used ... Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't ...

Great idea....I've built up about 80 songs from styles. Gonna go this route and see what comes of it. I've got a pretty darn good repertoire already so this can only give me more diversity

Ah, I see, by "songbook' he meant the equivalent of Yamaha's Music Finder Database MFD, and not MIDI songs. I have used the MFD some, but in most cases I've elected to create my own Registrations instead, if only to customize things a bit more to my liking. With my iPad and unrealBook app and the MIDI data that I'd set up to recall Registrations for me, I can get a song's Registration loaded and ready in ~1 second, so it's still fast enough fro my needs.

But as some have said, the MFD (or "songbook") is sometimes a good place to look for ideas on Style that suit a song you're going to do, a possible Tempo value, etc. Somewhere in the past, there was an Excel spreadsheet with all the "stock" Yamaha MFD data in it. (Yamaha's MFD from some Tyros, with corrected song titles etc.)

Jim

The Yamaha MFD and KORG Songbook shouldn't even be in the same sentence,.......
KORGs version is so much more powerful and flexible then Yamahas which needs a major redesign, IMO..
but if it helps the player somewhat so be it.

Donny, now that is nasty, especially coming from a turncoat that never used the MFD - EVER!

Good luck with your almost new PA4X,

Gary

Gary with no Transpose and no way to change fonts size that you need a Hubble telescope to see and no tilt the MFD is a useless feature for MY needs sorry...but other then that and the sub par VH2 the S970 does a great job with workarounds for sure style & sound wise....maybe the next generation MOTL kbs will be better designed we'll see..

Maybe it's time to get those eyes worked on, Donny. I can see that screen just fine from any position on the S-850, the font is more than adequate size for my old eyes, and I no longer wear glasses since I had my cataract operation 4 years ago. As for the automatic transpose, I just put that information into the title of the song, hit the transpose button and go. And I can do that while the prior song is ending without having any effect on the song until I hit a key, at which point it's instantaneous. I'll put my dead time between songs up against anyone.

You'll be back!

Gary

It's been like three days already.....he may already be back . Keep an eye on that Signature .

chas

Gary,....at least we agree to disagree,..we all do it different.
Lets just leave it at that.

Donny,

While you're on the subject of differences between Yamaha and Korg, perhaps you wouldn't mind telling us the reason for your switch to Korg and your impressions of the pros and cons between the two systems.

Tracy I've had and performed with both Yamaha & KORG and many others so many times before including this second KORG Pa4x...although being a Pro KB player for 20 years before the first arrangers even came to market I actually started with my first "Arranger KB which was a KORG SAS20 in the early 80's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOyD0TTWzdI

I was always a KORG Guy before that I was using a KORG M1, T2, for years also in bands,....Thru the years I've owned every iSeries i3, i30, & Pa Series Pa60.80.500,etc,....and the same goes for Yamahas Psr,S Tyros series, and Ketron X1, X9, SD1, SD5 SD7, Roland G1000, G70, BK5, and so many more,.....now back to your question of Korg VS Yamaha in today's world,.....sound and style wise I feel are both up to par but each has its own signature sound which is preferable to each player both are amazing if you know how to set them up. For me it comes down to "Navigational Features" in live play for MY playing style.That includes since Im a Singer first and a player second many things that the Pa4x has on-board that suit my needs more then the Yamaha: S970.

These are a few KORG features made me switch back,

Large Color Tilt up touch Display, metal build, Songbook, TC Helicon VH, on deck Sliders & buttons, EDS-X (Enhanced Definition Synthesis-eXpanded)Filters with Resonance - Three band EQ for each track, 128 Voices, 128 Oscillators, Final Mastering Effects: Waves Audio Ltd. MAXX Suite, Full Edit, Time Slice, Sampling feature, Guitar Mode 2,MIDI Song to Style Converter, Chord Sequence recorder in Style Play mode, KAOSS Automatic MIDI FX generator, Double MP3 Player and MP3 Recorder, Markers with Add, Delete, Edit and Loop functions,Jukebox function,Four Assignable Pads + Stop Buttons,Pad Record function,Mic: Combo XLR balanced with Gain control and Phantom Power, 550 Factory Styles, freely reconfigurable sets, and I know it's silly and NO Wall WART , for starters I can go on and on many of these features were reasons that swayed my opinion to go back to KORG vs Yamaha which I had to use many workarounds to get the desired needs filled on stage,....after years in the deep trenches most of my playing now has been in studio recording different projects, and KORG offers the tools to suit my needs musically combines with VST's, DAW, etc,... That said, in the "playing out" as a solo musician/singer OMB scenario, this is where the Yamaha S970 shines and is more then capable to perform with the best of them to a point depending on your needs of course. That said, today's arrangers can be made to sound terriffic no doubt its all up to what your looking for, ....but for me it's the "features & navigation while I'm playing". Imo at this time I just think that KORG is on a faster track toward the future of music then Yamaha, I hope I didn't confuse you too much but this is how I feel and I tried to answer as honestly and thoroughly as possible from my perspective....

Take care,

In the end, you have to please yourself, despite well meaning opinions to the contrary.

Your very wise friend Bernie...talk soon right now Im updating
to v.2

Thanks Donny for your interesting reply-much appreciated and good luck with the new arranger!

Tracy your very welcome...if you need anything just shout!