This is me playing my Yamaha PSR-S700. I used the Live Grand Piano, but I tweaked it a bit (changes to the filters, EQ, and effects). The song is called River Flows In You.

It's not note for note, and I made a few mistakes, but it's a very pretty song. Hated the movie series this song is associated with, but this song was fun to learn.

I used Mixcraft-6 to record the audio. Hope you all like it.

SoundCloud

Squeak, this is very, very good. I love the piano sound...I'm guessing you rolled off a bit of filter and/or brightness, which gives the piano a lovely rounded tone.

Your playing is excellent.

Ian

PS...Live Grand is still my go to piano, even with the new SA Pianos on the Tyros4

Thanks Ian.., glad you liked it. Backing off the filters is exactly what I did. I also pulled back on the Hi-EQ setting as well to get a more warm bodied tone. Reverb was also adjusted. Thanks for listening to it.

It's your style of playing that makes it, Squeak...you have what I call, "the touch"...lots of emotion evident in your phrasing...and, of course, having such a beautiful piece of music is a plus too.

Ian

Great piano sound, Squeak. Good rendition of the song as well.

Thanks for submitting this,

Gary

Thanks Gary.., and for taking the time to listen to it!

Ian.., what makes this song harder than it should be IMO is that it's really best played on a set of weighted keys. Some piano songs, you can squeeze by with synth action, but not this one.

The PSR's light synth action made it difficult to play some parts, but after several attempts (and a few choice words) I pulled of a one shot with minimal playing mistakes.

I think it's time I get my hands on a full 88 weighted controller. I do get the chance several times a week to play on an actual piano, but in my home set up it's all synth action keys.

I've really been considering just trading in/selling some gear and getting either the MOXF8 or the Kross-88. I can't believe the Kross-88 goes for under a grand!

A second hand or even a new Yamaha P85 or P95, they are both sweet feeling 88's, with midi, Squeak.

I've been beating around the idea of getting that new Casio PX5S synth...it supposedly has a great weighted 88 note keyboard, and the synth is a killer..

Even though you were handicapped by the light action, it sure didn't sound like it...lots of expression!

Ian

PS I've heard good things about the Kross 88.

Squeak, I played an MO8 for an hour down in the Florida Keys at an outdoor gig. By the end of the hour my hands were so cramped I didn't think I would ever be able to play again. The hurt the rest of the evening, despite a couple Margarettas and some aspirin. Old guys like me need that lighter touch.

Good Luck,

Gary

Very nice indeed, squeak ...

Tasty, squeak...

Damn, I have to agree with Diki again.
DonM

absolutely beautiful, and like Ian says it is the player in the first place who has to pull it off. Incidentally I played the new Yamaha DGX650 (88 keys, weighted) which in Europe sells for 760 euros, fantastic piano sounds, additional 500 sounds and 200 styles. Might be an idea ?

Could you fill in the exact value changes you made to the piano sound as regars, filter, eq and reverb ? I would like to implement them on my PSR750 grand piano and see what happens....

kind regards,
John Smies

I really enjoyed your rendition. Thanks for sharing!

Nice tune, well played, .. .....it's screaming for a style to come in like "Rock Ballad" or West End Ballad" to give it more life half way thru.

Thanx for sharing.

Thanks fellas!

Gary.., funny you mentioned the MO8. I used to own that board and to date I'm still kicking myself in the (you know what) for getting rid of it.

At the time I wasn't where I wanted to be with a computer set up, so my work was primarily hardware, and I had to rely heavily on internal sequencers. The limited 64 note poly on that MO just wasn't cutting it for me, but DAMN! I'd sure love to have that board again just for those keys and it's controller capabilities.

If you're not used to playing on weighted keys.., don't feel bad about the age thing. There are many players in their 20's who have to recover from an evening of playing on weighted keys. That's why I play on a real piano several times a week to keep my fingers in shape (thankfully I have a friend who is kind enough to let me play their piano).

John.., the settings for this piano are VERY simple. First I have to note that I "do not" use any EQing on the overall keyboard sound. I keep that set to FLAT.

For the sound I used the Live Grand

Filters:
Bright -11
Harmo -2

Scroll over to the Effect Tab:
Set Low EQ to +8
Set Hi EQ to +2

DSP Depth set to 40. (this area is really suited to taste.., you could add more or less)

That's it.., it really didn't take much editing. The biggest change you'll hear to this sound is when you roll off on those filters. You'll immediately hear the sound darken when you drop the "Bright".

Thanks Squeak, I will give it a try first thing tomorrow morning and let you know what I find...........

regards,
John

...which I did.

Does not really work out well according to me on the PSR750, that is I prefer the factory live grand piano. With the settings that you use on the 700 the sound becomes too muffled, but then again it is all a matter of taste. Besides I gather that the PSR750 samples are different if not necessarily better than those on the 700. Ah well I am not really a piano player ( wish I was) and I keep on saying this, I played the new DGX650 and think it is a marvellous piano sound for a budget price. But first I have to think "harmoniser " and " acoustic guitar ", so the DXG will be on my wishlist for next year.

regards,
John

Some of us need to reacquaint ourselves with a REAL piano. And a good one, at that..!

While bright pianos can help you cut through a mix, unless you are talking say a Yamaha CIIIF or the like (and even that is nice and warm at medium touch), you'll find that, until you really pound it, a real piano IS nice and warm and darker than you think. So, if you go for the exposed piano as the solo instrument, you really do need to darken it down somewhat, especially Yamaha arrangers, where the piano's come extremely bright and tinkly.

One of the reasons I like my G70's main piano is that it comes OOTB pretty much like a real piano. A lot of people have commented that it seems not bright enough, but I disagree. It sounds like a piano! Not a piano with a boatload of high EQ, low rolloff, and hardened hammers...

I think squeak's tweaks have done a great job of returning believability to the Yamaha's piano sound.

SPOT ON DIKI! I guess it kinda goes along with one of DNJ's posts where he said "I'm not a piano player". Some players stick to keyboards and units with synth action keys (and that's it). So some of these over bright, tinky tonk sounding pianos in a few keyboards are acceptable to their ears.

You're absolutely right in that a real pianos tone is FAR from what you hear on say a Yamaha arranger. It's MUCH MUCH warmer, and "muddied up" in a good way depending on how you have the lid set. Plus I think many seem to forget that a piano is like other stringed instruments in that they sound better with age. You get an amazing warm, deep, and dark sound from a 30+ year old grand that has been taken care of.

I have a couple user pianos that I edited on my S-700 to simulate various positions of the lid and room size. A few are very warm, and some very dark simulating a completely closed lid.., AND they still get brighter as I spank the keys a little harder.

Sqk

Squeak,

This is a very nice edit for the Live! Grand.

It adds a warmth and softness (but no wooliness) I love to hear doing jazz ballads.

I like it better than my own setting (below) which works very well too.



Filter:

Harmonic Content: +2

Brightness: -12



Scroll to Effect tab.

EQ High: +32

EQ Low: +44

Reverb is Hall 3 at around 20 or to taste.


I have the Master EQ set as follows:

Q: 2.2

Freq: 70Hz

EQ 1: +2 db

EQ 2: -1 db

EQ 3: -24 db

EQ 4: -1 db

EQ 5: +2 db

Again, thanks for sharing you settings, and, of course, your excellent playing.

Ian

Ian, I think you may have a typo for EQ 3: 24 - you can't get there from here.

Gary

You are correct, Sir Gary...that was my mistake.

It should be EQ 3: -2 db.

Thanks for pointing that out.

Ian

Does anyone think the common everyday audiences notices the editing changes to the Piano sound, especially within a mix?

Probably not Donny, but a great sounding and responding piano voice is very noticeable to me, the player, and it certainly is inspirational.

My piano edit works well as a solo piano, as well as in the mix (with the accompaniment), although I find it suits jazz ballads the best. The stock (unedited) Live! Grand works a treat for pop and country, at least for me.

I still prefer the Live!Grand over the SA Pianos...I find it more even across the range.

Ian

Thank you Ian

No problem, Donny.

I think maybe keyboard people like us would notice, but the majority of listeners would simply enjoy the piece as one being sensitively played by a fine player.

Ian

Do you think the audiences notices anything much at all? LOL

They are either having a good time, or not. And the process for doing that concerns them absolutely not at all! Most of them nowadays don't care if you sing flat, play badly, or use tracks for everything..!

Why would they care how the EQ is set up for your piano sound..?

But, unconsciously, they either like you or they don't. And not grating on their ears by trying to do a sensitive ballad on a bright, tinkly, unrealistic piano sound (when you KNOW that the CD's they like sure don't go that route!) will help them like you, even if they don't know WHY.

There are times when I wonder if you think the audience cares about ANYTHING, Donny... And the truth is, no, not really. Other than they have a good time or not. But how you set up your sound, what songs you pick, how you present yourself affects that. But they don't know WHY they like you or not.

But we do, don't we?

Honestly piano is my least used sound.

Then wouldn't it be something that those that actually DO use it might have a more informed opinion? LOL

Hard to say whether the audience cares or not, when one doesn't use it!

I think Ac.Piano would be one of my most used sounds, followed by, SA Ac.Guitar, SA2 Jazz Sax, Strings, SA2 Harmonica, SA2Jazz Trumpet, SA Single Coil Electric Guitar, and SA WhiterBars Organ.

I can easily rhyme these off as that's how my 8 registrations are always set up.

For style specific sounds, perhaps electric piano, or a synth patch, for instance, I put them in the style's OTS, but the above are my favorites for playing instrumental music.

Ian

No regrets for "HOW I DO IT".....after 45+ years gigging..lol
can we get back on topic.

Squeak, I'm impressed with your musicianship. I don't give a crap if you played it on a piano from the "GUNSMOKE" set, it would still impress me. I'm more into musicianship and how well a musician plays more so then the tone (sound) of the Piano (instrument), just as long as it's in tune.

I hadn't a clue that you played this well. I can't jam with you because I can't play two classical notes in a row without screwing up.

I sure would like to hear Squeak play the same piece on a Yamaha CF-III or Steinway B grand piano.

Like you, Boo, I didn't know Squeak played that well...all I ever heard was some synthesizer stuff he posted.

His piano playing is beyond reproach with the posted tune.


Ian

Squeak, you wouldn't be screwing around with us would ya? LOL

Thanks fellas.., I'm really glad you all liked that piece. I enjoy playing keyboards, but I'm both a pianist and a keyboardist. My issue however is that I can't read music AT ALL! You put a piece of sheet music in front of me.., and I'll grab a pen and just start connecting the dots

This song I posted was 95% by ear and the other 5% by watching vids of others playing (for the parts that ended up just pissing me off)

Maybe I should post a few more song using the other pianos I edited on my S-700. The S-700's pianos aren't bad.., they're just too bright and need to be warmed up a bit. Thankfully you at least get the basic synth parameters for editing on these units. Without the ability to control the filters.., no amount of EQ'ing can accomplish what's needed (IMO). Ya gotta have filter control.

Oh Ian.., I actually got the chance to play this on an OLD OLD OLD Steinway a week ago. Helped someone move audio equipment at a church and this church had a very old Steinway. The piano was WELL KEPT for sure, and MY GOODNESS.., the tone from that well aged soundboard was AMAZING!

It almost rivaled one of the best sounding Steinway pianos I've ever played (which was the one my high school had).

When I took piano lessons, we had a Steinway at home...unfortunately it was not a grand, but a big old upright.

The nicest grand I ever played, also at my high school (St.Michael's), was a fairly new Petrof. I used it, along with a Hammond M-3 and Arp Omni, in a performance of the musical "Hair" which we performed in the school gym. I still have one of the programs that they passed out at the door somewhere in my papers. I can't remember the year off hand.

The Petrof had a nice mixture of warmth and bite, and I played it at every opportunity. It's still in use at the new high school, and still sounds great according to those who have played it recently.

And I agree about the filters for shaping the piano's sound...you couldn't get the results you got without them.

They also work good on the Tyros4's SA2 Jazz Sax, and the SA2 Violin to give nice variations of those tones.

If you do another piano piece, please don't hesitate to share it here.

Ian

I think one of the things to take from this thread is perhaps a realization that how 'realistic' something sounds depends a lot on the surroundings.

Our arrangers are generally set up to be able to do a complete mix without that much input from the player, and consequently, we often find that certain sounds, when soloed, do not sound quite on the money, having already been sculpted by EQ into something that cuts a dense mix, and doesn't muddy it up. All well and good when you are burying it in a busy style.

But as you bring it further to the fore, those shortcomings show up more and more.

This is why I'm often unimpressed by arranger demos that show off single sounds, and compare them to each other. In context, in a busy mix, they may well fool the ear. But solo them, things often change. Arrangers tend to be voiced for the way most use them... the style doing most of the work, and you merely providing a melody. But start to use them in more exposed settings, and you often have to undo some of the processing added to make it cut the mix.

Squeak did a great job here, possibly the first Yamaha arranger piano solo I have heard that didn't make me scream 'TOO BRIGHT!'