If anybody used or uses both these keyboards, can you comment on size?

The tyros 4 is way too bulky and heavy to gig with. I have a pro flight case with wheels and its just way to big and heavy. Not practical.

in contrast:

Is the Korg pa3x alot smaller and possibly fit in a lighter case? (with wheels)?

I'd love to hear about it

Shim,

Not certain about the weight but the Pa3x must be the smallest footprint professional KBA on the market, very narrow, you can carry it under one arm, not for long mind you, the T4 unless your a big boy, you will struggle under one arm and the Audya it needs two to carry it, " TRUSS ME"

The Audya has got to be the heaviest KB ever produced, IMO, perhaps the Roland G70 next, all this data is on the internet somewhere, Shim.

Tony

Hi Tony

My Lionstracs Mediastation takes the heavy honors! I have the Audya 76 as well. My Mediastation is the 76 key version a tank!
My Kronos 61 feels like a toy compared to my arrangers.

David

David,

Forgot about the MS, I was going to buy one a long time back and yes you are right it full to the brim with kit, how is it, do you play it much, the people who have them don't give any feedback. Hell they must be expensive now, I think they are only made in small numbers, they look the part, but??? You have some kit with those three, what do you think of the Kronos I still keep looking at it. You have at least two of the best KB. Do you live new DNJ?

Tony

Tyros 4 weighs 32 lbs

PA3X 61 weighs 32.4 lbs

PA3X 76 weighs 38.58 lbs

The weight thing is no real reason to not buy a Tyros 4.

As for a lightweight ATA case with wheels here's one that is proving to be popular at 20 lbs!

http://www.synthzone.com/forum/ubbthread..._Als#Post330486

Tony,

I carry the T4 under one arm everytime I set up and tear down. You must be a little shaver

Shim,


Because I didn't want to buy another case for the T4 I'm using a Guardian 76 key case for it. It's a little too big when you come right down to it, but I like the Guardian case, its weight and construction. Now with a Pa3x I can use my 61 key Guardian for the Pa3x. Comparing the T4 to the Pa3x size wise, it makes the Pa3x look like a mini arranger.

Scott

I can see you are a big lad... off your avatar

Regards

Tony

Shim,
I gig daily, often multiple times a day with my Tyros 4. I don't fly on planes with it. But, it fits nicely in my car and is easy handle. I use a Rock-N-Roll Cart for all my equipment and it is a one trip in and out event.
I doubt you are going to find any of the TOTL arranger any lighter or at least enough so to make a real difference.
Deane

The PA3x seems much easier to handle than the T4 to me. It fits in a conventional sized bag. The Roland E80 was by FAR the heaviest arranger I've ever had. I would still have it if it weighted under 40 pounds. I think it was 54! PSR9000 wasn't far behind.
DonM

I hope the next generation of Tyros and Motif are slimmer. I never understood why they are so darn bulky. It's almost like Yamaha didn't consider that people might take these keyboards out of their homes to perform on.

Tyros is build as a home Keyboard... Yamaha never intended that people use it to gig. And i don't think they will change that any time soon.

I get that, but why are the Motif so FAT too?

Tyros is build as a home Keyboard... Yamaha never intended that people use it to gig. And i don't think they will change that any time soon.[/quote]

You hit the nail right on the head.....!
the emphasis on "HOME KEYBOARD"

Anyone want to trade the tyros 4 for pa3x 61?

In my opinion, the Tyros4 is primarily meant(and designed) for home use, but, many professional (advanced) players are using it for gigging..it is only 30 lbs or so.

If we want to really define the "home keyboard" thing, any instrument with "easy play" features, like single finger chording, automatic accompaniment, and automatic harmony in Right Hand, is a home keyboard...and yes, that includes the Tyros4, but also, the PA3X (and Pro), the G-70...even the Audya. The Korgs have a more sophisticated editing system, but they are still arrangers made primarily for the home player.

Yamaha and Roland keep things a bit simpler, although you can extensively edit the former with the software included with the instrument.

Having built in speakers really makes arrangers even more "homier", like the S910, the PA-800, the E-80 etc.

If they were designed exclusively for pros, you would not see a "single finger", or "one finger chord" option, or built in speakers.

It's good the entry level PA-500, is working for you on gigs, but, truth be told, you are playing a home keyboard.

That's not so bad, is it?

Ian

PS...Good luck with your eyes...I hope you are back in shape as quickly as possible.

If an arranger is made of plastic then its pretty much meant for home use....lets face it metal is more rugged for the road...although yes most are home Kbs as you say doesn't mean it cannot be taken on the road & used with TLC to get a pro sound and fill pro needs...Tyros kbs in general have a lot of wasted real-estate and can definitely be re-sized and trimmed down for sure...

Thank you for the well wishes.

Just a comment about "one finger" chords...I believe this to be true with Yamaha and Casio...I recall one of these companies has the non musical design...root and next key to the right makes a minor chord etc....it is so wrong to use ...

I will say that Roland does not use a one finger chord...the "intelligent " mode is designed for incomplete chord fingering and calculates the intended chord...It is very different from what I mention above...

Roland uses simplified chording for home use and beginners. There's nothing "intelligent" about Roland's system...it's made for those without the intelligence (or skill) to play full chords such as a rank beginner or non-keyboardist.

The G-70 is a home keyboard designed for players who want to use their own speaker system...it's that simple...Tyros4 is designed for the same purpose (although they do offer a bespoke speaker system) and so is Korg PA-3X.

Lots of pros gigging with "plastic" keyboards as well..you see guys, that's why they make road cases. People gig with delicate violins and acoustic guitars and lots of other fragile instruments...ALL instruments require extra care when used out gigging.

Donny gigged for quite some time with a plastic fantastic S910, and it didn't break; Gary Diamond has been using a PSR-3000 since I can remember, and no issues with the case or anything else. Scott Yee has done hundreds of gigs with his Tyros2 and Tyros4...no problems.

Let's face it...you drop any electronic instrument on a hard floor, and you are going to do damage, especially internal. I don't believe arrangers were meant to be tossed in the back of a van without a case.

A Tyros (or PA-500) in a road case is every bit as secure as a metal bodied instrument...no keyboardist in his right mind would gig without a road case, or at the very least, a good gig bag.

Ian

PS...Donny, I can assure you there is no wasted real estate on (or inside) the Tyros4...it's packed inside, so all space is well used and needed.

Right on the money, Fran. I never did "get" Yamaha's idea of making chords with adjacent keys. Talk about setting a person off on the wrong foot.

Me neither, guys...it's definitely a stupid system, as are all "easy play" chording systems...they are all very limiting to what type chords can be played. Deciding which one is worse, is like deciding which leg you'd rather have amputated.

By the time you learn how to use the "simple" or "intelligent" system, you may as well have spent the time learning how to play chords properly.

No matter what simple chord system being used, it just further pushes home that these arrangers like Tyros4, PA3X and G-70 are basically fancier (and pricier) home units...but some enterprising musicians use them for gigging.

Ian

My friend Bill (Semilive) was kind enough to offer to put my E80 in my truck at the last Shreveport Jam. He tripped on a loose door facing going out the door, did a head-first flip into the parking lot where he dropped the E80 about 6 feet onto the concrete steps. It was not in a case, because I used the only case I had in which it would fit for my Audya. The E80 was unscathed.
Not so for Bill, who is still having problems with his back and neck from the fall.
Point is the E80, which weighs about 54 pounds is built like a tank. Not sure any other board I've ever owned would have survived that ugly accident!
DonM

Some people are very lucky, Don. It depends on how it lands...internal circuitry can easily be jarred loose, but, fortunately for you, it wasn't. The E-80 was never meant to be gigged with...far too heavy.

Not using a case...tsk tsk! Should have put Bill in one.

Ian

Ian, here is where we have to disagree...again....

"Arranger" keyboards have the stigma of "home" entertainment...in the past.....No more...Since they are well known and used by Pros nowadays...with quality sounds and features...

Roland G70 as an example...76 great action keys, Mic and harmonizer (first class), separate out puts (What home users need this?)..Steel chassis, and durable buttons...This unit says "Professional" all over it

The counter offerings from General Music (Genesys Pro), Ketron SD1, Korgs PA2x and 3X 76 models...All these have the quality built and features that Pro use demands..I will suggest they are Pro models and not "home" keyboards....

Make them cheap, light plastic , lower quality knobs and screens and add speakers.....now you have a "home keyboard"..

Enter the Korg models with speakers including the PA800, the Yamaha PSR s910, and sorry to say the Tyros4 is right in there too...Roland you can look at the Prelude, E-50/60 and yes the E80....Doesn't mean any of them could not work on the gig...but the quality design and features dictate what models are designed as Pro models and what are home models...

Oh well, Fran...we'll have to agree to disagree, and I'm cool with that.

This thread has drifted off topic long enough...my apologies to shim.

Find me an arranger that does not have easy play features, and I will agree that it is a professional instrument.

Ian