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#310441 - 04/14/10 07:02 AM Audio buffer set too low.
Irishacts Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1631
Loc: Ireland
Hi all.
How do you adjust the audio buffers for VSTi's ?

VSTHOST lists it as a set value and I need to change it because some of the VSTi's that came with the keyboard don't run right. The buffer is set way too low and you can hear the VSTi choking.

Regards
James

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#310442 - 04/15/10 03:00 AM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
LIONSTRACS Offline
Member

Registered: 12/13/05
Posts: 664
Loc: Italy
Quote:
Originally posted by Irishacts:
Hi all.
How do you adjust the audio buffers for VSTi's ?

VSTHOST lists it as a set value and I need to change it because some of the VSTi's that came with the keyboard don't run right. The buffer is set way too low and you can hear the VSTi choking.

Regards
James


You can not change the ASIO buffer on VstHost and to any multiple ASIO host.

The true Audio Host is Jack, where is setting on default to 128 samples buffer, for the LOW latency, that is fixed around @1ms.

In fact some VSTi need more buffer, because are not so well optimized ( on Windows normally they use 512 samples frames..but then automatically you get from 8-12ms latency)
Our system request good and fast optimized VSTi, many shareware VSTi are not so well working and made a lot of xruns.

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#310443 - 04/15/10 05:49 AM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
Irishacts Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1631
Loc: Ireland
Thanks for the reply.

Quote:
Our system request good and fast optimized VSTi, many shareware VSTi are not so well working and made a lot of xruns.


Sure, but just from using what you provided on the keyboard the vast majority of those plugins don't work right at all. FM7, FM8, MASSIVE, KORG Legacy Cell. I'd consider them premium plug-ins.

I have to say Domenico I have a very sour taste in my mouth here for Linux right now. I have compatibility problems from just using Wine. There's a Memory Leak you have no control over which causes all sound to be lost form the VSTHOST and also crashes the keyboard. Ok a fix is in the works, but right now its a problem. Even when you get that fixed I still can't use the plugins mentioned because I can't even adjust the audio buffer.

Why even bother with Linux at this rate ?

If the buttons on the keyboard worked with Windows right now, I'd wipe the keyboard clean and install Windows 7 and go it on my own. It gets very frustrating over time when you can't do what the keyboard is designed to do.

Sorry to vent like this, but the more of the keyboard I start using the more I find it fighting back at me.

Regards
James

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#310444 - 04/15/10 07:15 AM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
LIONSTRACS Offline
Member

Registered: 12/13/05
Posts: 664
Loc: Italy
the new Wine 1.1.43 will be released this friday and then we compile for test.
I will ask to Znago wich better old Wine version have installed and I give you the package for testing too.
Is also fixed the new COMBI mode, maybe tomorrow we add also the Input Midi ports for play the desidered Layers with a different keyboards or USB controller.

You can also full install windows/7 the MS is working, BUT then you dont have any windows drivers for the Digital volumes control, Audio card, touchscreen and of course you lose the all OS 4 features.
Unfortunally I have the dependence of Wine..there we can not make miracle.
The only way for have a GOOD wine-Asio, OS, is to make a really BIG donation to the Wine developers.
They are only interested to bugfix of the video games and standard windows application, IF someone make a big donation, they will fix this too.

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#310445 - 04/15/10 11:54 AM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
Bachus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 03/02/06
Posts: 5138
Its not Linux you should blame James... As an operating system Linux is much more fit for real time operations then Windows (with the right Kernel)

I suppose its all the 3rd party solutions that still don't work together perfectly... But any VSt that works on Muse receptor should also work on Mediastation...

But Muse did create a lot of special interfecing for certain VSt's to get them running on their receptors... I have no clue how Dom has solved those issues.

Next to that whole loads of VSt's are not fuly compatible with the receptor yet, and as you can guess by now, receptor is also working on Linux.
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#310446 - 04/15/10 01:55 PM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
miden Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 01/31/06
Posts: 3351
Loc: The World
Quote:
Originally posted by Bachus:
Its not Linux you should blame James... As an operating system Linux is much more fit for real time operations then Windows (with the right Kernel)

I suppose its all the 3rd party solutions that still don't work together perfectly... But any VSt that works on Muse receptor should also work on Mediastation...

But Muse did create a lot of special interfecing for certain VSt's to get them running on their receptors... I have no clue how Dom has solved those issues.

Next to that whole loads of VSt's are not fuly compatible with the receptor yet, and as you can guess by now, receptor is also working on Linux.



But don't forget, the VST's HAVE to run under WINE other-wise no go

And I still have not heard ANY decent native Linux VST's.

It's that emulation interface that creates the issues.

I note that James seems to be hitting the same frustrating "roadblocks" that I encountered.

And even though the new WINE is released this Friday (if it actually DOES is another matter) it will be some time before the new ISO with the updated Lionstracs OS will be actually compiled and tested and then avaialble.

Dennis

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#310447 - 04/16/10 04:28 AM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
Irishacts Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1631
Loc: Ireland
Quote:
Its not Linux you should blame James..


My problem is squarely with with third party software, not lionstracs or Linux per say.

Even if the next release of Wine is flawless, you still can't adjust the ASIO buffer size and therefore I expect many VSTi's to never work on the keyboard good enough.

That's never ever...!!!!

1ms Latency is great but ultimately useless if it's the direct cause of the system never being able to run many plug-ins. I'd rather have 4 or 5ms and everything work.

Regards
James

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#310448 - 04/16/10 07:31 AM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
LIONSTRACS Offline
Member

Registered: 12/13/05
Posts: 664
Loc: Italy
Quote:
Originally posted by Irishacts:
My problem is squarely with with third party software, not lionstracs or Linux per say.

Even if the next release of Wine is flawless, you still can't adjust the ASIO buffer size and therefore I expect many VSTi's to never work on the keyboard good enough.

That's never ever...!!!!

1ms Latency is great but ultimately useless if it's the direct cause of the system never being able to run many plug-ins. I'd rather have 4 or 5ms and everything work.

Regards
James


James
You have to understand that the ASIO driver are made only for windows, because they have a lot of issue and latency.
read here: http://www.driversupdate.org/asio-drivers.htm
ASIO drivers are specific to Windows.

The Mac OS X and Linux do not have any latency issues. Windows Vista for example cannot provide synchronized audio to multiple devices. With the ASIO drivers in place, the user can handle synchronizing using external clocks.

You can also find more article about this issue.

Anyway, i made also more test and now I'm really confused to understand where can be the real issue, IF is from Wine or from VstHost.

VstHost sometime lost the sound and will also kill the wineasio driver ( Asio>Jack).
this happen only when we change the VSTi patch.
IF you running up 6-8 multiple asio patch ( including the VstHost mode) and then you jump engine, the system continue work and not lose the sounds on jack.
This mean that 6-8 Wine host are running but only the VstHost lost the sounds when you change VSTi.

I made also a different test:
Loaded 8 different VstHost for each ASIO patch.
each ASIO patch with one VSTi loaded on VstHost
There I can change the program change nice and switch in realtime the 10 ASIO host without lost the sounds on Jack.
this way also is more fast to use as to change/loading the VSTi on the main VstHost mode.

So..at the end of this test now I'm really confused...where can be the true bug?
the MS OS system and linux have nothing to do, because they continue work "untill" wineasio crash Jack, then of course freeze the MS OS too, this is normally.

Are you able to make there this test too?
Maybe under multiple ASIo hos mode you can resolve your issue and you are more fast for chage engines.
let me know

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#310449 - 04/16/10 08:34 AM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
AFG Music Offline
Member

Registered: 03/12/09
Posts: 513
domenico maybe did you know about this project:

http://www.breakfastquay.com/dssi-vst/

maybe you can use this, i do not know!

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#310450 - 04/16/10 12:03 PM Re: Audio buffer set too low.
Irishacts Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1631
Loc: Ireland
Hi Domenico

Quote:
Anyway, i made also more test and now I'm really confused to understand where can be the real issue, IF is from Wine or from VstHost.


Maybe the buffer under-runs and the VSTHOST crashing and loosing sound are all a result of the same problems with Wine.

Has for example the KORG Wavestation Plug-in run on older versions of Wine without buffer problems ? I'm wondering because it does not work at all right now.

Regards
James

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