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#269484 - 08/21/09 02:59 PM Re: Survival or Death to the Arranger keyboard ?
rikkisbears Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 6020
Loc: NSW,Australia
Hi Diki,
just checked,psr's actually have a groove & dynamics functions in their style creator section.

Never thought to use it.
best wishes
Rikki


[QUOTE]Originally posted by Diki:
[B]One thing that would help assembling styles out of bits of other styles would be a 'groove extractor' like they have on a lot of MIDI DAW's (and audio, now).

Basically, this would allow you to impose the 'groove' (swing factor, 'feel', whatever you want to call it) from one part (whichever feels best to you), and impose its' feel onto other tracks you import. This would vastly increase the number of style possibilities, IMO...
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best wishes
Rikki 🧸

Korg PA5X 88 note
SX900
Band in a Box 2022

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#269485 - 08/21/09 03:44 PM Re: Survival or Death to the Arranger keyboard ?
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14212
Loc: NW Florida
Does it allow you to copy and paste? That's a pretty handy tool, there...

I think that Korg have got the best handle on style creation, allowing you to do it in a computer MIDI sequencer, then import easily to the arranger. No shortage of all the esoteric MIDI editing tools you would ever need.

But I feel they need one extra step... the ability to play the style WHILE it is still in the computer, as banging the files back and forth ('save' the style, transfer to the arranger, THEN get to listen if the edit actually worked, then re-edit the style, 'save', transfer to the arranger, listen to see if THAT worked, and so on and so forth ad nauseam ) is a total PITA.

Korg (and actually, all others too ) need to create a simple 'Style Player' software so that works in progress can be quickly checked as you edit them in place, IMO...
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#269486 - 08/21/09 08:19 PM Re: Survival or Death to the Arranger keyboard ?
rikkisbears Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 6020
Loc: NSW,Australia
Hi Diki,
don't know. Probably pretty basic compared to what sequencers can do.

Yep, luv the Korg import/export function.
DEfinately makes style editing easier.
One day I may have to look into a better pc sequencer. I'm using PT12 & XGworks, pretty basic.

As for the last suggestion, that would be great.

Actually I keep forgetting about the Korg pads. I could actually create my phrase library out of multipads. ie mute certain tracks in a style & audition the pads.
Then when a suitable combination is created, the pads came be copied into the style itself.
Organizing them might be a bit of a challenge.
best wishes
Rikki

Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
Does it allow you to copy and paste? That's a pretty handy tool, there...

I think that Korg have got the best handle on style creation, allowing you to do it in a computer MIDI sequencer, then import easily to the arranger. No shortage of all the esoteric MIDI editing tools you would ever need.


Korg (and actually, all others too ) need to create a simple 'Style Player' software so that works in progress can be quickly checked as you edit them in place, IMO...
_________________________
best wishes
Rikki 🧸

Korg PA5X 88 note
SX900
Band in a Box 2022

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#269487 - 08/21/09 08:39 PM Re: Survival or Death to the Arranger keyboard ?
rikkisbears Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 12/22/02
Posts: 6020
Loc: NSW,Australia
Hi Dave,
I must have explained that really badly.

What I meant was,
just say I'm looking for a style to play a waltz like moon river or fascination,
I try the onboard styles first, unless I missed some, I couldn't find one to suit.
Next I'll try muting all the tracks except drums & percussion . I think Slow Waltz 2 drums may work. Next I try the bass with the drums, doesn't work, so I have to use a different bass line. Then I'll check to see if any of the other instrument tracks suit the song.

Probably clear as mud. haahaa

Anyway since a phrase library as such, doesn't exist, I may look at trying to use multipads as a library. I keep forgetting about them.

best wishes
Rikki

Quote:
Originally posted by WDMcM:
OK, now I get it. Sort of like folks using Sony Acid to build songs out of individual phrases. That's cool.

Dave

_________________________
best wishes
Rikki 🧸

Korg PA5X 88 note
SX900
Band in a Box 2022

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#269488 - 08/22/09 12:39 AM Re: Survival or Death to the Arranger keyboard ?
abacus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5355
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Sequencer and Keyboard

Just connect the Midi Out of the sequencer to the Midi In of the keyboard, and tell the sequencer to use the voices on the keyboard, then as you modify any settings in the sequencer you will hear how it sounds as if you played on the keyboard. (Thats the way I have always done it since I started with Midi in about 1985, when I combined my Atari ST with my Wersi Alpha Organ)
Tip: If you own a Wersi OAS instrument, use Midi 2 for your sequencer, as by default this is set up to directly work with an external sequencer.
Hope this helps

Bill
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English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#269489 - 08/22/09 12:57 AM Re: Survival or Death to the Arranger keyboard ?
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14212
Loc: NW Florida
Trouble with that, Bill, is it still only plays the ONE sequence, and doesn't follow your chord input, or switch in and out of fills and Intro/Endings. Getting the basic pattern is not so tough, but designing styles that flow smoothly through the fills and other segments, and seem natural progressions through the Variations, and also provide just the right amount of variety between the maj/min/7th/dim variants is MUCH harder to tell from playing the one chord pattern you just created...

Just getting the chord parts' ranges right, so they don't jump around too much requires the style engine to play the part in the first place... Then listening to any glitches as you change mid beat from major to minor, etc. means a trip to the arranger...

It would speed things up and make decisions about things like this much easier if the computer actually PLAYED the style...

JMO...
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#269490 - 08/22/09 04:24 AM Re: Survival or Death to the Arranger keyboard ?
Irishacts Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1631
Loc: Ireland
Quote:
But I feel they need one extra step... the ability to play the style WHILE it is still in the computer,


There's this....
[URL=http://www.korgpa.com/pa_root/software/history/bonusware/pa1x/Pa1X_StyleToMidi_303.zip]http://www.korgpa.com/pa_root/software/history/bonusware/pa1x/Pa1X_StyleToMidi_303.zip[/ URL]

It allows you to bypass exporting the style to the Pa1X for testing and assembly. You can do the lot on the PC and test it through Midi.

Once your happy, you can load the actual style straight in. No conversions.

It's an old tool but all KORG Pa-Series keyboards can read this format of STY files.

Regards
James

[This message has been edited by Irishacts (edited 08-22-2009).]

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