Ok, here is the Live styler TCP network engine integrated on Mediastation:


The Live-Styler is running in background as Host server by network TCP control,thsi mean how you can see on the vodeo demo that will be never displayed during the play:


And here i made a small video demo on Youtube for shown how the Live-styler in Background Host server is working: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lV6Pry6REIg

The video is recorder from a normally videocamera with Mic.
The XG sounds used is the original Yamaha YXG50 VST, some DSP, GIGA and B4II Asio host sounds, then you know well how this engine are sounding..

I will update more info on the video and here soon...now is saturday..
best regards

Thanx Dom.......next time I hope you record directly into the camera for a better sound.
Mediastaion gets more interesting every time.

Yeah, it really gets your juices going......right up to the point where it starts playing. The SPECS (and potential) continue to make me want one, despite everything my ears are telling me. With all due respect, I don't think these audio clips are helping the MS's cause.

I still believe it is (or could be) an awesome music creation tool, but you really can't blame Diki and others for insisting that SOMEONE......ANYONE, make a decent piece of music on it. Send one to Herbie Hancock.

chas

Looking good there LIONSTRACS.
Seems the mediastation is a pretty powerful beast.


Regards.
James.

Chas, I am planning a road trip/vacation next January....I have you penciled in to stop by and say hello..if you share your email. and postal address..

My plan is to drive to the jam, with my MediaStation, and wife.. ....and stop by a few SZ member homes...If they want me to stop in...

We can set the MS up and you can record one of those quality videos, and place it on youtube....We can monitor through your 802's..

Fran, my wife and I would be honored to host you and your wife. We just purchased a new (to us) house (irresistible 'short sale') but it has lots of room (6500 sq.ft.-6 beds/6 baths) and there's just the two of us, so feel free to stay over and check out the local music scene if you like. It has a great space for a studio (probably intended as a large media room) and I should have it up to speed by then (I was thinking of trying to get Diki to come up and help me set it up - he doesn't know it yet ). My wife's a lousy cook but there are lots of great restaurants in the area, many with live music. Let's make it happen.

chas

PS: Just in case we have to 'sit in' in one of the clubs, start practicing Ebony and Ivory .

Indeed, but when we see a real good performance on this instrument.
There must be a better way to demo this unit.

Impuls

OK, Guys...now here is what he has.
A arranger (YES it is now officialy an arranger!) that plays Yamaha styles ( Last I looked there were a couple), virtually any soft synth (VSTi) Giga, etc. for solo and LH sounds. That means you are not stuck with the standard factory voices provided (Like in Yamaha, Korg, Roland, Ketron etc). That means if I want a close to perfect violin, Oboe, Clarinet, piano Sax, etc, etc. I can have it.

Dom,
Tell me the buttons on the MS that correspond to the LS functios. I would like a list of all that are currently programmed.
You can get technical...I know LS like the back of my hand.

Now, all you need is a very high quality XG, and Mega-Voice sound set for the styles...are you working on that?

Why not do a few COMPLETE songs with MS & LS and post MP3's...so we can reallyhear this thing!

Thanks,
Lee S.

Hi Guys,
one thing that's got me intrigued, is, I wonder what Yamaha would think about a perfect clone?
They appear to turn a blind eye when it comes to software like OMB & Live Styler & the hundreds of psr styles that are converted to other formats.
Guessing the reason may be because conversions don't sound as good as originals. They also require tweaking.
And in the case of OMB & Livestyler the PERFECT psr soundsource doesn't exist (as far as I'm aware.) Styles again require tweaking, which puts a lot of potential users off.

best wishes
Rikki

i dont know if that sounded beter than how the Ms sounded 3 years ago but having said that i have heard demos that didnt sound a whole lot better on from the main manufacturers keyboards also. Your demo showed one thing that just jumped out at me, forget the sound for a minute...how easy is it to navigate around the MS to change styles and sounds on the fly ? I know you are introducing new functionality on the MS all the time (although i dont understand why) but in the demo above i saw the demonstrator at one point press about 6 buttons to change a set up. Does the MS have one touch settings ? Another time the demonstrator took both his hands of the keys to change a setting ....lots of hands almost crossing over each other . It doesnt look very user friendly at all. I knom there is a steep learning curve for all arrangers but this looks challenging. Have you got a diagram you can publish on this site that shows the function buttons on the MS , the style sections, sound sections and one touch settings just so i can understand the physical layout and what the buttons do. There are lots of lights on your keyboard all active at the same time , looks confusing to me. Also the last style you played was a gospel style straight from the PA1X.It sounded really poor in comparrison to the original. It sounds like it might be quite time consuming to tweak any style to sound close to how it sounded on the original instrument.

[This message has been edited by spalding (edited 02-28-2009).]

[This message has been edited by spalding (edited 02-28-2009).]

So Fran.... Does that mean that you are estimating that maybe by next January, you will finally have the MS sounding like a decent arranger?

Because if it is any sooner, why not post something up now (or whenever it happens)?

You see, if it is me, I really don't think I could wait nearly a year to make something good on a piece of gear I just got (or already had for a couple of years or so!). If it were me, I'd want to be able to make something decent on it the day I got it, or it would be going back!

If I want to crown some folks here, Nigel is the first as "King of patience".
Chico

Realy nice thing YAMAHA STYLES on MS.


Thanks DOM.

Yeah, because playing them on a cheap PSR (which is what that sounded like) would be too simple and easy, wouldn't it?

What would have been more convincing would have been to already convert them to the best VSTi's you had, and have them actually sound BETTER than the cheap portable arranger they came from. JMO...

More likely that Yamaha turn a blind eye because they know that when it comes to arrangers, theirs are ready to go right out of the box which is what the huge majority of arranger buyers want. And that huge majority ain't gonna faff around with something as complex as the MS appears to be.

The only other reason may be that Yamaha are constucting the mother of all lawsuits on the styles copyright issue.

Where is the problem...Live Styler (included with the new MS) is a midi based Yamaha style player..The styles are wherever the consumer wants to get them...They are all over the place (most are terrible for me anyway..some are great)..And you can put your own sound library to use with LiveStyler...Unfortunately they have to be close to the XG wave table to sound like the Yamaha line...so why worry about using the better Giga sound library...

Correct Fran
The Live-styles is only a midi based yamaha styles player and then depend on wich XG soundfonts you will use.

I told in my old post too, the Yamaha YXG50 VST is just a simple 5Mb XG soundfonts and sounds really sh.......
In the next days is ready the new XG-GIGA soundbank and then you there can test what is the big sounds difference!
The sound designer made really a GOOD work, 480 XG sounds and 28 Drunkits, all stereo samples, the XG-GIGA library folder is about 4650Mb of data, plus the 1200Mb of the GM/GS soundbank.
Fortunally, the MS GIGA streaming sampler don't have the memory issue as the others..
This friday is ready to FREE download, just let me complete the sounds mapping LSCP list.

That's great news Dom.. My finger is poised over the download button..........

Dennis

OK Dom...that's what we have been needing! That is the real answer and the big breakthrough...trust me on this...I have been using LS for a long time and always wanted to put together a top quality VSTi based XG AND mega voice sound library for playing Yamaha styles.

The mega is not ncessary as LS will use the next closest sound...you guys may need to do some work in that area and maybe involve Norbert.

As a second project...why not actually do the mega voices? It can be done. To make sure they are right you will need a T2 or T3 available.

What about the list of LS functions controlled in MS? I would like the details on this...it is critical as to the real playability of Ls within MS.

Lee S.

Excuse the quesion...but MS is a full touch screen? If so LS will work very well on MS by using touch screen. I had a 15" touch screen here for a demo and used the touch screen with LS...worked super. Even though many will want real buttons...especially our seeing impared friends around the world.

Lee S.

Is there a reason for picking GIGA samples for the sounds? These sounds may be good enough for the arranger part and one could choose higher quality (and newer - Garritan, East-West, VSL, and others) voices for the lead (right hand) voices. Just something to think about.

yes, of course, is full touch screen and you can see on some video too when we like to change the all VST parameters too.

Live styler will work as TCP host, on virtual desktop 3, when you focus Live-styler, you can also use it during the play or for open the setups configuration, Midi I/O configuration.

If you touch the Live-styler patterns/features, they are sent to MS interface too, like a duplex TCP system.
NOTE: we have only integrated the arranger section features and NOT the right hand presets/sounds system, because for the right hand we will use the MS features.
IF you want, you can enalbe it BUT then you have to use this more features by the touch screen on Live styler.

step by step...
first we release the XG-GIGA soundbank under the MS Linuxsampler features and then MAYBE I can try to organize the same XG soundbank under the Linuxsampler VST system for the PC desktop user...BUT not sure that I will do.

After the XG-GIGA soundbank, the sound designer will try to "clone" the mega voices too, this is a little more complex work BUT is possible, because the Gigastudio have this multilayer features too.

For the Live styler to MS features I have already reply and we have only supported by TCP network the all basic arranger section and not the Right hand sounds session.

This is a OLD features that the MS have from 3 years.
Each of the giga file included on soundbank can be prelisten and Inserted on the GIGA SOLO=LAYER1 MS patch mode.
So, you can browser the all single XG-GIGA sounds, test it manually if you like it and then Inserted on the MS patch for the Right hand WHOLE sounds mode OR loaded on to the 8 LAYERED COMBI mode patch.

Have to say that this is starting to sound even better by the day.

Regards.
James.



[This message has been edited by Irishacts (edited 03-03-2009).]

Frank,

Let mw know when you get the MS in...I will come out there and spend a couple days.
We would have a good time! Audya, MS, T3, PA2....aranger overload for sure! :-)

Lee S.

[This message has been edited by leeboy (edited 03-03-2009).]

Wow,
you've actually created an XG soundbank.

I had a number of xg soundfont banks, but none of them really played back my psr styles perfectly. Drums , even though they were mapped correctly for xg, still didn't play back as well as they should have. Velocities weren't always correct & some of the samples didn't really suit. They sounded different to what was used in my psr. So, style tweaking was required.

What do you mean by
"Fortunally, the MS GIGA streaming sampler don't have the memory issue as the others"

Is there some sort of difference between the MS giga sampler, & the giga samplers run on a pc?? I only ever used soundfonts, I don't think my laptop was up to running the larger stuff.

best wishes
Rikki


[QUOTE]Originally posted by LIONSTRACS:
[B]
In the next days is ready the new XG-GIGA soundbank and then you there can test what is the big sounds difference!
The sound designer made really a GOOD work, 480 XG sounds and 28 Drunkits, all stereo samples, the XG-GIGA library folder is about 4650Mb of data, plus the 1200Mb of the GM/GS soundbank.
Fortunally, the MS GIGA streaming sampler don't have the memory issue as the others..

Hi Frank,
great to hear from you again. How is the 2009 setup going?? Did garriton ever finish the gm bank?
I've been toying with the idea of using my laptop as a soundmodule for my PA800.

Won't go into detail here as I don't want to hijack this thread.

best wishes
Rikki

They only use Yamaha styles...can they not use Korg and Roland styles as well, or are they just limited to one manufacturer?

Ian

Ian,
LS does use Yamaha styles as default..however if you buy the 'PLUS' version it includes the ability to play Ketron styles and will use a Ketron SD-2 ($300) sound module to play them back with real Ketron sounds.

Isn't Yamaha styles good enough? There are a few around :-)

The only issues in quality playback on LS was always the less than great XG sound set available to play the accompanymen trackes (drums, Perc and the ACC tracks).

IF and that's a big IF the MS gang is able to create a close to perfect XG sound set that sounds as good as & works as good as a real Yamaha t2 for example...then this is a home run for the home teem!!!
I wouldnot expect it to be perfect on every style...but if it hit 95% that wuld be super.

Rikki,
Hi, I have always know this could be done but just didn't have the time to do it myself. Also, the mega voices can also be done...but that will take some serious work.

Lee S.

Hi Lee,
I didn't actually doubt that it could be done, the surprise is, that someone's actually gone ahead and done it.

best wishes
Rikki

p.s.
slowly putting together an xg mapped drumkit for the korg. Hard part is getting the velocities right so that the conversion hopefully won't require drum tweaking. I'll send you a copy if I EVER finish it . haahaa.

Rikki, I am still waiting for the Garritan GM Wavetable. It is taking more time then originally thought given they are developing the Aria as their new sample engine and abandoning Kontakt. I am not certain whether this is wise move on their part - especially given that I think it uses Soundfonts - rather old technology. The only changes I have made to my software based arranger system is updating the software.

I note that some of you are concerned about how well the styles would work using other than XG Wavetables. In my view the main problem is that XG Drums are different than GM/GS, e.g., hand claps instead of snares and so on. M. Bedesem altered (redesigned) a software program (MidiPlayer) for me which made this conversion (XG to GM) a piece of cake.

I think that the thing so many of us forget is just how difficult it is to get acceptable translations between even bona fide XG and GS soundsets from actual Yamaha and Roland gear. As Rikki points out, there's a LOT more to it than simply getting the right drum sound on the right note number.

Even with the simplest non-velocity switched drum sounds, there is the issue of velocity CURVE, which is only further complicated by newer drum sounds, with multiple samples per note. What is the crossover point of these samples? There's no hard and fast standard, even the Big 3 themselves have no consistent crossover points, nor velocity response curve.

Next is drum EQ... No consistency here, and so on, and so forth. Let's put it this way. It is notoriously difficult to get translated styles to sound as good as the original, and that is with the benefit of at least a fully balanced sound set like you get in a Big 3 product... Now you want to do it on GIGA sets that, IMO are anything BUT consistent and balanced.

It's an uphill battle, that eludes the best of us... Even Roland, to be honest, have a far less balanced soundset since they abandoned GS Sound Canvas based products. Sure, some of the newer sounds are formidable, but the overall consistency of sounds has suffered. And if these guys are having problems, what is the chance mere mortals like us can succeed..?

Just designing ONE sound that impresses is tough enough. Now do that for at LEAST a couple of hundred (what you need for full-ish GS or XG compatability), and THEN make sure that they are all interchangeable (change a bari sax for a tenor one, and have NO volume, response curve or EQ issues - change one drum kit for another, and have NO issues with drum sounds louder or quieter, consistent velocity cross-switch points, or EQ issues), and you start to realize the gargantuan task that faces you...

Now add in Mega voices (after all, what's the POINT of playing Yamaha styles if you don't have the one thing that makes them so good?) and the weird things they need the OS to do (like only transposing within a certain note range and leaving others untouched, all on one part) and the deal gets even MORE complicated.

I hate to say this, but soundset design is a task for professionals, and even THEY have problems...

And all this, just to be able to play PSR styles when a cheap PSR (comparatively) plays them perfectly already. Seems a case of diminishing returns, IMO

Hi Frank,
it seems to be taking forever. I had a quick peek at the site today noticed Aria.
Don't know whether my laptop would even run it. I find the specs , so confusing since the dual core processors became available.. haahaa
Soundfonts, that seems rather strange.
Even more amazing, you haven't added anything. Does that mean you've almost got your setup where you want it?.

best wishes
Rikki
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Frank L. Rosenthal:
[B]Rikki, I am still waiting for the Garritan GM Wavetable. It is taking more time then originally thought given they are developing the Aria as their new sample engine and abandoning Kontakt. I am not certain whether this is wise move on their part - especially given that I think it uses Soundfonts - rather old technology. The only changes I have made to my software based arranger system is updating the software.

Diki: “I think that the thing so many of us forget is just how difficult it is to get acceptable translations between even bona fide XG and GS soundsets from actual Yamaha and Roland gear.”
My sentiments exactly. That is why I laugh when I hear Yamaha fans brag that Yamaha keyboards have lots of third party styles from other Yamaha keyboards and other manufacturers.

But in any case you forget to say that you can clone any keyboard to giga format if you want with full resolution and all effects.

And here is all balanced and ready but i can tell you that is better to use some new fresh ideas for same style.

Frank,
I sure HOPE that they use a system that allows DYNAMIC Back/Program changes while paying LIVE. Key switching does not cut it for me anyways in my software arranger activities..

Current Garriton sound library's don't and it is useless to me without it.

Do you happen to know if they will support this?

Thanks

Lee S.

Diki,
As always you make some good points...however, you may be underestimating the level of talent out here.

I did not realize the level of talent until I started participating in the Korg arranger forum. And don't forget the third party guys (Michal B. etc) on the Yamaha side.

But, there is also huge talent that is out here that you don't hear much about.

Boils down to this...this CAN be done very well. It's not easy, but if the right people REALLY want to do it...done deal!

One critical part is who ever is working n this MUST hae a Yamaha keyboard in house to be able to get the sounds right from all aspects (like Rikki and you said, it's not just mapping)

Lee S.

..and yet i sit and still wonder,will anyone ever upload a MP3 song from this thing?..or will it be likened to the much talked about 'Bigfoot'.

Are you suggesting that lionstracs are sampling the entire factory sounds off an XG Keyboard ?. Lets say, something like a Tyros ?

Is this the XG library that's being worked on right now ?.

Regards.
James.

lol.... Tyros 2 today, Lawsuit tomorrow.

AFAIK, no-one at the Korg forum is working on an entire soundset. Yes, there are talented sound designers, but they seem to be mainly working on individual sounds.

And, I'm also sorry, but simply sampling the sound of an existing arranger does NOT get you that close to the original. At least, not unless you turn off all the effects, envelope programming and LFO's, sample just the basic waveforms, and recreate the whole programming. Otherwise you get unacceptable 'munchkinization' of all the periodic variations (vibrato rates, envelope times, effects) and lose the velocity cross-splits unless you are anal about the recording process.

Not to mention, of course, you STILL lose the SA and Mega abilities without an OS that can do these tricks. Which, from what I've read, the MS cannot do.

I hate to be the voice of reality on this pie in the sky thread, wouldn't it be nice if there WAS an easy way to do this? But it is still a herculean task to do even half baked, and of course, there is STILL the copyright issue. Wholesale theft of a product's entire soundset, especially if made commercially available, will undoubtedly have Yamaha's lawyers down on you like a ton of bricks.

This whole thing was done to death two years ago (if I remember rightly) and we haven't seen the product since.

And all this, STILL to only play non-Mega old PSR styles...

But I think the desire for it simply illustrates how poor the native library of MS styles is. If there were sufficient TOTL styles already in the box when you get the MS, no-one would honestly give a damn about some old PSR styles...

Hello

There is something here I do not understand.

We have through a long time been told that MS is superior to any other arranger. How is this possible when it relies on LiveStyler which mimics the Yamaha OS; and sounds which mimics the Yamaha sounds?

Since when has a mimicked version of anything been superior compared to the original?

Some enlightment required....

Regards
Jørgen


------------------
The Unofficial YAMAHA Keyboard Resource Site

Hi Jorgen, I didn't read it that way...The MS does not have to depend on Live Styler...

The Live Styler came about, because someone asked if a program like Live Styler could work on the MS...And secondly , people here are largely interested in Yamaha styles..
Dom, just followed through with contacting Norbert , and they developed this program to use on the MS, allowing the user to play Yamaha styles, as they can on their PC...

Hi Jorgan

You have to remember the differences between a software based keyboard and a hardware based keyboard.

Hardware plus points

Will sound great OOTB and allows the user to edit various parts.

Minus points

Can only use what the manufacture gives you, and any additional have to comply with what the manufacture specifies.

Software plus points

No limit on what you can use, therefore the manufacture has no control over what you are allowed to produce.

Minus points

Only comes with the basics, therefore you have add what YOU want and set it up to your requirements (If you want workstation add workstation software, if you want organ add organ software and if you want arranger add arranger software)

Which do you choose?

If you want a plug and play that you can modify to suit, then go for a hardware board

If your prepared to put the work in, then go for a software board, as then it is only your imagination that is the limit.

Hope this helps

Bill

Rikki, it may be hard to believe that I have not made many changes to my software based arranger system in recent times. As you know I spent a great deal of time getting my system up to the quality and reliability standards I set for myself. I still prefer my software based system over any of the hardware based arranger systems out there today. I have operated my software system now for many many years.

I am all for progress and aplaud the development of the MS. It has a better control surface compared to my system for one.

Rikki, I still think you and Fran should just give up on the hardware stuff and again adopt the software approach....you just can't lose!!! Besides I need some friends.....

Lee S. I don't think Garritan's wavetables will include key switching. You find more of that in the higher end (East-West, VSL, etc.) sound sets. Although Garritan's Strings may have this feature.

Sharp, No the XG soundset is going to be from Giga sounds...not sampled from T2. Mapping, velocity etc will try to make it work like a Yamaha XG set.

Frank, Yes the Garriton stuff uses key switching or preset banks...based on what Gary G. told me it is useless for what I want. I need full MIDI implementation...Bank/Program change live, dynamic. I currently use EMU 1820m studio, which does support bank/program change.
He does not offer it in any of his sound sets.

Diki, Also today LS can play styles with mega voices in them...it maps to the best substitute. Not bad...I've used it a lot. Is it as good as a full Yamaha instrument...no, but it ain't bad.
The whole idea of this MS...or software arranger is choice...you are not stuck with only what the mfg gives you.

I personally think the LS under MS is one thing that will be great...I could be wrong...but I don't think DOM has thousands, make that hundreds of thousands of $$$ to spend hiring people to make 400 TOTL styles. So LS wll be a good option.

Lee S.

Why not simply a license deal with a great style factory, if he hasn't got the dough up front? Not that I imagine that it is THAT expensive... hundreds of thousands? For 400 styles? $500 or more per style? Shouldn't be hard to find someone at THAT rate!

Has Dom talked to EMC?

Yes Lee, I think you may be right.. I will be downloading the new XG set tomorrow (assuming Dom gets it out as expected) and will load it
up and see.

Dennis

Hi Dennis

Points to remember

Make sure you use a download manager, as you wouldn’t want to start again if the connection dropped.

Make sure your ISP doesn’t have data limits set up on your account.

If you haven’t got broadband, forget it.

Remember it will probably be about a 4GB download. (Depends how WinRAR has compressed the files)

Enjoy, and don’t rush anything. (Software arrangers are infectious)

Regards

Bill

good point Bill!
In some hours the XG soundbank is uploaded: http://www.lionstracs.com/demo/qsampler/YXG-GIGA.jpg

The folder is about 4200Mb now and the compressed RAR file is 2300Mb.
The MS user can download direct from the MS GFTP tool and I will also duplicate one copy on the web store.
I have to test too IF the Explorer and Firefox are able to download one big RAR file of 2300mb without errors.

So...MS users please use first the GFTP tool from MS side to be totally sure of the whole download and then Extract the rar file inside the GigaLibrary folder.
With the GIGA SOLO MS mode you can also play the all new giga sounds on right hand.
Enjoy

Ciao Domenico,
it was nice talking to you this morning, thanks for your time.

thanks Nedim, was really a nice conversation.
You get a email reply...

Diki,
Yes I have heard the rate is several hundred per style. But also, there are some third party's that make them and sell for more like $10.00. But are they like factory quality? Subjective.

Wersi was smart...just license to use the Yamaha styles and provide the engine to play them directly. How do they work/sound?

Dennis,
I'll be anxious to hear how the XG set works/sounds.

Dom,
Hey man...just send CD's out for the sound set. Won't cost that much. Quality assured.

Lee S.

Just download it, where is the problem? http://www.lionstracs.com/store/yxggiga-p-221.html

All the MS user can login with the MS GFTP tool and start to download too.
Enjoy

To both Lees, Denis and Franky...MS is smiling my way too i think...next to AUDYA...
Frank, Dom told me today on the phone yours is on the way, when do i come see it?

[This message has been edited by Nedim (edited 03-05-2009).]

Hi Frank,
rather than hijack Dom's thread
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/019220.html

best wishes
Rikki

Lee S. I am not certain what you mean by key switching. The usual meaning is that with key switching you can change the sound of the instrument from say a regular sax to a growl sax by depressing a designated (programmed) key say in the lower part of the keyboard. This, with the possible exception of the Garritan strings, none of his sound sets can do (JABB, GPO, etc.).

If you wish to be able to change from a sax to a trumpet then you should be able to do that using bank and program numbers. I can do so using Kontakt versions of JABB and GPO.

If you can't do that with their new Aria sampler then that would be a rather large drawback. You would think that this sampler should have this capability given that they are going to provide a GM wavetable.

Another approach could be loading instruments onto channels 1 to say 16 and then switch channels and call up the intruments you need. I often use this approach for my lead/right hand instruments.

"Frank, Yes the Garriton stuff uses key switching or preset banks...based on what Gary G. told me it is useless for what I want. I need full MIDI implementation...Bank/Program change live, dynamic. I currently use EMU 1820m studio, which does support bank/program change.
He does not offer it in any of his sound sets."



[This message has been edited by Frank L. Rosenthal (edited 03-05-2009).]

Simple... adjustable chord recognition delay!
Yamaha, are you listening???

[This message has been edited by TedS (edited 03-05-2009).]

Frank,
The folks at garriton told me that if I bought the standard GPO..it would not work with MIDI bank/program changes. I asked how do you change sounds they said you have to have it setup in a ptrset before hand...(I thought they also mentoned key switching but I may have them confused with Sony stuff) I said WHAT! You don't even have a simple bank/program change implemented? They said nope.

I have't bought a thing from them.
Oh, I said Kontat does support that and they said not with our sound sets???

Teds,
I use 40 ms chord recognition delay with LS.
Works very well.

Lee S.



[This message has been edited by leeboy (edited 03-05-2009).]

Live Styler is only a midi engine that load and play the all original yamaha styles, including the Tyros styles.
It work same way on PC and on MS, depend only witch soundfonts you will use connected to the Live styler midi Out.

If the Live styler is connected to one Midi Out to one external XG expander ( or one Tyros), the yamaha styles will be full compatible.
If the midi Out is connected to the Vst YXG50, the styles are working nice too, BUT the soundfont used on YXG50 is a little poor and not so agressive sounds.

Live Styler work similar as the Wersi, they have integrated some yamaha styles loader engine like we made with the live styler under MS.
Wersi for sure, have cloned the yamaha sounds under AKAI sampler format or is almost impossible reproduce nice XG styles.

Note that "cloning" sounds do NOT mean copy the original Yamaha ROM soundfont or reverse engineering.
We can cloning all waht we like BUT will never totally same as the original 1-1 yamaha ROM and for this resampling cloning system you can never have legal issue with the manufacture, because is NOT original!

After you have resampled the all sounds remain the problem how to manage it in realtime, I mean when you have to switch styles or midifiles.
AKAI sampler: all the sounds must be loaded in RAM first and then can be played and need a lot of time.

kontakt sampler is good, but not so high quality as the Gigastudio version and in both system is really hard to manage GM/GS/XG sounds when you switch midifiles.
this professional sampler are developed for Studio user and not for midifiles and styles players.

On MS we use the Linuxsampler and we have developed the sampler to be used in realtime sounds switch like one ROM system.
With the Qsampler editor we can create unlimited maps and configuration, after saved the LSCP session, the MS will load it in background and the all sounds are ready to play.
here is one example mapping editor: http://www.lionstracs.com/demo/qsampler/qsamplerinstruments.jpg

On qsampler editor is possible setup the MSB, LSB and PRG and link the desidered gig file.
It mean the possibility to create multiple sounbank, GM, GS, XG, all in realtime.
Linuxsampler is a full streaming HD sampler, BUT we have developed one more amazing features:
ON DEMAND= the chace sound will be loaded in RAM, then can be played and when on same CH you switch sound, the chace will be deleted.
ON DEMAND HOLD: the chace sound will be loaded in ram and then can be played and when you switch sounds, the chace remain in ram, ready for the next time, without lose time for the next loading.
PERSISTENT: the chace sound will be always present in RAM and then when you switch sound will play without any latency, like a ROM system.
Of course, more persisten sounds you will have on system, more PC RAM is request.

Hi Dom,
most of the stuff you wrote is a bit too technical for me.
If I understood correctly, there is something special about the way your giga sample player works compared to the way a giga sampler works on PC??

The array of softsynths that were available a couple of years ago for playing "style tracks" ( for OMB & Livestyler) was very limited because of the Bank & Program Change issue.
I chose soundfonts at the time because they gave me the most flexibility. I could pick & choose which sounds I wanted to use in my XG Bank. The reason I gather soundfont program & bank changes work is because the whole xg soundfontbank gets loaded into the pc's memory. The XG soundfont banks I've come across ranged in size from roughly 32 megs to 250 megs. Not a hassle to load.

Your XG Giga Bank is gigabytes, obviously that's why the streaming.

So what I suppose I'm really asking is, if your xg giga sample was availalble for PC,
would a pc giga sample player / livestyler setup work?? ie does a pc giga sample player handle bank & program changes as perfectly as the MS??

best wishes
Rikki

[QUOTE]Originally posted by LIONSTRACS:
[B]

Lee S., I purchased GPO and JABB when the sounds were packaged with kontakt as their sampler. With the current version 3.x of kontakt you can setup multis which preloads a bit of each sample (voice) and then you can send program change numbers to switch between the various preloaded voices.

So it could be in their current Aria version you cannot do this....that is a poor design decision on their part. They will change otherwise the competion will do them in, e.g., East - West.

But how will they get their GM Wavetable to work. This will likely have something like a 1GB or 2GB of sounds preloaded into memory either entirely or in part with the rest streaming from the hard drive.

What do I know???

Dom,
OK, I got most of what you said...sounds pretty flexable. I need to see the manual/instrument to really see if I like it.

Frank,
I was told by the Garriton folks including Gary quite a while back that they do not really support live play. Duynamically selecting sounds as yo uneed them. They must be per setup. No good for me, and I told them that...but..who an I to them? Yep!

So, I wrote them off for my use...Hope it changes as they do have some great sounds.

Lee S.

Lee, wanna go to Franks place so both of us can check the MS? After he recieves it, we can
go together, of course if we dont kill each other on our way there.

Hi Nedim,
not really any of my business, but, you don't happen to have the 2 Lee's mixed up?

Leeboy ( above)( our PA2X buddy from Korg Forums)
&
Leezone ( Audya Lee) with whom you've been having the occasional intense discussion about the Audya..

I gather this reply was to Leeboy?? our korg buddy.

best wishes
Rikki

Hi Rikki
I think under PC the linuxsampler with the Fantasia frontend will work at the same way that we have used on MS.
with the linuxsampler Fantasia editor, you can create your all owner sounbank/soundfonts and streaming the all giga sounds under GM, GS and XG mode together. http://linuxsampler.org/downloads.html
the only problem is to remake all again the LSCP file configuration under PC windows, because in Linux the HD link to files is different.
example on linux:
MAP MIDI_INSTRUMENT 0 0 0 GIG '/home/mediastation/GigaLibrary/SoundbankGM2/001Acoustic\x20Grand\x20Piano/GrandPiano.gig' 0 0.9 PERSISTENT 'GrandPiano.gig [0]'
MAP MIDI_INSTRUMENT 0 0 1 GIG '/home/mediastation/GigaLibrary/SoundbankGM2/002\x20Bright\x20Acoustic\x20Piano/BrightPiano.gig' 0 0.9 ON_DEMAND_HOLD 'BrightPiano.gig [0]'

On windows will change the disk directory by [url=C://....][url=C://....][url=C://....]C://....[/url][/url][/url]
In this way my LSCP file GM/XG configuration will not working there.
I'm not interesting to make it under windows OS, to much work and not my field products.

Hi Rikki, actually i was refering to LeeZone cuz we live close here and both know Frank.

Hi Nedim,
I hadn't noticed Leezones name crop up on this thread,so I thought for a moment you may have been getting the names mixed up. haahaa

best wishes
Rikki

Nedim we are waiting for replay.


This tool is every day better and better.

Dom is all the time explaining good points of developing.

I hope somebody will find the good way of that keyboard.

Best regards.

Magica Alfa

I will do it tonight bro, i was busy with some familly stuff the last 2-3 days.