Guys- (er, gary?)

I am leaning more and more towards buying a tower PA system (Bose, Fishman, etc..) and if I can route my vocal through my T2, which I know I can do, AND get the on board harmonizer to sound good...I can make my life and setup much easier...

I use a Sennheiser 855e vocal mic...I also have a big voice...

I've tried using the harmonizer on the Tyros 1 and the PSR 3000...I adjusted the settings per several people suggestions and it wasn't acceptable...it was clipping and distorted much of the time...

Before I make the leap to a new PA system, I'd really like to try and make the on board harmonizer on my T2 work like Yamaha intended...

All suggestions, ideas, help, will be appreciated as always...



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Bill in Dayton

Bill,
On the site of Michel Voncken you can find a
VH workshop (in German) and a screenshot of his settings.
Look>> http://www.michelvoncken.com/pages/downloads.php

Regards,
Impuls

Bill,

There is an outstanding lesson on the PSR Tutorial site posted by BIG741 that provides step by step information on how to make the vocal processor sound really good. Plus there are some outstanding demos of this posted there as well. Check it out.

Gary

gary-

Do you have a direct link to the harmonizer tutorial from big741 you spoke highly of? I've searched through the site but can't find it...

Thanks,

Bill

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Bill in Dayton

http://psrtutorial.com/Resources/Articles/VHPrimer/VHPrimer.html

Dan a.k.a. big741

Thank you kind sir!



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Bill in Dayton

The best way to sound good vocally with a T2 is to BYPASS the internal mic input. Get a nice add on unit, set the mic input to LINE and use the outboard unit.
Just my personal advice.Yamaha mic sections are not up the the standard that the rest of the kb is.

The secret to e.q.ing the 855 is that it needs VERY LITTLE e.q. I used it successfully on both Tyros 2 and S900. You will probably have to roll off the bass band a little, and leave the mids and top flat.
I have no problem at all with the vocal processing on the Yammies, but the harmonizer is very sensitive and must be adjusted quite a bit. Roll the harmony voice back to 70 percent or so. Most of the garbled harmonies come from too much bass e.q. on the mic. It's never going to sound like a really good harmonizer can, but you CAN work with it, as I have done ever since they started putting them in, beginning with PSR 800.
It's very easy to fall into the old analog habit of using the smiley face e.q. The new digital stuff rarely needs that radical e.q.
DonM

Have to agree. Even with the settings and suggestions the harmonies don;t stand up to the rest of the board's quality sounds. Pony up for a TC-M and run it through the Yamaha or direct.

Bill already bought a TC Harmony M....tried it with results that didnt work for him.
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/018223.html

All Yamaha units that have VH need big inrovements it is the least attended weak point of all their arrangers through the years for sure aside from the MFD. Especially when the other BIG 3 competition have much improved them both on their models.
With MUCH tweaking at low volumes it could be made to sought of work very delicately with tracking at a minimum in real time usage. By shutting off the vibrato, lowering VH:lead ratio to 15%, rear gain knob to 9Oclock, EQ & a few other changes you can have a gimicky VH sound at best compared to quality units like Tc Helicon or Digitec, etc, lets face it certain features are just there to entice buyers...although Yamaha has many great features re: sound/styles, etc, the VH is Not one of them plain & simple. If your a REAL lead singer you'll know what I mean. On a 1-10 scale Yamaha VH is a 5 at best. Don't be fooled.
Once you use the above mentioned brands you'll never go back if your serious about singing. At least there are good alternatives you can use coupled with your Yamaha unit.




[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 12-05-2008).]

Here's a song that Dan just posted on PSR Tutorial forum using the Yamaha VH. http://www.box.net/shared/v30uy914au

DonM

He did a nice job on that...



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Bill in Dayton

Thanks Dan for your very interesting write-up on VH.
Duly downloaded and printed, this is going to bring me plenty of enjoyment in the next few days and I am sure in the next few months and years with pursuing your advice.
Your vocal demo was just fine.
cheers
Eddie Johnson

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Eddie from Rotherham
Skype:eddiefromrotherham
www.yamahakeyboards.info

PSR9000

Excellent job on that tune, Dan, and thank you for the terrific vocal harmony tips.

It proves it really can work very well with the right tweaking of settings.

I will pass them to my Yamaha clients.

Ian

Hi guys.
Thanks for your interest in The VH Primer. I hope it proves useful to you. Oh yeah, thanks for listening to my warbling - not a task taken lightly. And you said nice things, too (so far...). Thanks for that.
Keep in mind, my VH tricks are done in a somewhat controlled situation of my basement, and I have no idea how well it works live. I do regularly practice with two 12 inch wedges two feet from each ear with no problems. They're kinda like headphones.

Thanks again,
Dan

Exactly Dan....live is a BIG DIFFERENCE vs a controlled recording situation.
This is where the Big Boys TC Helicon
http://www.tc-helicon.com/products.asp

& Digitec
http://www.digitech.com/vocalist.php

surpass most for quality & portability for performing....just let your voice & ears be your guide plain & simple.

Unfortunately, I no longer have the health to gig, or I'd be playin' sax in a blues band instead of messing around with keyboards. I am considering a Harmony M if I ever get the bills caught up (probably be a Harmony Z by then ). I'd LOVE to hear a non-factory demo of one, live or multi-tracked, if you have one, Dnj. After all, I showed you mine...

Take care,
Dan
P.S. While I wave no flag for any particular manufacturer, I find your "Big Boys" comment arrogant and condescending. I would expect a stand-alone anything to far surpass any built in unit.

Yes, they are Dan, but I must say, you really made the most of the built in harmonizer...the best I've heard.

As for controlled environment, I suppose it would be similar to the situation most arranger users would be in, as after all, arrangers are primarily "home" keyboards and would be generally not be subjected to the demands of "live" stage use.

I've passed your tips on to the head guys at Yamaha Canada and they were quite pleased with your ideas.

You do fine work.

Ian

Yamaha needs to do a major VH overall plain & simple they have dropped the ball on this feature for years. Althoiugh their arrangers sound fantastic....They are on the BOTTOM of the list with VH units for sure... I hope they get their act together soon on their next series of arrangers.... meanwhile I'll use my TC Helicon & Digitech VH units which are MILES Ahead EVERY Time. Charge more but give us what we want please....

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 12-07-2008).]

Monitor placement is vital in getting the most out of the Yamaha harmonizer...keeping any extraneous sounds out of the microphone is very important.

I use headphones when I record vocals with my S900 and Tyros3...works very well.

Ian