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#249385 - 02/07/09 02:45 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
I guess I dont have to repeat what Mike just said above....& with that said gentleman it's Saturday night time to go GIG baby!!!

CYA

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#249386 - 02/07/09 02:56 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14208
Loc: NW Florida
I'm not off until nine or so (gig's 300 yards away!), so I'd just like to say this...

If it WEREN'T getting almost impossible to find a TOTL or even MOTL arranger anywhere near you, sure, I'd say this isn't an issue at all. But almost every last one of us has noticed over the last few years how many stores that USED to carry arrangers have stopped altogether.

And, I can't for the life of me think of anything other than internet sales (and using the store as a free demo showroom) as the cause...

Perhaps you could tell me of another reason?
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#249387 - 02/07/09 03:12 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14208
Loc: NW Florida
And if Yamaha don't rigorously enforce their own MAP pricing structure (it would be simple to pose as customers and see what is REALLY being quoted), and other manufacturers too, perhaps it is time for the manufacturers to place product in the stores at no cost to the dealer until it is sold...?

They MUST be losing sales due to unavailability to try out (not everyone can afford that leap of faith, or want the inconvenience of shipping a keyboard back to the dealer). It seems unfair to the dealer to make him BUY something, and then do nothing to protect him from dealers willing (or able) to turn only a slight profit and benefit from increased volume at the expense of the brick and mortar store... In violation of the MAP, at that.

Time to drastically reduce the cost to the dealer of just being able to SHOW the product, especially as the manufacturer encourages (by inaction) others to benefit from that dealers willingness to put his money on the line...
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#249388 - 02/07/09 05:21 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
leeboy Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 10/09/04
Posts: 2580
Loc: Ocala, FL USA
Steve,
Why not respond to the questions a lot of us have on the T3 Piano?

How do we get the same sound as on the Demo?
The equivelant of the Clavinova which is outstanding.

Or...maybe we can't? If that is true...I wander why?

Thanks,
Lee
_________________________
Lee S.

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#249389 - 02/07/09 06:04 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
Diki Offline


Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 14208
Loc: NW Florida
Maybe it's just that the demo was probably (possibly? ) PLAYED on an 88 wood controller (although it used the T3 piano) and the touch sensitivity curve on those promotes a much higher degree of pianism?

Also, you have to ask yourself, are you the pianist that the demonstrator was? As with most sounds, it's the way you play it, and not the sound itself that has MUCH to do with a demo's realism...
_________________________
An arranger is just a tool. What matters is what you build with it..!

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#249390 - 02/07/09 08:34 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
I'm not off until nine or so (gig's 300 yards away!), so I'd just like to say this...

If it WEREN'T getting almost impossible to find a TOTL or even MOTL arranger anywhere near you, sure, I'd say this isn't an issue at all. But almost every last one of us has noticed over the last few years how many stores that USED to carry arrangers have stopped altogether.

And, I can't for the life of me think of anything other than internet sales (and using the store as a free demo showroom) as the cause...

Perhaps you could tell me of another reason?


Low end Casio units etc, ... at Costco, BJ's Sams Club etc......for cheap are selling like hotcakes vs TOTL or MOTL arrangers.Poeple dont need expemnsive KB's to start out with.

Music stores in general have plumetted in sales the last 15+ years due to less & less people playing instruments vs DJ's, Karaoke artists, & everything else the kids are doing today to make music.

Manufacturers lack of educating their buyers on their products with instructional DVD's, good well written manuals, etc etc, .....this creates loss of attention & interest after the sale.

We are the last generation of real players learned in the ways of "OLD SCHOOL" after us its over ......don't you see it coming?
If you already have experience and talent as a player worship it...share it, enjoy whats left of it.

shall I continue or are you getting the picture....or do you want to look at the Blakpool Festival pictures again to remind you of who's playing arrangers!

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#249391 - 02/08/09 02:27 AM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
abacus Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 07/21/05
Posts: 5354
Loc: English Riviera, UK
Most sales of Arrangers/Organs in the past meant going to the shop and trying them out, or listening to the manufactures demonstrators in store. (The idea of buying something without at least hearing it was a big No No)

Moving to today, More demos then you could ever get in a store are available on the web (Pro and amateur) and so the reason to go to the store and try is (To most buyers) pointless, (Yes most on this site know the only true way is to try it, but 99% of Arranger sales go to customers who havent a clue how feel and operation can make a difference, they are simply bowled over by the demos) hence internet sites with low overheads (Compared to bricks and mortar) now rule the roost.

Competition is good (And there is plenty of it in Russia these days) but if you look at most advances in technology, it has usually been the smaller guys that move it forward, not the big boys. (Unfortunately the smaller guys are swamped by the big boys and so quite a lot of advancement is lost) (The downside of competition)

Fortunately most of the smaller guys have now moved into software (VSTs etc) which leave the big boys for dead, (The big boys hardware cannot match the small guys software) and consequently if you want the best (Leaves most hardware for dead) at a cheaper price, then you go the software route. (If you dont believe this look at modern film and music production and you will see that hardware while still used has lost out big time)

Will this continue in the future, who knows?

Just be thankful that small manufactures and dealers exist, as otherwise the big boys become what Russia used to be. (Choice disappears out of the window, and you have to buy what the big boys provide)

Regards

Bill
_________________________
English Riviera:
Live entertainment, Real Ale, Great Scenery, Great Beaches, why would anyone want to live anywhere else (I�m definitely staying put).

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#249392 - 02/08/09 06:46 AM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
Bill...


Interesting thoughts for sure...

I feel as soon as companies can produce "QUALITY" PC software arranger programs on computer that can reproduce what a stand alone "Arranger" can do via MIDI "IN REAL TIME" with NO difficulties or latency with top quality Styles & Sounds & have the "EASE" of use with "ALL" on-board features in real time as we have with today's keyboard arrangers we will be on the way to a new era. Then all you would need is a lightweight controller of your choice, speakers & a Laptop on stage or at home. This day can't come fast enough
Please hurry.

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#249393 - 02/08/09 01:25 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
rsm2000e Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/05/09
Posts: 21
Loc: USA
Quote:
Originally posted by Diki:
(snip)


I am in favor of 'in the flesh' music stores whenever possible.

[This message has been edited by rsm2000e (edited 02-14-2009).]

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#249394 - 02/08/09 01:45 PM Re: Again with the Tyros 3
Dnj Offline
Senior Member

Registered: 09/21/00
Posts: 43703
When all is said & done Money is the bottom line you can philosophy all you want......plain & simple. Everyone is out for themselves in this survival game we all play. Hang in there things are going to get worse for some & better for others. With all the big problems in the world where do you thing the Arranger keyboard is on the list? You are your best salesman....use it to your advantage, don't be naieve & think out of the box when you buy something........good luck.

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 02-08-2009).]

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