I think we need to be careful to remember exactly what Steve wants to use the keyboard for. A songwriting tool first and foremost.

A built in harmonizer is not needed for this (and, IMO, are little more than a gimmick for OMB's). Anyone recording a song is going to use real BV's...

There are some important questions that need to be asked before the right choice can be arrived at....

How well do you play, Steve? (Is the quality and size of the keyboard important at all?)

What style of music do you write in? (WS's are better for modern, cutting edge styles, arrangers are better at 'meat and potatoes' styles)

Do you intend to lay guitars down as real instruments, or do you need an arranger with realistic guitar parts? (Yamaha S900 is a good choice if you do)

Do you intend to record FINAL parts, or just make demos? (WS's, though much more complicated, ARE what they use on CD's much more than arrangers)

Do you have ANY experience making recordings with a computer sequencer and a WS? (If not, an arranger will get you up and running MUCH faster and easier than a WS)

Come back with these answers, and we can perhaps advise you better...

The e60 does display notation, chords and lyrics, just like its bigger brothers. That is very good!
Steve, if you are songwriting, don't discount the larger, 76 notes of the e60 keyboard, especially if you plan to play or record live. In step recording you might not need or use the extra notes, but in playing you will appreciate them. The e60 styles (and access to the other G/E styles) are the most LIVE sounding that I'm aware of. I do a little writing and find the Roland to be much more inspiring than the Yamahas. I can't speak for the Korg styles now, but when I owned one they were great, but very out-front styles as opposed to the more subtle Roland rhythms.

Really excellent feedback guys...

As long as I can string together sequences(INTRO,VERSE,CHORUS..ETC), punch in and out...And play into the sequences with 2 hands...(don't know how to play 1 handed)

76 keys I agree would be optimal...

The bass and drums from the arranger I would probably use and play everything else manually

Thanks

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Steve A

http://www.soundclick.com/stevealtonian

Donny, only thing i would use harmonizer for
would be pitch correction..in a loud situation
where my natural voice could not be heard so it
wouldn't sound like doubling..

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Miami Mo

I use the Vocalizer alot for many songs which require it mostly 50, 60's doo wopp stuff its a main staple in that sound....using it correctly is an art form in itself...I dont recomend pitch correction at all.....hey if someone is off key thats a problem nothing is gonna rectify but themselves, you have to hear what your singing..

Steve... At some point or another in making a songwriter demo, you ARE going to have to record your voice (and anything else you need outside the arranger).

The Roland arrangers have no recording (audio) capability. The sequencer is quite powerful, but more linear oriented than you indicate. However, with an arranger, getting your verses, choruses and in/out sections in one pass is a snap. Once the building blocks are down, it's easy to cut them up into the component sections, and rearrange those if you want.

But, at some point or another, you are going to have to transfer it to a computer DAW, and do the acoustic stuff. BTW, THIS is where you'll be applying any pitch correction you need. Donny is mistaken in thinking this won't be needed... Every pro recording done nowadays uses Auto-Tune or equivalents - at least subtly.

If using a DAW is completely out (I wouldn't recommend this, but it CAN be done), your choices narrow considerably at the price point you can afford. Only WS's (and even those are on the high dollar side, like MotifXS and FantomG) have usable multi-track (that part's important) audio recorders built in. Arranger audio recording tends to be more 'one take scratchpad' features.

But an inexpensive computer (you are probably posting on it!) can do quite sophisticated audio production at a bargain price. All of my production and songwriting demo work is done this way... Use the arranger to get the rhythm section fine tuned, then record to the computer, add the vocals, acoustic instruments (and maybe some cutting edge loop stuff if you need it), mix and master in the box. Simple, powerful, inexpensive.

The final choice as to which arranger, I feel, should be left to your ears alone. Advice from here rarely comes from those with the same goals, age group, music tastes and skill level as you. Auditioning them for yourself, getting to know the differences in 'sound' and style choices (style CREATION is fairly complex) that the arrangers have is paramount. I would NOT recommend buying sight unseen.

But your short list to audition, I think, at your price point should probably be Yamaha S900, Roland E60, and Korg PA500 (should be over here soon). If you are writing hiphop, techno, rap, etc., you might also take a look at the Yamaha MM6. Very inexpensive, but can do those style better than most arrangers.

If you MUST do everything in the keyboard (not my recommendation!), you might save a bit more and spring for a MotifXS, or maybe (when they get here) a new FantomG-series. but you'll need an extra $500-1000 over budget.

Hope this helps.

Helps?

I think I'll sell all my stuff and just play the radio. It sounds like way too much work for an artist.

Couldn't I just use my arranger and a cassette deck?

Where would anyone get the impression that being an artist ISN'T hard work...?

Being an unsuccessful artist is the easy part... Succeeding ALWAYS takes a LOT of work. Nowadays, record companies, A&R people and promoters expect a VERY high standard of demo. Almost CD-ready. The days of handing someone a cassette have LONG gone (to all but the unbelievably lucky).

In the real world, songwriters use DAWs, WSs, arrangers, and everything else available, and still are not guaranteed success...

DIKI

Really excellent insight ALL the way around...I appreciate all your time and advice...

I did play the E-60 at GEORGE KAYES TODAY AND WAS AS IMPRESSED WITH THE BOARD AS I WAS BY GEORGE HIMSELF...If I wasn't short about $500 plus I would've walked out with it...Plus my wife got robbed with my money at gunpoint last night so i couldn't pull the trigger (she's ok though)

Let me clarify something though..I am planning on using the new keyboard as inspiration and for a "scratch pad" as a songwriting tool...

I only have a guitar now and haven't had a keyboard in 3 years...NO STUDIO...and no plans to get one..

I handle the singing and songwriting chores & go into a studio and hire session musicians...I play well but I AM NOT A SESSION PLAYER...As a rule of thumb I don't play on my own tracks just sing...(The metronome can never keep up with me)

You can check out my web-site at the bottom of the page for the song "TELL ME WHY" which I just completed...TOTAL COST $1000 including 4 session players and studio time..(you'll love the violin and steel guitar)

I just had the guitar player play it like I would stylisically and play it technically way better then I ever would...

It's my hope to do the same with my piano written songs and to write new ones with the new keyboard I decide on...I have some special songs I've NEVER recorded and I'm sure more songs are to be written...

Anyways check out the tune and maybe you'll get a better idea of what i'm about...

BTW this was my 1st country tune

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Steve A

http://www.soundclick.com/stevealtonian

Steve nice website & very nice songs, I enjoyed lisening.

Good luck with your project!