Maybe I have a chance today of selling some scaffold equipment worth $12000.

So if money isn't a problem, what do I want:
Mackie SRM 450
Barbettas or what?

I still don't want to haul around 100 lb pieces of equipment though.
Boo

Boo,

After you go listen to each piece of equipment with your keyboard and microphone at full performance volume in the store, in realtime, you can make a good choice for yourself I'm sure.[In the very hot weather of Colorado Boo I would be carefull with the Mackies.]
Then with the change have a few Beers!!!

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 08-21-2003).]

[This message has been edited by Dnj (edited 08-21-2003).]

Well the target is out of the box, fire!!
Seriously though, I'd go for the SRM 450. You can see those being used everywhere, and there is a reason for that. I used to have both SRM 450's, and before that EV S200's, which I have heard against since and never understood how good they really were with the Sba120 subs and XP200 controller. Well, I wanted to slim down to two speakers only and the choice fell on the Mackies. The only reason I sold those were I bought the SR1530's instead with 1500 subs. Heavy, but great sound. For smaller jobs I use one 1500 sub with four small Voice Contact speakers, 180 Watts (oh here we go!) each. They sound fantastic, so the choice might be greater than the two you mentioned. My .02!


------------------
Roy-Andrè

Boo,
Look into the Mackie C300's and get a powered mixer. Best of both world that way with no overheating troubles ! The 300's sound just as good and they are lighter too.

Boo. you could buy yourself a Motorhome and forget about keyboards. Your other half would love it ???

Graham UK

Gotta' agree with Graham, but with one small addition. Buy the motorhome, buy a keg of beer, buy a couple Barbetta Sona 32C's and head for south Florida for the winter, play lots of gigs in the Keys, enjoy life to the fullest. Damn it's cold in Colorado in the winter!

Cheers,

Gary

Boo, Interesting how these discussions always bring about so many varied responses. I guess that in itself is the answer. between JBL, mackie, EV, and Sona barbetta, you really can't go wrong. Some are better in various areas than others...in the end, we the performers make much more of a big deal about this than the people who are listening.....Any of those speakers sound great...or else everyone using them would be out of business....but seeing they're not, it is a testimony to the quality of their systems..now all you need to do is pick what fits you best...nothing more to it than that my friend...Good luck. (Still loving my EV Sxa-100's with the Mackie bass Bin...all powered units...all sound great...fit well for my application..plenty of happy customers to boot...at least with the sound quality...my performance is still up for debate!!!)...Good Luck!! B2

Graham, Gary,

I don't know what it's like where you guys live but here in Colorado $12000 is just a down payment on a motor home. I'm not going in debt any more for anything but a car when absolutely necessary. My house is paid off. I just do food, lights and gas now. Oh, I do go out ocasionally to eat, drive around in the mountains etc.

I've thought of a small camping trailer. However, it'd be quite a thrill pulling a trailer over these mountain passes over 10000 feet.

I'm like Dave and the rest of you guys. Shopping gear keeps me busy from time to time. Noticed I said shopping like Dave. Not buying. Ha! Ha! I'll get something soon. But it will last quite a while. I still have my i30 and am happy with the 16 bar loops on some of the styles.

Funny you should mention that Boo. I have a few swing styles that are 16 measures long,and if I play a 12 bar blues song ..... I get weird accents and cymbol crashes at the WRONG times ! I should really find a way to shrink these patterns down to 4 measures so they will be more universal, but so far .... no clue how to do that. (Lazy, not stupid)
My favorire swing(jazzy, not BigBand) is from an older Korg series and it's 16 bars long. gets in the way alot, but it's a simple, stylish pattern with a nice ride cym in it. Great for EZ swing tunes like "Nice & Easy" or "Rt 66". I just wish it was 4 bars long !

I was under the impression that the I-30s patterns changed according to the inversions used in the left hand. No?
Eddie

btweengigs. Yes you are correct the i3 & i30 have upto 6 Chord Riff variations. These can be changed by the user to play a certain Riff when playing a certain chord. Korg normally program 3 chord Riff changes in most of their styles.

Not sure if they continued this option though on the PA80 ??. Peraps U-Dave can tell us.

Graham UK

Dave,

On the i30, a style such as "The Duke" won't sound good on a 12 bar blues. Most of the Big Band styles won't work on 12 bar blues. Neither will any of the 16 bar loops. However, for Satin Doll it really shines while playing my sax or singing. It also goes great with Sunny Side Of The street and a few others. It's probably more of a Jazzier sound than most entertainer vocalist will want to use.

I'm a horn blower. So, my taste will be different than most anyone here on the forum. I don't like any of the styles on any keyboard for 12 bar blues up tempo. I just have a couple I've learned to live with. I'm talking uptempo 12 bar blues like Sonny Rollins and Dexter Gordon the sax masters do. Not the "Shake Rattle and Roll" and "Rockin Robin" 12 bar blues. The 4 bar loops are made for these tunes and yes I do these tunes.

Being a horn improvising enthusiasts, I must emphasize the 4 bar loops just don't cut it.

I do a lot of Steve Tyrell's tunes using just the bass and drums. I set the keyboard for piano and I like playing the keyboard in a jazz guitar program to accompany the vocals I do. There are 4 bar loops I use for this and they work well.

When I comment I comment from the horn blower side. You'll never get me to agree on 4 bar loops for much of the stuff I do on the sax. It offers no kick or motivation for horn players who improvise.

When doing vocals you make the melody stand out. When playing a horn and doing a lot of improvising, the 16 bar loops offer much more motivation to inspire one in jazz improvisation.

Even on the Sinatra stuff, you won't find any 4 bar loops on his tunes. The horn licks, drum fills, kicks, guitar and strings voices are all over the place. Of course they are placed where they belong.

With arranger 16 bar loop styles, the accents are fixed and won't work on some tunes. However, they are very refreshing when I stand up and toot my sax. That is why some of the 16 bar loops which are mostly on the jazz stuff will only work on some particular tunes because of the added licks, kicks etc. being fixed

Playing just melody for 3 choruses with 4 bar loops would drive me out of music quicker than just using 4 bar loops for every tune.

If I could understand sound equipment as well as improvisation I wouldn't need to aggravate you folks with all of my stupid sound equipment questions.

Again the 4 bar loops work well in a strictly vocal environment. I want to improvise and I find the refreshing 16 bar loop styles much more invigorating while jamming on my sax. I'm sure any horn players here will agree.

I don't expect the vocalist to agree but perhaps a few do. This is not ment to be a put down of vocalist. This is a post hoping to explain my viewpoint from a frustrated old jazz musician that sees my music dying.

Most of the young kids don't even like what most of you are doing. They like rap.

My son is 24 and would flip over DonM. Here is the son of a jazz enthusiast and he likes all the new country music like Don keeps up with.

Don's my buddy. When I get around him I'm a bad influence. I hit some jazz licks on his tunes. But he seems to enjoy it. After we played at his gig he took me over to the Ramada to jam with some friends. He built me, and I have to admit he made me feel good.
Boo

Don't froget I'm a part time vocalist and I do maybe 15 or so country tunes. I like "Friends In Low Places" and "She Thinks I Still Care". So I mean no harm. I just wish you guys would play "Cheesecake", Doxy and a few jazz tunes. Ha! Ha!

I love mixing in jazz standards into my sets, but I need to know that the crowd will understand, or at least - APPRECIATE them. You can get away with Green Dolphin St, or How High The Moon, but try "Killer Joe" or "Joy Spring" (BTW - both have vocal arrangements by Manhatten Transfer that are awesome !) and you'll get a lot of weird stares, unless your crowd is on the hip side.

Machines are what they are, and whether it's 4 bars, 16 bars or more ... they will always have a degree of monotony. The inspriation has to come from within. Don't expect an arranger pattern to inspire you to blow great improv solos. Ain't gonna happen ! You gotta feel it INSIDE before you can push it OUTSIDE the horn.

On a side note - did you make your impulse purchase yet Boo? I know you're dying to spend some of that Scaffold money !

[This message has been edited by Uncle Dave (edited 08-22-2003).]

Dave,

Admittedly nothing is going to inspire me like Playing live with SonnyG and Jack Ness, but I really appreciate the 16 bar loop styles a million times more than the 4 bar loop stuff for tooting my flute with the recorded sequences.

Maybe I was too harsh on the Mackie 808S a while back about the humming noise. I was already very annoyed about the fan noise and the humming noise on the Behringer PMX 2000 by the time I tried the Mackie.

The guy didn't call back about the scaffold. Maybe I'll hear from him Monday hopefully. But I went ahead and ordered the Mackie this afternoon. Music 123 gave me the best deal.

Besides, Mackie has the most power after reading about all of that ohm stuff that I really still don't understand. Also, Mackie's reputation is second to none. I hope the manual is useful in explaing about bridge mode etc.

I figured if the local folk, especially the musicians saw a Mackie 808S, they would know I'm serious about music and my sound. It has to look a lot better than some of the other stuff when sitting on the band stand too. Like you Dave, I wasn't impressed with any of the effects on any of the Yamahas I tried. I just may try the Mackie C300's if I sell the scaffold.

Maybe all powered mixers hum a bit and I'm just too picky. I figured if the wife says I'm hard of hearing because the TV's too loud, the Mackie humming is too loud too. Then again maybe I like loud when the Redskins are Playing the Eagles or the Cowboys or the Saints or the Broncos or the beavers or the whoevers.

They will ship the Mackie Monday. They said I should get it in 3 to 5 days in Colorado.
I feel some relief.

Did I mention I have a gig at the Two Rivers Convention in Grand Junction on the 11th of Sept. Hope I get some other gigs this time around. It's for the Western slope Contractors Association. It's a big place. I don't have any idea how many people will be there. It's supposed to be 50's to 70's age group.

I should be able to please some of them with all of the standards I do. I won't do Cheesecake. I'll stick with Fats, Steve Tyrell and other old 50's Rock and Roll. No heavy jazz stuff.

I won't be boring you guys for a while with all my jazz talk. I need to practice.

You better learn some Willie and Merle.
DonM

Don,

I do "On the road Again" I think that's it for Wille. I do "I'm gonna love you forever" and "Friends in low places". That's the newest country stuff I know man. Oh I do "Crazy" too. That's my big country tunes. I do "Pretty woman" too. Most people call that rock and roll. I call it country. Ha! Ha!
Don did you get my cajun Boudreaux joke.

Funny ... I do "Forever and Ever, Amen !"

Boo, I got the joke!
The really hot country song right now, as far as my audiences go, is "Whiskey For My Men, Beer For My Horses". Willie and Toby Keith do it together.
I no longer try to keep up with all the new C&W songs. I just learn the ones I like and the most requested.
DonM

Don,

My son helped me a few weeks back lay brick. Everytime the beer for my horses song came on, I had to turn the cement mixer off so we could listen to it. Before we can set scaffold , brick or make cement, he has to get the extension cord and radio out of the truck. It's no wonder he likes the country stuff, every kid he went to school with wore cowboy boots.

Dave, sorry about the wrong title. I'm pretty bad for that.

I might just have to learn ... "It's 5:00 somewhere" since Jimmy Buffett is on the track. It's got a good, fun beat...even though I don't like to advocate drinking. I'll probably learn it anyway. Margaritaville never bothered me.

Dave,

You could count on you and Don's toes and fingers the alcohloic beverages I consumed in my whole life and I played about 17 years in the New Orleans area. Off and on on Bourbon street and other places in the French Quarters. And I do Margaritaville too.

If a person can have a drink or two no problem. However if after drinking a while he thinks he can beat-up everybody in the place and that all of a sudden all of the women in the joint are in love with him, that's a problem. Also, if he starts playing wrong chords and he thinks he's really jamming that's a problem too. Ha! Ha!

Dave,

On the i30 you choose edit style (it's a button on the board). Then on the touch screen you choose the style to edit and then there's the word "Bar" ( along with a bunch of other things to change. programs, tempo etc.) and next to the word "Bar" there's a check box with the number of bars in the style. All you do is touch the box, it highlights and then you can use the + or - button or the wheel to change the amount of measures you want. Then you save that style under a different style number. It's simple. It must be cause I can even do it. You're not going to let me out do you on this one are you? I already can out do you with a comb and tissue paper. Ha! Ha!

The PA 80 must be similar heh?
Dave's my buddy even though he can't carry a tune in a bucket. But he sure can sing.

[This message has been edited by brickboo (edited 08-24-2003).]

Don.....

"Whiskey For My Men, Beer For My Horses" is a great tune with a dynamite beat! I can just hear your voice on that tune for sure....
I like it big time!! I'll add it to my repetoir.

Boo,
Let's say I find a similar editing button on the PS80, and I choose a 12 bar loop instead of a 16 bar loop in an EXISTING pattern. Will the last 4 measures be taken away, or some other design? Can I just choose to shorten the loop at will? Hmmmm.... now where is that darn bucket????

Dave,

I really haven't played much with style editing. I assume that the style will just play the designated bars you choose and just keep looping. It's just that on the i30 there are styles that you can change but have to save in a different location and the original style stays the same.

I remember adding a couple of bars playing around some time back and I didn't record anything and when I used the style it was just silent for those 2 bars and after the two bar silence it started the loop at the beginning.

I assume you found the edit style button. Man the i30 touchscreen is super for doing all of this stuff. I'd like to see a Korg with the better sounds and newer features but keep the touch screen like the i30.