I was playing with the G70 today at my store and came upon two features I like alot.
First, I can be playing a standard midi file, find the style I want to play next with the auto accomp. on, push syncro start, choose an intro and a variation, and as soon as I hit a chord on the keyboard the midi file stops and the style begins. Then, if I want to go back to the midi file, just push the song play button and the song begans exactly where it stopped when I pushed the keys down. This could be a great feature when playing parties and things need to change really fast.

The next feature I love is after I record just using the record button and playing a style with my left hand and a melody with my right, I then entered the 16 track sequencer mode by pushing the button by this name and now I see a multi color by track view of everything recorded. With this visual view I can now see where I have not recorded anything because it has a blank area and I can simply select a blank track by pushing on that track, hit record and begin recording additonal tracks. While recording, you see the tracks scroll in the screen making it very clear to know right where you are in the song. This scrolling screen is like looking at a Roland Digital 24 track recorders track scroll screen.


------------------
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

That is a nice find George.

BTW- To do a similar thing on the Genesys, simply store an accompaniment set-up to one of the 1024 Memory locations, and then while a MIDI file (or an MP3, Wave file, GEM song) is playing, select the Memory, play a left hand chord and the song playback stops and the style starts instantaneously. The only difference is you can't go directly back to the original song and have it pick up from where you left off. I don't see a big reason why this is necessary anyway, although I am sure someone will use this feature.



Hmmm, that is cool! Then again, GEM keyboards have done this very thing for years. SX series, WK series, SK series, PS series, and the Genesys series.

You know, I find it really funny how so many members of these forums go on and on about some new cool feature that they discovered, or that they would like to see implemented in their particular brand, when the Genesys and past GEM keyboards have had many of these features for a long time.

I am not trying to take anything away from the other brands; they are all pretty cool actually. It just surprises me that the pro members aren't interested in discovering new sounds, styles and features that would set them apart from other single acts and give them some real uniqueness in what they offer their clients. I guess that is what the G70 brings to the table. I only wish I knew how to get folks excited about a company that is a REAL innovator in digital keyboard technology.

Best Regards,

Dave


[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 03-11-2005).]

" It just surprises me that the pro members aren't interested in discovering new sounds, styles and features that would set them apart from other single acts and give them some real uniqueness in what they offer their clients"

Dear WDMcM;

I am!! I think that a KB has to excel at the basics first before it moves onto other issues such as features. The KB has to sound realistic/authentic along with a lrage variety of excellent styles, or else it is mot worht it. the audience won't hear the 200 other features that the KB has. they only hear the sound.


Thanks;
Regards;
BN

Dave,
What I was refering to with the record feature is the view I am seing in the color display, not the actual way I'm recording. It's the visual thing I totaly appreciated on the G70. As you know, I sell most brands of keyboards in my store, including GEM products. I get excited with new keyboards when I find features which aid the player in making music, songs or styles easier and more intuitive. The G70's color screen and design features brings this to users in a very user friendly manner and this is what I was commenting about. All the type of the line arrangers have their strengths that differ from the competition and over the past 6 or 7 years of my posting here as a music store owner, I have always given my newest received products as much posting here as I think will interest the readers. The comments I receive from the readers is that they enjoy my reporting on as much as possible when they themselves might not be able to see or touch one of these new models because of limited availability. I am not saying that the product I'm reviewing is the best or only choice but rather giving my view on the latest choice. I know I get excited when I really like what I'm playing with, but this is my personality and I think the readers will agree here that I am consistant!
I do understand your perspective that more than one product overs similar features but my intention here was not to do a comparison but rather a review of a newly received product.
George Kaye
Kaye's Music Scene
Reseda, California

Hi BN,

I definitely agree with you that the sounds must come first. That is part of the point I was making. Most all of the brands out there sound good. Sure each has there own strengths and weaknesses, but they are all useable.

As for sounds, an advantage of the Genesys is in its true programmable synth capabilities that far exceed what other arranger instruments offer. If you can't find the sound you are looking for in the existing presets, the ability exists to create entirely new sounds that have nothing to do with the original sounds.

Most of the time however, using the Quick Edit Sound mode suffices to make easy edits to existing sounds so they are more to your liking. I.E. mellow out or brighten a piano sound, increase or decrease the key release time, etc.

Once an edit has been made, there are several different ways to store and recall the new sounds/set-ups to make the instrument comfortable to use and play for most anyone.

BTW- I hope you realize I wasn't trying to cut down anyone here in my comments about the pros on the forums. Just making an observation and pointing out that it might be worth checking out a product that can set you apart from the crowd.

As for the other features, they are very important. The more variety you can offer your clients, the more special you become to them. Features=Variety. This of course is not to say that talent doesn't enter into the equation.

Best Regards,

Dave

Hi George,

I realize that and wasn't trying to start anything up. Sorry mucking up your thread. I enjoy reading your reviews and comparisons.

Regards,

Dave

"I only wish I knew how to get folks excited about a company that is a REAL innovator in digital keyboard technology."

Dave,
It's very helpful that you monitor these forums and are available to help. You even offered to send me one with return option.
As we have discussed before, find a way to let people see and try them. Arrangers are a niche product in the U.S. A lot of dealers can't stock several brands. Most don't stock ANY brands. I know I'm not telling you anything you don't know.
There probably aren't more than a handful of potential sales in my area for top-end arrangers. Now there aren't ANY arrangers in town other than a PA50 at Shreve Audio, a few Cascio WK3500s and the really small Yamahas at Circuit City. Not even a PSR3000!
Maybe you could have some regional clinics or demonstrations. Maybe post a list of who DOES stock them. I know I would drive a couple hours to see one, but I'm an exception. If the GEM is as great as the specs say, it should sell itself, BUT you have to have access to it.
My search for the ultimate arranger continues! Must have great sound, great features and not TOO heavy. The way each of us uses an arranger is almost as varied as the number of users. What is important to me may not be a consideration for others, and vice-versa. For example, I don't really even care if it has a song sequencer, but I would like to have an easy way to create styles.
The SD1 has great sound and isn't too heavy. Any future arranger I buy will have to measure up to the drums and bass sounds of the SD1. It's pretty dated in some of the features and OS, but I'm finding that I'm glad I sacrificed the ease of use of the Tyros and have endured the learning curve of the SD1.
The G70 won't be available here either, but maybe it will be in Dallas.
It would be worthwhile to take a trip and play it and the GEM in one day.
Again, I appreciate your participation. I'm only trying to be helpful.
DonM

Can't find the orignal poster and his famous quote, went like this, "no see, no try, no buy". Many on the zone (including me) feel the same way. I will not buy any keyboard I have not demoed.
Starkeeper

I agree with Don, I've never seen a Gem, and never heard of anybody that plays one, I did find them on the internet a few years ago and was interested sounded like a great board. I sent away for some info and the name of a local dealer, never got it.
Roland sends out video demos, Yamaha has alot of great groups and forums and creates alot of buzz.
I wonder how many guys started on a 3 or 4 hundred dollar yammie then went to psr 2000 then 3000 or whatever. I grew with the Yamaha brand. Roland wasn't accessable to a beginner, not just price but couldn't find one.

------------------
qqqwq@hotmail.com

As far as I know, I've bought every brand at one time or another except GEM. I did have an opportunity to try one of the older models back when Peavey was marketing them, but the ones they had were too big and heavy for my taste. Peavey didn't have the lighter ones. I recall it had a great sequencer in it, and seemed to be built with great quality. I also had very useable styles.
I'm sorry we intruded on your thread, George, but I guess it's all relevant.
DonM


[This message has been edited by DonM (edited 03-11-2005).]

Hi Don,

I appreciate your comments. And agree. I travel the US doing product training to our existing and new dealers. Maybe what I should do is start posting where I am going to be and when and anyone interested could make a trip to the store. Thanks for the idea.

I know what you mean by not finding arrangers in every store. I live in Cincinnati and there is not a store in or around the city that has a PA1x, Tyros, SD1, etc. There are two stores here that have a full stock of GEM products. Not to mention dealers in IN, KY, MI.

Best Regards,

Dave


------------------
Wm. David McMahan
Nat'l Product and Support Manager
Generalmusic USA
GEM Community Forums

Ever hear of Joey DeFrancesco? He is now a GEM Genesys owner. How about Don Grusin? He uses a Promega 3. How about Rick Wakeman, Keith Emerson, John Tesh, Larry Williams, Joe Vanelli.....

As for not getting a response to your request for information, I apologize for that. It was before my time at GEM and that sort of thing does not happen any more.

We have streaming video demos on our website. I will be re-doing the current Genesys demo as soon as I have completed the Promega series, RP series and DRAKE Physical Modeling videos. The current Genesys demo was done by Chris Anthony who is one of the best sound/style programmers around. He helped design the Genesys.

Best Regards,

Dave

------------------
Wm. David McMahan
Nat'l Product and Support Manager
Generalmusic USA
GEM Community Forums

Dear WDMcM;

What about video conferencing on the net, where you could give a tutorial on the Gem equipment? Then you could reach a much larger target audience.

Thanks;
Regards;
BN

Hi,

Actually I am already set up for that. I have been considering the best way to do this very thing. I would like it to be interactive so someone could ask a question or want to see a particular function and I could then demonstrate that feature right then and there.

Even though our corporate offices are in Chicago, some of the GEM USA staff are in Oregon, Arizona, Australia and Italy so video conferencing is a very common tool that we use.

I am set up on MSN Messenger but that only allows for one video conference at a time. I have also looked at iVisit which may allow for more than multiple simultaneous video conferences.

I like the idea. For now I can certainly do one on ones via MSN Messenger.

Best Regards,

Dave


------------------
Wm. David McMahan
Nat'l Product and Support Manager
Generalmusic USA
GEM Community Forums

[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 03-11-2005).]

QUOTE]Originally posted by WDMcM:

"You know, I find it really funny how so many members of these forums go on and on about some new cool feature that they discovered, or that they would like to see implemented in their particular brand, when the Genesys and past GEM keyboards have had many of these features for a long time.

I am not trying to take anything away from the other brands; they are all pretty cool actually. It just surprises me that the pro members aren't interested in discovering new sounds, styles and features that would set them apart from other single acts and give them some real uniqueness in what they offer their clients. I guess that is what the G70 brings to the table. I only wish I knew how to get folks excited about a company that is a REAL innovator in digital keyboard technology." [/QUOTE]

I imagine there are a few famous guys out there that have one of your boards (probably comped).
But I'm not trying to be a wise guy all I am trying to say is I can walk into Daddy's Junky Music (a chain here in the northeast) and see a bunch of lower priced Yamaha keyboards. So I get familiar with them. And also like you said get above that certain price level you can't find a Tyros or roland or Korg arranger anywhere with in hours.
When I decide to move up I stay with what I know.
Can I start on one of your boards for $500 and build up my brand loyalty?
What I meant was I can't talk to any users like you can on a worldwide support group like psr tutorial and other sites of real users that I can and have asked "hey how did ya like the board..whats your experience trying to do this or that."
Next time I talk to Joey D or Rick I'll see if they give me some pointers on how to sequence on a gem. Celebrities probably have a hundred different keyboards, Joey and Rick didn't get famous using a Gem.
Send me one I'll try it for a couple of months and if I like it I'll send ya a check.. or the board back.
All I'm saying is your distrubution hasn't been great. It's like a rolls Royce or a Farrai I know there out there, and I know somebody is buying one. But I've never been to a showroom cause they don't sell around here, or service em either.

Again it sounds like a great board but I've never seen one, I would like to see demos like the ones that Michel Voncken does for Yamaha with real pop songs so I can really compare.




[This message has been edited by mikeathome1 (edited 03-11-2005).]

thanks for the link to your forum Dave. I havent given up on the genesys as a concept and will be visiting the forum regualarly to see how it develops.Cheers

Actually not comped. The famous players using our instruments have either paid for or offered other services as payment.



Yes, the GK340 is less than $500.00. The WK1 is a bit more than $500.00



I'll give you that one. At this point GEM does not have the following that Yamaha has. This doesn't mean that they are not as good or better in some cases.

As for wanting to know how certain things function on our instruments, you are talking to the national product support manager. It is my job to know all of the ins and outs if our instruments. I am a regular here and on other forums to answer those questions and do so in an honest straightforward way. I try to leave the hype out of my responses and only offer relative, un-biased information. And there are GEM owners that frequent these forums that are happy to answer questions you may have.



Do that. Joey said he really likes the Hammond sounds on the Genesys. Now that surprises me since he is the B3 king as of Jimmy Smith's passing. GRHS

Rick Wakeman uses the Promega 3 which is our Physical Modeling stage piano and does not have an internal sequencer. Before the Promega 3, Rick used the GEM Pro 2 digital piano (along with a huge arsenal of other synths).



Give me a credit card number and I will have one sent to you with a 15 day trial with full refund, less shipping. Shipping doesn't amount to all that much, so you are out almost nothing if you don't like the Genesys.



That is true. The relationship with Baldwin Piano for our home pianos and Peavey for our pro instruments both turned out to be not great ideas. There was a lot to clean up from those situations. But that is over and our distribution is much better than it ever was in the past and getting better every day. We have come up with a way for those people that are a distance away from a dealer to still be able to get our product until a dealer is set-up in their area. I am on board to supply product support and do so at all hours of the day and night when necessary. Via e-mail, this and other forums and our own forum, and via phone support if needed.

Best Regards,

Dave


------------------
Wm. David McMahan
Nat'l Product and Support Manager
Generalmusic USA
GEM Community Forums

[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 03-11-2005).]

My pleasure. Let me know if you have further questions I can answer for you.

Dave

[QUOTE]Originally posted by DonM:
[B]" For example, I don't really even care if it has a song sequencer, but I would like to have an easy way to create styles.
The SD1 has great sound and isn't too heavy. Any future arranger I buy will have to measure up to the drums and bass sounds of the SD1. It's pretty dated in some of the features and OS, but I'm finding that I'm glad I sacrificed the ease of use of the Tyros and have endured the learning curve of the SD1.
hi Don,
I'm kind of like you there, no need for sequencer, just good style for gig playing. How is your transition from Tyros to SD1, I'm almost the opposite, just got tyros, after playing with SD1 since they first came out in 2001, is yours SD1plus or just SD1, Idon't even know the differences. Can you compare the 2 keyboards, if you have'nt done it already. Also style 8beatballad3 is pretty awesome for song " a Whiter shade of pale" with some tweaking.
And I live in Dallas, there's no G70 at any stores, It sure looks good.

Tye

Tye, I plan to post a complete opinion on my SD1 experience soon. Briefly, I've had nothing but great feedback on the sound. I've had some battles with the OS but I'm slowly winning them.
I love the "live" sound of the SD1. It's hard to tell you're not hearing a live drummer and bass player.
DonM

WDMcM
Thanks for your time, and I hope you can get your message out there and your boards become more accessible. Just by your being here you have shown a new willingness.
Remember I did compare it to the Rolls Royce.
And probably, because of the innovations of your company, it forces all the keyboard makers to better their machines to keep up.

Looking forward to it DonM, had a SD1 for a few days back in
2001, and even wrote some lines about it downwards this tread:
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/001755.html


Also Ketron_AJ wrote a review in this tread:
http://www.synthzone.com/ubbs/Forum37/HTML/002319.html


Looks like SD1 (SD1+) is still going strong, and since there
are no new successor in foreseeable sight (if ever?) and it
is almost in the same price level as G70 a comparison between
the two would be nice to see as well, even if it at the end
is the personal taste and needs who decide what to choose.

Also I would like to know the "fill in" system on the G70 are
i.e. compared to the KN's?
I understand you can't choose between them freely, but a kind
of up and downwards progress just as when use the KN's MSA.
Is it possible to use them separately as you desire and in the
succession you want to either by use the fillin buttons as is
or maybe programmable ones?

Happy playing.
GJ



[This message has been edited by Gunnar Jonny (edited 03-12-2005).]

[QUOTE] by WDMcM:

I live in Cincinnati and there is not a store in or around the city that has a PA1x, Tyros, SD1, etc.

Dave,
Sam Ash has a PA1x in Tri-County
Zuki

They must have gotten it in recently then. The last time I was there, the keyboard clerk said that they do not stock that model but could special order it.

But thanks for pointing that out anyway.

Buddy Roger's music in Beechmont has a Promega 2, Genesys Ensemble Grand, RP800 and RP700 on the showroom floor.

Kathy's Organs and Pianos in Northgate has a Genesys Ensemble, RP800, RP700, RP80, pRP7, and Genesys on the showroom floor.

Far Out Music in Jefferson, IN has a Promega 2 and a Genesys Pro on the showroom floor.

Central Music in Louisville, KY has a Genesys Ensemble vertical and grand, RP800, RP700, RP70, GK340, WK1, WK2000HD, PS1300 on the showroom floor.

BTW- The Genesys Ensemble is the home verion of the Genesys series. So if you can't find a Genesys Pro in your area, you can always check out a Genesys Ensemble since ALL Genesys models are the same on the inside, front panel layout, etc.

As an example, somebody metioned not finding many high end arranger keyboards in Dallas, TX. Dallas Piano is one of our largest dealers. They became a GEM dealer last year. They have several Genesys Ensembles in stock and every other GEM home model as well.

LOL,

Dave

------------------
Wm. David McMahan
Nat'l Product and Support Manager
Generalmusic USA
GEM Community Forums


[This message has been edited by WDMcM (edited 03-13-2005).]