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 I just bought a B-3 and two Leslies (Page 1)
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| Author | Topic: I just bought a B-3 and two Leslies |
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cassp Member |
posted 01-31-2010 03:42 PM
   
No I didn't. I just couldn't help myself when I saw that T3 post. But if it were possible, wouldn't we all want a B-3 and two Leslie 122's or 147's? Sign me up.  IP: Logged |
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cgiles Member |
posted 01-31-2010 04:24 PM
quote: I just clicked on an ad above this post entitled, "Hammond organ and Leslie maintenance and repair". BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU WISH FOR. chas IP: Logged |
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cassp Member |
posted 01-31-2010 04:35 PM
Believe it or not, one of the things I always disliked about the Hammond consoles was that there was no sustain on the bass pedals. They were absolutely dead and I needed to use a lot of 16' to not barf. But the rest of the machine was a work of art. BTW - I'm lonesome for my G70. [This message has been edited by cassp (edited 01-31-2010).] IP: Logged |
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DonM Member |
posted 01-31-2010 06:14 PM
quote: No way I'd ever go back to hauling all that stuff around. Arrangers were my deliverance! IP: Logged |
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cassp Member |
posted 01-31-2010 07:06 PM
I'm with you there, Don. But anyone who would dream of such a setup probably isn't thinking about weight, bulk or anything like that. Let's top things off and put a Motif XS8 on top. Put me on stage with ____ and let me go. IP: Logged |
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Bill Lewis Member |
posted 02-01-2010 04:57 AM
Cassp When I was gigging with a B3 I had a bass unit called a NOVA IV installed and had synth bass tones with sustain on both the lower manuel and pedals. Also had its own volume controlled 1/4" output. You can get sustain on a Hammond with a String Bass unit from Trek II products in New Brunswick NJ, They make top quality add on and replacement parts for all model Hammonds. Until recently I did a lot of buying and selling of Hammonds and did business with them. The last B3 I have is my personnel one. A MINT 1958 Cherrywood with matching leslie, String Bass, Fischer Reverb, new covers, etc. Interested? I can make your dream come true Bill in NJ IP: Logged |
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cassp Member |
posted 02-01-2010 07:57 AM
Bill, you just described my dream setup. Michigan just started having Powerball drawings along with the MegaMillions drawings, doubling my chances to win millions of dollars. Can I put it on layaway? Then again, given the odds, maybe it would be cheaper to just buy it outright. Thanks for the offer. IP: Logged |
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captain Russ Member |
posted 02-01-2010 09:05 AM
My B-3 is one of my prized possessions, and I am really lucky to have a place to store it and gig with it. I use a 145 and a 147'RV with it. A couple of things: * Chas ir right-maintenance is a bitch! * I only move it for really big jobs two or three times a year. * If it didn't "live" at the club where I use it 4-5 times a month, it would be in storage-I have the XK system in my home (with a Motion sound 145). * I really wish EVERY keyboard player would have the chance to "woodshed" on a B-3 at some time in their lives. * None were any good, bass-wise, without one of several boost/sustain units attached. * Leslies-at least old 145, 147, 122's are WHAT A COOL INSTRUMENT!
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Diki Member |
posted 02-01-2010 12:59 PM
Yep, they're nice to dream about, but a nightmare as regular gigging keyboards..  I have to confess, right now if someone offered me a B3 and a couple of Leslies for the same price as a C2 and a couple of Motion Pro 145's, I'd take the Nord in a heartbeat... We've got a B3 and a 147 at the studio, and you are right... noisy as hell! Of course, for what we mostly do (alt rock, blues rock, etc.) you don't need a whole lot of subtlety IP: Logged |
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captain Russ Member |
posted 02-01-2010 03:56 PM
Diki....WHAT? I CAN'T HEAR YOU! (Whir...whir....) Russ IP: Logged |
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ianmcnll Member |
posted 02-01-2010 04:38 PM
I always used to say, you played a keyboard, but you "rode" a B-3. No two of them sounded quite the same, but they all "sounded like a Hammond." I miss the experience of playing one, but I don't miss the pain of moving one, especially when confronted with stairs. My old B-3 and two Leslie 147RV are still with the guy who bought them from me...he has them in his rec room, and everything still works fine. I always carried a tube of oil, and a little wrench to adjust the nuts on the smaller motor for the horn on the Leslies. The "Hammond sound" is and was, timeless, much like the sound of a piano or an acoustic guitar...it was a mood, a style, a color...not a shrink-wrapped sound that you get as a preset on a synth or an arranger. I can understand where you're coming from,. Cassp...if only we could afford roadies....425 lbs is a little much nowadays. Ian IP: Logged |
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Songman55 Member |
posted 02-01-2010 08:49 PM
I must say I miss my B3 days. My first church job was on a C3 which is a B3 in a church cabinet. I hauled one around for several years. Like Don said, an arranger was my salvation. As far as the bass was concerned, there was a crugar sp? bass that you could have put on that made it more user friendly. Anyway, even though I love my arrangers, I still miss my B3. Joe ------------------ IP: Logged |
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DonM Member |
posted 02-01-2010 10:14 PM
I suppose a B3 was what REALLY got me interested in music. My mother used to play one at church, and I would go with her when she went to practice, and she would let me "play". I must have been 5 or 6 at the time. I can still remember how awesome the thing was, and even the smell! We always had a piano at home and she was a concert-level pianist as well. I took lessons for about 6 months when I was in the first grade, but quit. I always fooled around with the piano at home though. I learned to read music playing trumpet in high school, then added bass, drums and guitar with various bands in college. The day I graduated, I bought a Lowrey organ, on credit of course, and started playing with a local band back home. It wasn't long before I realized that the B3 was the thing, and I traded the Lowrey on one. I learned to play keys almost entirely on my own, but had a great influence early. My mom could play anything written that you placed in front of her, but couldn't play Happy Birthday without the music. Ironically, she became jealous of my ability to play just about anything I hear. Jealous, but proud. DonM IP: Logged |
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Tonewheeldude Member |
posted 02-02-2010 12:38 AM
congratulations on the purchase of the virtual B3 and two virtual leslies! Hope you don't get a virtual hernia  Good choice though. Playing a B3 (or any oth the series) through a Leslie just helps to remind you what an amazing and original instrument it is. The trouble is it makes it hard to put up with the organ sounds on arrangers! IP: Logged |
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cassp Member |
posted 02-02-2010 07:44 AM
I was taken with the B3 when the Rascals hit the music scene, although my parentsw had albums from greats like Lenny Dee and Jimmy Smith in our collection. Felix Cavalieri really set my Hammond senses burning. When I was 16 I worked for the church organist as apprentice and flower delivery boy. He had a BV with a large PR cabinet in his house - wow, was that great. One day I was delivering flowers to a doctor's wife and she asked me to put them on a table in the den - and there it was... a beautiful cherry B3 with a matching Leslie. The lady could tell I was taken by it and offered to let me play it. She offered to let me stop by and play it whenever I wanted. I think if it were up to her, she would have given it to me. Since then I can't get that vision out of my mind. I've played almost every type of drawbar organ Hammond put out until 1975 as I gave lessons and did some selling for the local dealer. The store manager would let me take out a Porta-B or M3 for my weekend gigs, AND let me use the store truck and dollies. I've owned two M's and now an XK-1. IP: Logged |
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captain Russ Member |
posted 02-02-2010 08:35 AM
Don is right about the smell. You've got tubes, the belts moving, the oil bath, and that old cherry wood. It's almost like the thing comes alive when you raise that 2nd switch. They're neat old "monsters". At the club where mine stays, one of the "veteran" waiters is a long-time church organist who plays a little M-100 in a small country church. He and his son move my B to the room where the event is. W@hen I get there, the instrument is up and running. When the gig is over, I just walk away and William moves it back to the equipment room where it stays. We've got the regular B-3 dolly and carts for the cabinets, plus the place has elevators between floors. I moved the B-3 there in 1977. If I ever had to move it, I'd probably donate it to William's church. Last year, I found, restored and donated the 122 they use. Great memories!
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cgiles Member |
posted 02-02-2010 08:50 AM
I've owned a CV, a C3, and 2 B3's. The last was a B3 that had been 'portablized' that I bought while in Hawaii and sold when we moved back to the mainland. Even in it's portable state, it still weighed over 300lbs, not counting the Leslies. Heck, the two Leslie cables alone probably weighed as much as my Nord C1 . Would I choose the real deal over a clone? For home, yes; for gigging, never (unless I were a touring superstar....or travelling with one (the more likely scenario ), and had full-time instrument techs, roadies, and set-up guys). I want to be the keyboardist in one of those Jay Leno/David Letterman-type house bands (but I also want to be independently wealthy, living in a mansion overlooking the bay where my yacht is anchored and my trophy wife is just returning from her modeling gig at Victoria's Secret). Sorry, got carried away; what were we talking about? Must be arrangers, since we're now only allowed to talk about those, or so it's been proposed. Better get in these pointless posts while we can.chas IP: Logged |
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cgiles Member |
posted 02-02-2010 08:55 AM
Russ, you just reminded me of those old oak strap-on dollies. Those babies must have weighed 40lbs by themselves. chas IP: Logged |
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DonM Member |
posted 02-02-2010 11:59 AM
Yes, the dollies weighed more than my Audya. My last organ was a huge Yamaha FS500, retail $15,000, like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320445361664 At least it had built-in pedals. The last Lowrey I had had a full pedal board that had to be detached and moved. What a load! Between two leslies, the pedals, the dollies, the p.a. system, the bench, I could barely get it all in a full-sized Chevy van. Now I get all my stuff in a Scion XB! DonM IP: Logged |
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ianmcnll Member |
posted 02-02-2010 12:11 PM
I used one of these for a few years...factory portabilized Yamaha Electone C-605... Pretty rare instrument as well, from what I hear...I special ordered it when I was still gigging using the organ...still needed a van, as the two powered speakers (remember the Yammie's with the white speaker cones)were nearly as bulky as two Leslies. Wasn't near as heavy as the B-3, but I'm glad to be using an arranger today. Only 400 lbs lighter than the B-3. Ian IP: Logged |
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captain Russ Member |
posted 02-02-2010 12:24 PM
Yea, I'll have to say that it's hard to beat a C-1, a small bass amp and a Motion sound top box. Whole thing, in three easy pieces, is around 100 lbs.
Russ IP: Logged |
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cgiles Member |
posted 02-02-2010 12:35 PM
quote: Yeah, but if you were "riding" (your words) a B3, the 'pop-tart' of the night was pretty much a sure thing, whereas with an arranger, even if you DO get lucky, you're probably talking wig, dentures, and support hose. Hey, had to be some reason we were willing to hump 700 lbs. of gear up two flights of stairs for $50.00 a night. BTW, I think about that every time someone mentions the 'good ol' days'. I hate the B3. chas IP: Logged |
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Diki Member |
posted 02-02-2010 03:22 PM
No one is talking about the MAIN difference between gigging with the B and what we do now... On the B, you played EVERYTHING! Play something great, nobody assumed it was a machine. Play something bad, EVERYBODY knew it was you! Nowadays, nobody knows what's real and what isn't. And are pretty blasé about the whole experience, I'm afraid. I miss the old days... IP: Logged |
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Tonewheeldude Member |
posted 02-02-2010 03:39 PM
quote: Its such a relief working with people that still have a passion for vintage keys and see the benefits of staying close to the original sound as possible, even if they can't carry around genuine vntage gear. Its a fairly common assumption that audiences don't know the difference between say a sampled hammond on a synth and a genuine vintage C3/Leslie, and when they are listening to a band with only synths that may be the case; However they certainly know when the right sound is present!! I see it on their faces on a regular basis. IP: Logged |
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Bill Lewis Member |
posted 02-02-2010 03:47 PM
Cassp Gotta answer you on the Rascals. When I finally sold my gigging B3 to a church and had it all packed up and ready to go I get a call from a local club that I used to loan it to for show groups that required one. We got dinner and drinks and got to see the show in return. I tell the owner its ready to go and ask who needs it? FELIX of the Rascals!!. Just him and a pickup group but it was a thrill for me to have him play it and meet him later. Meet him agin in Atlantic City NJ and he remember the gig. Also a girl singer I worked with for a while had a boyfriend who ran a big band in North Jersey. Eddie Brigati used to show up and sing all the time with them. Rule #1--never mention the Rascals Diki ME TOO!!! Used to kick bass on the B, Fender Rhoades on top, synth on the side, and sang. Just me, a kickass drummer and a frontman who played congas. Worked my tail off every night and loved it.. Miss it big time Bill in NJ IP: Logged |
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keysvocalssax Member |
posted 02-02-2010 04:48 PM
Back in the 80's when I just played sax i used to use the late great jazz organist Bobby Forrester in Long Island NY (he was with Ruth Brown in the 90's) and I always marveled at how he used to roll his B3 and Leslies in and out of his rickety old van to all his gigs all by himself. Maybe it helped that he used to down a few shots of Black Bull through the night. But I don't know what it is with organ players, they all seem to get louder and louder as the night goes on, until by the last set they are killing your ears. Can anyone explain this to me? ------------------ IP: Logged |
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Tonewheeldude Member |
posted 02-02-2010 05:22 PM
quote: Its normally down to the sound engineer. Its best to keep the Leslie as back line and mic it up... even for small gigs. Always make sure the guy on keys has the Leslie next to him or at least a monitor speaker otherwise if the leslie is off stage he is going to have trouble hearing himself over the other instruments. IP: Logged |
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keysvocalssax Member |
posted 02-02-2010 05:41 PM
sound engineer?lol no engineer at those little clubs we played- Bobby controlled his own sound. but not his 100 proof Black Bull habit. ------------------ IP: Logged |
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Bill Lewis Member |
posted 02-03-2010 06:38 AM
What a coincidence. A few years ago when I was buying selling Hammonds I teamed up with a tech from North Jersey, Jack Pelek. Jack built a new garage for his business and in no time Bobby had his beat up B3 and leslies stored there. Didn't move them for over two years, always had a rental on the gigs with Ruth Brown. Just after Jack got him to put them in a storage facility he passed away. Great underrated player. For all you Hammond heads out there I've still got the Mint Cherrywood setup for sale. Not too many like this one around. Bill in NJ IP: Logged |
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Fran Carango Member |
posted 02-03-2010 08:32 AM
Bill, I thought your cherried B3 was ear marked for Chas.. IP: Logged |
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cgiles Member |
posted 02-03-2010 10:34 AM
quote: President Obama is trying to do away with earmarks and as a good citizen, I'm trying to comply. Actually, since you're on my 'need to know' list, Fran, my daughter had some economic downturns (as in, lost her job) and unfortunately for me, the cost of her economic rescue was/is about $100k. That's like my 'discretionary' budget for the next millenium. Sadly, family comes before B3's. Hope this answers your question. chas IP: Logged |
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ianmcnll Member |
posted 02-03-2010 10:51 AM
quote: Good thing for your daughter you were able to bail her out. Some of us have no family to rely on for support, and, you're right Chas...family does come ahead of everything,. Best thing is that the C1 is just about indistinguishable from a B-3, especially on a recording, so a B-3 is not really a necessity...just a nice dream. You're a good dad, Chas. Ian IP: Logged |
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cgiles Member |
posted 02-03-2010 03:37 PM
quote: Not that good, Ian. 'She has a very good MOM' would be closer to the truth. I've reached a point in my life where 'stuff' is becoming less important to me. My days of buying airplanes and big diesel motorhomes are over. I've discovered that the less I have, the less I have to worry about. It's a nice feeling. I'm just grateful to have reached this age and still be in a position to help. chas IP: Logged |
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ianmcnll Member |
posted 02-03-2010 03:52 PM
quote: That's a good thing Chas...lucky you were in the position to help...lots of people have no one to turn to. I feel the same way about "things"...biggest splurge for me was this new PC, and only because it was necessary. I used to be into antique cars, and gave it up...sold my old Cadillac some time ago. Right now I'm happy (more like content) with a middle line keyboard...never thought that would happen...really don't need much else. Don't miss the bars and clubs either. Gettin' older, but needin' less...nothing wrong with that. Ian
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keysvocalssax Member |
posted 02-03-2010 05:03 PM
Chas, I'm back here after a long time off, and you have once again made it worthwhile with your wisdom, as you were one of those whose posts used to have the most to say to me. thanks. And Bill from NJ, thanks for the Bobby Forrester tidbit. He was a great player, but he always was bitter he never got more recognition. He thought it was because he was white, but then when Joey D skyrocketed to fame, that really threw him for a loop. One of the highlights of my career was playing tenor sax with the Jimmy Smith Trio ------------------ IP: Logged |
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cgiles Member |
posted 02-03-2010 08:17 PM
Mo, it's good to see you back and posting. I can't believe we've got three, count 'em, THREE jazz sax players on this forum (Brickboo, Randy, and you). Wow, with Diki on 'bone, Russ on Upright bass, Rory on guitar (or whatever else we need), and maybe TonyMads to put some old skool jazz vocals on top......heck, let the games begin. We'll meet you in Miami, let the ladies know we're coming. chas chas IP: Logged |
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Tonewheeldude Member |
posted 02-04-2010 12:23 AM
quote: Lol! Jimmy played at the Jazz Cafe and had a cold about the time you worked with him, he was very grumpy that noght. Myself and a colleague spent quite some time with him before and after the show as we had been photgraphing some of the leading Hammond players for my website. My colleague took these: http://www.hammond-organ.com/Artist/html/jsmith.htm About half an hour into the night he grumbled and swore about his cold and disappeared for ages. The thing is, at that time everyone was so happy to have a chance to see him perform they didn't mind. My colleage Mark gave him a set of the photos at a later date which he liked. The photos look great on the wall if you guys havn't seen them before: TWD IP: Logged |
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Diki Member |
posted 02-04-2010 02:18 AM
We get so many comments about working OMB because some of us can't stand the shenanigans that other musicians (never US, eh?  ) get up to, but here is the perfect example of someone WORTH the hassle...Sure, in this case it's a legend, but in all fairness, most of us probably know some players that might not be choirboys but can play CIRCLES around any darn arranger (and tastefully, too, before anyone starts dissing competency You ever played with those kind of guys? You REALLY prefer being solo and playing with a machine? IP: Logged |
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ianmcnll Member |
posted 02-04-2010 05:14 AM
quote: Just curious my friend, but would you play in a duo or trio where one of the members, who was a good player, constantly showed up late, drunk, missed gigs, played only what they wanted to play or did all or most of these things? In other words, if Chris, your partner, without which you'd be a solo act, with no vocals, did any of the above, would you work with him? Working with someone who's cranky or has a personality dis-order is not a problem, but the above examples are not something most players would put up with more than once, no matter how "good" the person. Not everyone has the luxury of available and dependable sidemen. That's why many go solo...it's certainly not an anti-social thing, nor does it mean they aren't skilled players. Ian [This message has been edited by ianmcnll (edited 02-04-2010).] IP: Logged |
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cassp Member |
posted 02-04-2010 05:58 AM
I would like to add that booking a solo is a lot easier than booking a duo, especially if you have identified a market such as heath care facilities. It's tight this year to maintain prices, let alone try to sell a duo at an even higher price. I speak for myself, but feel many would prefer to play with other humans if the circumstances and economics were different. And lastly, it seems a good number of us are established in our lifestyles and prefer not deal with many of the inherent hassles of playing in a group or in public venues, as many have done in past "lives". JMHO [This message has been edited by cassp (edited 02-04-2010).] IP: Logged |
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