I am trying to use my keyboard controller and wind controller at the same time. The SD40 plays accomp and lead voices very well, but I want to switch off and play my harmonica wind controller on the same song.
The SD40 recognizes and play either fine from two of the USB ports, but since they are both assigned to global ch 1, obviously, it is either or. I can change TX channel on the DM48 controller, but can't find a corresponding different receive channel on the SD40, and the manual doesn't help me.
I know nothing except the mere basics of midi, but it seems I have to transmit on two different channels, use a midi merge unit, of play one at a time.
Bernie - Read this a couple of times trying to understand better. Do I have this, right? You are playing using a keyboard controller via USB and controlling both left and right-hand parts with no issue. Then at some point, you want to change to a different controller. What happens when you do that? Maybe a better question is, what doesn't happen when you do that? I think you want to use both controllers at the same time? If that is correct, what do you want the keyboard controller to do and what do you want the wind controller to do?
Hiya Curt Thanks for the reply. Yes, play both at the same time. Say I am playing a registration from the SD40 with 4 instruments to navigate to on the screen. since I can play most anything by ear on the harmonica, I have a DM48 wind controller to jump to for embellished riffs etc.
Technically, both are on ch1, so when I jump to the DM48, I have to unplug the Controller and plug in the wind controller, naturally, since they are both on the same channel. Both are readily recognized and work perfectly. I hope this helps. Bernie
Bernie, I understand what you are trying to do here, and I am sure that you know that vArranger can do this and a lot more with such ease and flexibility, which is why I like software solutions in many situations. Anyway, I would love to be wrong about this, but I don’t think the SD40 can do what you are trying to do. However, you can connect the DM48 to the MIDI In 1 (GM) on the SD40 via your Keton USB MIDI host. This way, the two USB MIDI controllers will be totally independent from each other, and you can play any solo patch from the DM48 by sending PC messages.
Does the DM48 send PC messages? It looks like a serious MIDI controller. Can you play it without holding it with your hands like the Jamboxx Pro, which I own?
Hi Chris I have to limit the gear to the SD40 and perhaps Kenton Midi Host. I have to play it like a harmonica, as opposed to keys, as this allow me to play freely by ear. The DM48 has midi cc messages, which is now on ch2-wind controller, midi program numbers, midi ctrl keys 22-24, whatever that means.
However, it works fine on my Pa4X using Upper2 voice, for gigs with a keyboard. Curt will undoubtedly get back to me also. I appreciate your help.
Bernie - One option is to switch from USB to using basic MIDI connections. As you know the SD40 has two MIDI ins. Under the covers that gives you access to 32 independent MIDI channels. You could run one of the controllers to In1 (this is limited to using the GM voices) and the other to In2 (This will allow access to the arranger and the voice presets). In the MIDI map, you would use the "GM Part" button to configure whatever channel is needed for In1 and the "Arranger" button to configure whatever MIDI channel is needed for the In2 port. Of course, that assumes you can run MIDI vs. USB connections?
Thanks Donnie, but I use a Sennheiser 935 for both vocal and harmonica. I have about 40 different ones, and can't commit installation to one. For strictly harmonica, I can see the advantage if it sounds as good as they say. One disadvantage I can see is like working a mic as opposed to a head worn. Unless your name is Gary, it is more difficult to shape your sound.
Thanks Curt It looks like this is the only way to go. My Kenton Midi Host receives the USB from the DM48 and provides midi sockets for SD40. In fact, before I was told that the SD40 was class compliant, I used the Kenton for just the DM48 into midi in#2. Chris had also mentioned this. The only thing to figure out is in#1 setup.
Controller midi out In#2 keyboard and SD40 to #1. Midi port for #1: Midi play to style and voice out is piano voice, to keyboard is the same as my controller. If I could direct my instruments, I would be home free. My ignorance showing badly, sorry.
I have to leave for a gig, will take this up again later this afternoon
The unit shown above is what we use at the lab and we are about to release a video showing how we control 2 modules with this units (focus is on modules ofcourse but you get the drift).
The unit shown above is what we use at the lab and we are about to release a video showing how we control 2 modules with this units (focus is on modules ofcourse but you get the drift). Thanks,
I think Bernie is saying that he wants to use two USB midi controllers (with no MIDI 5 pin Din out) at the same time with the SD40. One of the USB controllers is his DM48 a midi harmonica.
AJ's solution to use a MIDI merge box is not a viable option for a few reasons. First, Bernie will have to have two Kenton USB MIDI hosts or a USB MIDI host that supports multiple USB MIDI controllers or a USB hub like the UHMR USB Host MIDI Router by Servilla Soft, which I use. Second, even if you feed both USB controllers, after "conversion," into MIDI In 2 (Keyboard), the MIDI harmonica will merely play the same patch as the controller #1. Not much benefit at all. I would be happy to be wrong about this but the SD40 in this mode doesn't allow the 2nd MIDI controller to call up its own sound patch. In other words, both MIDI controllers merged together will play the same sound. However, if the 1st USB midi controller is connected via USB, and the 2nd controller the harmonica to MIDI din 1, the harmonica will be totally independent from the controller 1 and be able to select its own patch for a nice solo melody. This is what I and Curt suggested earlier.
I have kb controller connected by USB and DM48 midi din to GM #1, and both playing same instrument. How do I get DM48 to play a different patch. The GM midi screen on the SD40 shows channel choices, but DM48 will play only on ch 1. It is simple on a keyboard by using different upper numbers. The problem is I don't have room for a big heavy keyboard, and I use the SD40 for a multitude of things. The only thing I have gotten to work is to choose a different instrument when I want to play the DM48 and the left hand sound remains the same. Of coarse, this is the same as changing instruments on the keyboard.
Bernie - When connected to In1, the touchscreen on the SD40 will not change voices. You need to send a program change via MIDI. In comparison, when connected to In2, the SD40 touch screen will change the voices (or respond to program changes via MIDI). The default GM MIDI map is a 1-1 mapping of all the channels. So ch1 from your controller is going to channel 1 on the In1 port of the SD40. Channel 1 on In2 of the SD40 is an entirely different connection and your second controller can send on 1 (if needed) or any other channel. I would suggest using the Global channel on In2 to make things easy to control the arranger section, and that will also by default give you a split point. Does that help with understanding what the 40 is (or not) doing?
Ah - Wait, I missed the USB part of your comment. I'll have to fire my unit up and look at what you can do with USB. I don't use that connection.
I am wondering how much fiddling I would have to do during a performance to send a program change message from #1 port(DM48), as there are no keystrokes or GUI available, just a scrolling parameter window on the harmonica.
All of you have been great in trying to help me out, but, it seems that a module does not lend itself to simultaneous commands very easily. If this is the case, there are always workarounds. 1. Program registrations with a DM48 patch and have the other three for keyboard, which my new Microkey 61 is working fine. 2. Play over SMF files using "Favorite Instruments" folder.
I just feel guilty about taking your time if it isn't practical.
How about this idea? You could pre-build a set set of registrations that match up to a known setlist. In that case, it would be as simple as reaching over and touching the next registration via SD40 screen to configure things. You could even have multiple registrations for the same tune if needed. Of course, if you took a request you have to fiddle around if you didn't have an existing registration that would work. I haven't saved a registration and verified that the MIDI In1 settings are saved but I expecting that they are.
I am intrigued with all this midi stuff of which in all my years playing never took a fancy to and hardly ever used it in my rigs. for me. It's just too dam confusing and cumbersome configuring all that stuff. But we all do it differently MIDI devices just isn't my cup of tea. good luck I hope you can figure out what it is your trying to accomplish.
I am intrigued with all this midi stuff of which in all my years playing never took a fancy to and hardly ever used it in my rigs. for me. It's just too dam confusing and cumbersome configuring all that stuff. But we all do it differently MIDI devices just isn't my cup of tea. good luck I hope you can figure out what it is your trying to accomplish.
Gee Donny, I thought you were a big advocate of cutting edge technology and using technology (ie. the latest, greatest, most full-featured arrangers) to accomplish your musical goals. If you haven't caught up to MIDI yet, that puts you about 20+ yrs behind the times. It's hard to find a piece of musical gear these days that doesn't support or utilize MIDI in some form or other. Hey, you don't want to be the dinosaur in the crowd, do you? Or should we just call you T.Rex (hey that could be your hip-hop name ).
Chas,...MIDI is nothing that new.... yes I know all about it but it does absolutely nothing for MY NEEDS at all. Years ago 70's/80's I always performed in a band with 4 keyboards without MIDI.... a B3/147 leslie & Fender Rhodes at a right angle second tier a Juno 60 & Crumar Performer It was heaven.. not an arranger KB in sight.
Just kidding you Donny. I'm a limited user myself (don't use it in recording, although I probably should). I HAVE to use it to trigger my many modules and computer VSTi's, but for recording I stick strictly to 'audio'. It's definitely easier to edit (tracks) in midi but I'd just rather re-record (replay) a 'bad' part. Kidding aside though, it helps these days to have a good basic knowledge of how MIDI works. Sooner or later you're going to have to deal with it.
Chas,...MIDI is nothing that new.... yes I know all about it but it does absolutely nothing for MY NEEDS at all. Years ago 70's/80's I always performed in a band with 4 keyboards without MIDI.... a B3/147 leslie & Fender Rhodes at a right angle second tier a Juno 60 & Crumar Performer It was heaven.. not an arranger KB in sight.
Donny you are looking at one aspect of midi use.. All the years I have known you... you have always used midi. It could be derived from midi, originated by midi, organized by midi.. etc.
For example those styles you have played and edited are midi based.. the SMF's you used are all midi.. the registrations you use... yep, midi based. Vst's and control to your MixCraft... midi. All continue controller commands, like volume, expression , reverb send levels and such.. midi based.. Many are internal midi based but you are using midi...all the time..
Chas,...MIDI is nothing that new.... yes I know all about it but it does absolutely nothing for MY NEEDS at all. Years ago 70's/80's I always performed in a band with 4 keyboards without MIDI.... a B3/147 leslie & Fender Rhodes at a right angle second tier a Juno 60 & Crumar Performer It was heaven.. not an arranger KB in sight.
Donny you are looking at one aspect of midi use.. All the years I have known you... you have always used midi. It could be derived from midi, originated by midi, organized by midi.. etc.
For example those styles you have played and edited are midi based.. the SMF's you used are all midi.. the registrations you use... yep, midi based. Vst's and control to your MixCraft... midi. All continue controller commands, like volume, expression , reverb send levels and such.. midi based.. Many are internal midi based but you are using midi...all the time..
Fran... I was mainly talking about midi connections... Sysex.... Cc codes, channels, ..controllers etc,. ... Gives me a big headache...
Hi Chris I have to limit the gear to the SD40 and perhaps Kenton Midi Host. I have to play it like a harmonica, as opposed to keys, as this allow me to play freely by ear. The DM48 has midi cc messages, which is now on ch2-wind controller, midi program numbers, midi ctrl keys 22-24, whatever that means.
However, it works fine on my Pa4X using Upper2 voice, for gigs with a keyboard. Curt will undoubtedly get back to me also. I appreciate your help.
Bernie
Hi Bernie, I'd say that what you are trying to do here is really a simple, straightforward MIDI task as you would think also, but the limited MIDI implementation on the SD40 makes it tricky. I really like your idea of playing the DM48 for solo voices while both hands are on the keyboard. It will bring more life into arranger and keyboard playing. For that reason, I have a Hammond 44, but the problem is that I don't have three hands. I thought about a MIDI harmonica for some time, and finally after your post I got myself a Jamboxx Pro. I don't know about your DM48, but the Jamboxx Pro originally designed for physically challenged people can be played on a bracket, which frees both hands.
Going back to MIDI, the DM48 manual doesn't mention anything about how to program/send PC messages. The other day, I took my SD40 out from storage and set it up. Though the pic doesn't show it, my FR4x is connected to the SD40 via USB, and a Korg Microkey air 49 (as a substitute for the MIDI harmonica I will be getting this week) and a USB MIDI device keypad (to send PC messages) into MIDI In 1 on the SD40. As expected, I could call up any patch I want. Also, the SD40 seems to fully support patch remain. I suppose I can do the same by using a MIDI foot controller to send PC messages. Watch this gentleman playing the Jamboxx Pro and Sensual Sax. I have Sensual Sax in my iPad, but I didn't know that a PC version is also available for $20. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-8JG4XIvJs
This is very interesting, and would like to hear how you make out. In the meantime, I have to content my self with alternating the DM48 and Microkey 61 to play lead voices on the SD40. Actually, I am not missing much that way except right hand comping while on the DM48. I still have left hand chord and comping, along with the style. It seems to much for me to try and send midi messages to voice the DM48, but probably because you are much more midifluent(I just coined a new word). The other problem is not enough hands. I don't have a neck holder big enough for the DM48.
The Jammbox Pro looks interesting ,at a much lower price than my DM48. Keep us informed.
But you are using them already without any effort on your part... no headache
Originally Posted By Torch
Originally Posted By Bernie9
Hi Chris I have to limit the gear to the SD40 and perhaps Kenton Midi Host. I have to play it like a harmonica, as opposed to keys, as this allow me to play freely by ear. The DM48 has midi cc messages, which is now on ch2-wind controller, midi program numbers, midi ctrl keys 22-24, whatever that means.
However, it works fine on my Pa4X using Upper2 voice, for gigs with a keyboard. Curt will undoubtedly get back to me also. I appreciate your help.
Bernie
Hi Bernie, I'd say that what you are trying to do here is really a simple, straightforward MIDI task as you would think also, but the limited MIDI implementation on the SD40 makes it tricky. I really like your idea of playing the DM48 for solo voices while both hands are on the keyboard. It will bring more life into arranger and keyboard playing. For that reason, I have a Hammond 44, but the problem is that I don't have three hands. I thought about a MIDI harmonica for some time, and finally after your post I got myself a Jamboxx Pro. I don't know about your DM48, but the Jamboxx Pro originally designed for physically challenged people can be played on a bracket, which frees both hands.
Going back to MIDI, the DM48 manual doesn't mention anything about how to program/send PC messages. The other day, I took my SD40 out from storage and set it up. Though the pic doesn't show it, my FR4x is connected to the SD40 via USB, and a Korg Microkey air 49 (as a substitute for the MIDI harmonica I will be getting this week) and a USB MIDI device keypad (to send PC messages) into MIDI In 1 on the SD40. As expected, I could call up any patch I want. Also, the SD40 seems to fully support patch remain. I suppose I can do the same by using a MIDI foot controller to send PC messages. Watch this gentleman playing the Jamboxx Pro and Sensual Sax. I have Sensual Sax in my iPad, but I didn't know that a PC version is also available for $20. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-8JG4XIvJs
).
[/img] 