Not that I am aware of as they are too large for most houses, (At least outside the US where 99% of arrangers are sold) and they weigh too heavy for those that gig, hybrids like the clavinova are the only way to go.
While it’s not state of the art, I do enjoy playing my Korg Havian at home. Mostly I just play piano on it, but it’s nice to some rhythms and styles to play along with. The chord sequencer is awesome!
Yep, Korg Havian would be my recommendation too. The DGX-660 and Casio PX-560 are good but have a watered-down feature set. The Roland BK-7m is another module you could use, more affordable than the Ketron SD40, but it doesn't have on-board style creation (if that's important to you.)
[quote= Strongest point of the Havian 30 however is that it has the same piano sound as the pa4x.. [/quote]
Really? I did not know that. I ‘m very much enjoying my Havian 30. I let a very good classical pianist use it for party in medium sized ball . He played during the dinner hour. Sounded great and he only used the built in speakers.
With Dan's vArranger2 software, free or commercial SF2 sound fonts / sound modules like Ketron SD1000 module, and MIDI controllers like Akai APC40 mk2 and APC Key 25 with MIDI light feedback buttons, I turned my old Yamaha S80 88-key synth and my Casio PX560 88-key digital stage piano into decent arrangers that can play styles from Yamaha, Korg, Ketron, Roland, and Technics in 2 different rooms.
The vArranger2 software covers arranger basics well, and makes arranger travel light by using a Windows touchscreen laptop, mini keyboards like Korg microKey Air 61, and small MIDI controllers like Korg nanoKontrol2 for MIDI light feedback buttons.
Too bad Korg and Yamaha don't want to go for the tabletop/rack version. I would buy them in a heart beat! I tried Havian 30 and did NOT like the keybed at all. I mean I could get used to it, but the arranger part wasn't all that impressive.
As stated earlier vArranger2 is a good option. I use it connected to my Yamaha MOXF. It works really well. It sounds great through the MOXF. I also have a SD2 module that works well. There are audio demos of it being played through the SD2 and the MOXF on the internet. You might want to take a listen.
Too bad Korg and Yamaha don't want to go for the tabletop/rack version. I would buy them in a heart beat! I tried Havian 30 and did NOT like the keybed at all. I mean I could get used to it, but the arranger part wasn't all that impressive.
As far as tabletop vrsions, ketron is the only way to go.. I am expecting a lot from the sd90 Altough its still not up on Ketrons website
And you can combine it with you favorite 88 key, Be it Nord stage3, korg Kronos, yamaha montage, roland rd2000, kurzweil forte or kawai mp11.. You will have your favorite keybed combined with a perfect arranger..
Currently the fact that there is still no multipads on the Varranger and that i seems in a rather stale development phase is keeping me away from Varranger.
As far as tabletop vrsions, ketron is the only way to go.. I am expecting a lot from the sd90 Altough its still not up on Ketrons website
And you can combine it with you favorite 88 key, Be it Nord stage3, korg Kronos, yamaha montage, roland rd2000, kurzweil forte or kawai mp11.. You will have your favorite keybed combined with a perfect arranger..
Currently the fact that there is still no multipads on the Varranger and that i seems in a rather stale development phase is keeping me away from Varranger.
Ketron doesn't seem to have a strong presence in the US. I can't even remember when was the last time that I saw one. Looking forward to reading your reviews on the SD9. Yeah, it'd be very nice to have a strong module and be able to pick a nice keybed.
As far as tabletop vrsions, ketron is the only way to go.. I am expecting a lot from the sd90 Altough its still not up on Ketrons website
And you can combine it with you favorite 88 key, Be it Nord stage3, korg Kronos, yamaha montage, roland rd2000, kurzweil forte or kawai mp11.. You will have your favorite keybed combined with a perfect arranger..
Currently the fact that there is still no multipads on the Varranger and that i seems in a rather stale development phase is keeping me away from Varranger.
Ketron doesn't seem to have a strong presence in the US. I can't even remember when was the last time that I saw one. Looking forward to reading your reviews on the SD9. Yeah, it'd be very nice to have a strong module and be able to pick a nice keybed.
Strong presence or not, they have top knotch support in the US by AJ..
Awesome! Especially with that app. Good 'bang-for-the-buck' also. I may have to spring for one of those. That will complete my 'essential three', Piano (P515), Rhodes (Seven), and 'B3' (KeyB Duo Mk111). After that I'll dump everything except the Bk7m and VP770. Maybe.......
Don’t disregard the Roland FP90 it comes with a companion app for the ipad and you can make many of the same adjustments with the app or at the piano itself. It’s a great piano, ask Bill Lewis too.
@ $300 price difference. Hate the fact that I'd have to buy an Ipad to take advantage of the app.
chas
Well, when it comes to tablets, seems apple has won the war, android tablets are slowly leaving the scene. Windows tablets however like the high end micrsosft surface are another thing
The main reason why all these companies choose Apple is the fact that its much more reliable because of a single hardware platform and much much more secure .. on top of that the average ipad owner spends a factor 100 times as much monmey on apps as the android owner, simply because apple has banned out the hackers and the pirates where android still embraces them, even offering them their own markets..
Prices of software on apple are really really acceptable to me, i will never look back.
And another thing, did you know that programming a high end Android app costs as much as 5 times as programming an Apple app, because of how the tooling works... and there is no easy way to convert from apple to android, so programmers need to start all over.
So my best bet is, apple will be king of the tabblet market for a very very long time... the tablet market is very different from the mobile phone market.
So there is many many reasons why these apps mostly come to apple... espescially in the musik market apple ipad is king... now all yamaha needs to do is allow this app to communicate with other music software on ipad.
Steve, Bill, Bachus, any personal opinions about the quality of the SOUND of the FP90 vs the P515? I know it's subjective but I'd be interested in your opinions anyway. Also your comments or thoughts on the feature sets of the two. Any other digi-pianos in this specific category/price range (Nord? Casio?)? Thanks.
Steve, Bill, Bachus, any personal opinions about the quality of the SOUND of the FP90 vs the P515? I know it's subjective but I'd be interested in your opinions anyway. Also your comments or thoughts on the feature sets of the two. Any other digi-pianos in this specific category/price range (Nord? Casio?)? Thanks.
chas
I personally prefer the Roland PHA50 action above the NWX of yamaha, but in the end both are really good...
I love the Bösendorfer sound of the Yamaha, but also the Roland piano sounds... thats a personal thing, in general people iether prefer Yamaha or Rolands sound..
Strong point of the yamaha is the complete soundset it uses to play styles, where the Roland uses the ipad to play styles.. in general i think yamaha’s app that i tried extensively on the csp 170 performes better then the Roland app (which also comes with my. G0-piano)
In the end you need to try both yourself, the difference is mostly about personal flavour.
Other piano’s in this price range would be kawai’s es8 and mp7 which both have an incredible action...and good sound... mp7 is a stage model witouth speakers(there is a lot of stage models in this price range)
I think both outperform casio’s px 560.. and anything with a fatar action..
Thanks Bachus. I appreciate the briefing. I'm leaning strongly towards the Yamaha. I too, really like that Bosendorfer sound, although I'm not sure if it's the best one for jazz/blues type playing.
Save yourself some money and buy the Casio PX 560. No iPad or apps needed because everything is onboard as it should. Great allrounder with everything you need.
Save yourself some money and buy the Casio PX 560. No iPad or apps needed because everything is onboard as it should. Great allrounder with everything you need.
Thanks Bachus. I appreciate the briefing. I'm leaning strongly towards the Yamaha. I too, really like that Bosendorfer sound, although I'm not sure if it's the best one for jazz/blues type playing.
chas
Adding a bösendorfer sound to the typical Yamaha soumds, adds so much ... They are 2 totally different characters...
Keep in mind tough, that Rolamd has several different brands of piano sampled... and/or modelled.. which makes Rolands piano collection even broader..
I love having steinway, boesendorfer, august/foster, yamaha and fazioli grand piano sounds in the Kronos.. all are great with each their very own character..
Save yourself some money and buy the Casio PX 560. No iPad or apps needed because everything is onboard as it should. Great allrounder with everything you need.
Except for style quallity, i still hink the casio styles lag the yamaha and korg ones by atleast a decade... mostly because of the orchestral sounds (except for strings) and guitars and basses and drums...
Piano, organ, dp, strings, synths are top tough..
And while the keyboard action is acceptable... its no match for the pha50 amd NWX...
But then thats just my opinion.. In the end both the Roland and the Yamaha are in another league, but then they also are a priceclass higher..
I'm guessing that if the average musician was blindfolded in a room and only one was played, he/she would be hard-pressed to say which one it was. BUT...in the video below, in the comments section, the majority seemed to favor the Casio PX560. Unfortunately, the Yamaha 515 was not included. To me, the Casio seemed a little 'heavy' (ponderous, thick, too full, don't know quite how to describe it) but definitely not 'bad', just probably not my first choice among those three. But as we always say, it's purely subjective, and all sounded really good (the Casio being 'killer' at it's price point). Of course, key feel can not be demonstrated in a Youtube video, so it IS important to go to the store and play one.
I'm still up in the air and spending lots of time (too much ) checking out Youtube demos and reading comments of all the models mentioned in this class of digital piano. Thanks for your input. Still loving the SEVEN but still trying to adjust to it's keyboard action. Not quite there yet.
Save yourself some money and buy the Casio PX 560. No iPad or apps needed because everything is onboard as it should. Great allrounder with everything you need.
So many great choices when it comes to 88 keys, but I, too, think the PX560 is among the better choices in many respects. I used to own a Casio PX330. An excellent action (as subjective as it can be, it is a very solid keyboard action) and great piano sounds at only 24 pounds. The Yamaha P515 looks promising, but at 48 pounds, I won't consider it as a gig instrument. The PX560 is 26 pounds. Just recently I purchased a Numa Stage (28 lbs) by StudioLogic. I should have purchased the PX560.
Anyway, any 88 key controller paired with either vArranger or the SD40 would make a great 88 key arranger.
Save yourself some money and buy the Casio PX 560. No iPad or apps needed because everything is onboard as it should. Great allrounder with everything you need.
So many great choices when it comes to 88 keys, but I, too, think the PX560 is among the better choices in many respects. I used to own a Casio PX330. An excellent action (as subjective as it can be, it is a very solid keyboard action) and great piano sounds at only 24 pounds. The Yamaha P515 looks promising, but at 48 pounds, I won't consider it as a gig instrument. The PX560 is 26 pounds. Just recently I purchased a Numa Stage (28 lbs) by StudioLogic. I should have purchased the PX560.
Anyway, any 88 key controller paired with either vArranger or the SD40 would make a great 88 key arranger.
The P515 has wooden keys.. which makes it heavy... I don’t think either the p515 as well as the fp90 are meant for gigging.. I allways asumed them being aimed at home players and kids starting piano..
If you need to move it a lot, and buy it for the typical keyboard sounds, the px 560 might actually be the best choice.. despite having a less authentic action, and not having the best arranger styles.. it still is a good instrument, just not the best, but does have its adavntages..
However if only weight counts... you could also look at a nord stage, its in the same weight category... and asuming you will use it with an sd40, would also make a very very nice setup..
There is so many options... thats what makes choosing hard..
I think of DGX as a more of a very entry level keyboard with its fake weighted keys.
So, got on Craigslist clavinova cvp-204 for now, it’s outdated but for now should be ok, but I’m on a look out for newer used Clavinovas, and other 88key arrangers.
With Dan's vArranger2 software, free or commercial SF2 sound fonts / sound modules like Ketron SD1000 module, and MIDI controllers like Akai APC40 mk2 and APC Key 25 with MIDI light feedback buttons, I turned my old Yamaha S80 88-key synth and my Casio PX560 88-key digital stage piano into decent arrangers that can play styles from Yamaha, Korg, Ketron, Roland, and Technics in 2 different rooms.
The vArranger2 software covers arranger basics well, and makes arranger travel light by using a Windows touchscreen laptop, mini keyboards like Korg microKey Air 61, and small MIDI controllers like Korg nanoKontrol2 for MIDI light feedback buttons.
Thanks, Paul
I tried varranger few months ago on friends home set up, it seems at very early stages and has long to go to catch up to hardware arrangers.
Worst part is that on many styles after filling end and goes into “normal” part, there’s a few milliseconds pause , like 1/32th note, that makes this varranger software unusable.
Are you sure you have tried a legal vArranger version?
Originally Posted By Vadim
I tried varranger few months ago on friends home set up, it seems at very early stages and has long to go to catch up to hardware arrangers.
Worst part is that on many styles after filling end and goes into “normal” part, there’s a few milliseconds pause , like 1/32th note, that makes this varranger software unusable.
I tried varranger few months ago on friends home set up, it seems at very early stages and has long to go to catch up to hardware arrangers.
Worst part is that on many styles after filling end and goes into “normal” part, there’s a few milliseconds pause , like 1/32th note, that makes this varranger software unusable.
The Varrange with the lates sound sets sound as good as the TOTL arenagers curently available..
Your friend might have set the program up wrong...
I don't say vArranger soundset sounds as good as all the TOTL But you can get a good compatibility with most of the style and complete your soundset with some best quality VST instruments, like a grand piano that sounds better than any hardware arranger
hardware arrangers used to add some FX like disto on guitars that adds some realism to the sound. This part still need a bit improvements in vArranger
hardware arrangers used to add some FX like disto on guitars that adds some realism to the sound. This part still need a bit improvements in vArranger
You can allways use VST's for the guitars and DSP effects..
Altough, if you have a hardware keybaord with USB audio support like the Yamaha Montage or Korg Kronos, its as easy to make VST's part of your setup as in Varranger.
Sadly there is no Arranger key yet that has Audio over USB support.
I'm guessing that if the average musician was blindfolded in a room and only one was played, he/she would be hard-pressed to say which one it was. BUT...in the video below, in the comments section, the majority seemed to favor the Casio PX560. Unfortunately, the Yamaha 515 was not included. To me, the Casio seemed a little 'heavy' (ponderous, thick, too full, don't know quite how to describe it) but definitely not 'bad', just probably not my first choice among those three. But as we always say, it's purely subjective, and all sounded really good (the Casio being 'killer' at it's price point). Of course, key feel can not be demonstrated in a Youtube video, so it IS important to go to the store and play one.
I'm still up in the air and spending lots of time (too much ) checking out Youtube demos and reading comments of all the models mentioned in this class of digital piano. Thanks for your input. Still loving the SEVEN but still trying to adjust to it's keyboard action. Not quite there yet.
Casio is no longer your grand children' toy keyboard. When a person buys a Casio, he or she doesn't pay for the "name" but instead you get more quality and features for the money.
Can someone send me a link to a video of food quality varranger2 music ? I searched on YouTube and all the the varranger videos sound very very cheap..
The Varrange with the lates sound sets sound as good as the TOTL arenagers curently available..
In speaking of a TOTL, that's quite a compliment for vArranger coming from someone who knows gear and I agree with you. I know that you've been saying quite often about a TOTL 88 key arranger. It dawned on me that if there is an 88 key arranger, it will be probably too bulky with all the buttons and knobs. You know how most arranger keyboards are pretty deep.
I find vArranger a lot easier to work with than any hardware arranger. With one or two midi controllers, it can be so flexible. For instance, I use a small $12 Bluetooth QWERTY keyboard to call up a number of functions or sounds - just as many functions or sounds as there are keys on the QWERTY keyboard. I attach the Bluetooth keyboard on the grille of my accordion and call up sounds/functions wireless. Or if I play a digital piano, I use a little bigger QWERTY keyboard.
Recently, a vA user named Bluebeat posted on the vA forum about Synthfont. He asked the owner of Synthfont if he would add features to Synthfont so that it could handle large banks and multiple files (soundfonts). The program has started working on it and there is a beta version. The program is only 15 Euros. So I purchased it and I believe it will really enhance vA for recording and live performance. There are some excellent soundfonts out there.
Someone posted this on vA forum. Quite good. Also, for solo voices, you can always use good VST instruments in vArranger that hardware can't compete with.
--------------------------------------- DEMO with vArranger2
The Varrange with the lates sound sets sound as good as the TOTL arenagers curently available..
In speaking of a TOTL, that's quite a compliment for vArranger coming from someone who knows gear and I agree with you. I know that you've been saying quite often about a TOTL 88 key arranger. It dawned on me that if there is an 88 key arranger, it will be probably too bulky with all the buttons and knobs. You know how most arranger keyboards are pretty deep.
I find vArranger a lot easier to work with than any hardware arranger. With one or two midi controllers, it can be so flexible. For instance, I use a small $12 Bluetooth QWERTY keyboard to call up a number of functions or sounds - just as many functions or sounds as there are keys on the QWERTY keyboard. I attach the Bluetooth keyboard on the grille of my accordion and call up sounds/functions wireless. Or if I play a digital piano, I use a little bigger QWERTY keyboard.
Recently, a vA user named Bluebeat posted on the vA forum about Synthfont. He asked the owner of Synthfont if he would add features to Synthfont so that it could handle large banks and multiple files (soundfonts). The program has started working on it and there is a beta version. The program is only 15 Euros. So I purchased it and I believe it will really enhance vA for recording and live performance. There are some excellent soundfonts out there.
The strong point of Varranger remains, that you can use VST's, for the widest sound quallity and choice of sounds... this allows you to add some depth where you need it.
Having a good sound set is just the beginning...
What in my eyes makes Varranger still a 2nd choice is thats it missing all those buttons and direct controll, and i think that there for it could never become as comfortable to me as a hardware arranger like the pa4x or Genos where every button is on the right place.. and gives you the direct controll you need.
I am still considering going back to a single 88 key however, being my Kronos(or a nord stage) combined with a Ketron SD90 and my mainstage/VST Macbook.
Having the Nord stage for example, with SD90 in the middle on top of it in an almost vertical position (20 degrees) sounds like the closest thing to an 88 key totl solution..
I have owned vARRANGER from day one, and I want to say that Dan, not only has made the program what it is today, but has personally helped me on numerous occasions. I am a big supporter of Dan and vARRANGER.
Someone posted this on vA forum. Quite good. Also, for solo voices, you can always use good VST instruments in vArranger that hardware can't compete with.
--------------------------------------- DEMO with vArranger2
Someone posted this on vA forum. Quite good. Also, for solo voices, you can always use good VST instruments in vArranger that hardware can't compete with.
--------------------------------------- DEMO with vArranger2
) checking out Youtube demos and reading comments of all the models mentioned in this class of digital piano. Thanks for your input. Still loving the SEVEN but still trying to adjust to it's keyboard action. Not quite there yet.